ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 66

[kellala]

Waste of money, IMO, except for the socialization. If it isn't part of the doctoral program, it's a lot of money to pay just for unneeded units.

IMO.

Maybe he thought he needed extra lab time? (That seems to me to be what you are implying). Mostly, students don't want to pay for units they don't have to have. There's no evidence he got a sublease.

It's not hard to do, it's just expensive and unneeded. I don't see him or his family as frivolous. I do see him moving into student housing as soon as there was an opening, but I will be very surprised if he paid tuition or took units last summer.

He could work in the lab or doing something so he he can stand out from his fellows when he apply a job at local LE department. Auditing some classes are common. I just try to rationalize his appearces in WSU in July

 

[meatandcookies]

Anyone else logging into their 23andme account, feverishly (and nervously) searching for BK, listed as your distant relative?

I’m in all of them, including FTDNA and GED (I was adopted) and now I know how I’m spending my day tomorrow.

 

[EncyclopediaBrownJr]

One of kohberger's PA professors called him "brilliant".

You'd think that such a 'brilliant' guy would've realized that.

Guess the evil coward just wasn't 'brilliant' enough, eh...

I think it's like a football coach or baseball coach. You can have bad players be football smart or baseball smart but as a player they would be classified as bad to mediocre.

You can have a straight a, book smart engineering student be a mediocre engineer. They're serviceable but not NASA or Lockheed Martin material.

 

[Arkay]

I wonder what a google search of "Maddie,Moscow Idaho " before the murders pulled up. Would that have pulled up Maddie's instagram or facebook? Maddie isn't a common name and neither is Xana or Kaylee. That's the problem I have with all these unique names. So easy to find somebody without their last names.

For their generation, I think names like Madison and Kaylee are pretty common. My eldest granddaughter is in that age group and many of her peers have those names or similar. Even Caylee Anthony would have been nearly their age now.

Xana's name was unique, for sure.

In my generation, the typical girls' names were Susan, Carol, Jane, Lisa, Laura, Barbara, Judy, Debbie, Sharon.

None of my daughter's or granddaughter's friends have those kind of names now. I actually think it would be more difficult for someone to search for a Madison or Kaylee nowadays. (Although of course we didn't have computers back then).

I think that if Bryan were intent on sleuthing them, he'd have found a way, but I just don't believe their names are all unique today.

Jmo

 

[10ofRods]

After going through the IL posts and seeing that there were 34 posts on 12/15 alone, including around the time they were pulled over in Indiana, I feel confident that IL is not BK.

<modsnip>

34 posts is a lot, though. I agree. But easily accomplished over a couple of hours at a rest stop. What are the time intervals? Do we still have that info?

The posts, IIRC, are mostly remarkably terse and kind of shot gun (one after another).

People can send out the equivalent of 34 texts in one day, for sure. More, even. What if Dad was driving for a couple of hours right after the jarring episode of being stopped twice by LE?

Since you already did the work of going through those posts, do you have any timeline (let's say on PST, as Moscow is?) Or just let us know the timezone.

For this particular character (IL) 34 posts is not all that surprising (I'm sure I have more here, on this day and I think a few others do as well; it's not every day, but just some days).

 

[EncyclopediaBrownJr]

For their generation, I think names like Madison and Kaylee are pretty common. My eldest granddaughter is in that age group and many of her peers have those names or similar. Even Caylee Anthony would have been nearly their age now.

Xana's name was unique, for sure.

In my generation, the typical girls' names were Susan, Carol, Jane, Lisa, Laura, Barbara, Judy, Debbie, Sharon.

None of my daughter's or granddaughter's friends have those kind of names now. I actually think it would be more difficult for someone to search for a Madison or Kaylee nowadays. (Although of course we didn't have computers back then).

I think that if Bryan were intent on sleuthing them, he'd have found a way, but I just don't believe their names are all unique today.

Jmo

I agree but if her name tag or receipt said Maddie instead of Madison that would have given him an opportunity to look her up. Madison may be common but Maddie....probably not.

 

[acutename]

After going through the IL posts and seeing that there were 34 posts on 12/15 alone, including around the time they were pulled over in Indiana, I feel confident that IL is not BK.

just remember BK doesn't sleep much so he has more time even when he is driving 12 hrs/day IMO

 

[Palinsmom]

I'd also like to interject something here re: DM and her "frozen fear phase." I was watching a show the other evening about death row inmates. One of the inmate's sisters talks about their past childhood trauma. She mentions as a child, someone who she could not remember regularly entered her bedroom to molest her. She said she went into a "frozen fear" type of shock - couldn't move and couldn't really remember what happened. That's the first time I've heard someone describe that condition since hearing about it regarding DM's reaction to seeing BCK in her house.

A few threads back I shared a similar story.

This was in 1985. I worked 3rd shift 11:00pm to 7:00am. One night when I woke up to get ready for work I noticed my porch light wasn’t on which I had assumed had a broken filament and no longer worked. I walked over to the door to open and check but for some reason I can’t explain, I looked out the peep hole… there was a man standing there! I immediately spun around placing my back to the door and slid down to the floor. The expression of hair standing up on the back of your neck is exactly what it’s like with an intense feeling of heat. I guess huge surge of adrenaline. Anyhow I froze sitting there against the door in the floor. I was to move because I was afraid I would be seen. As I said this was 1985 - no cell phones. I sat there for more than an hour afraid to move until I finally crawled to the room where my phone was. I crawled because I didn’t want to stand up. After I got to the phone my hands were shaking so hard I didn’t know if would be able to dial the number. I was 23. But like a frieghtened child did I call the police ?? NO. I called my mom. I have no idea why but that’s what I did. The scariest part was at the time there actually was a serial killer in my town. His name was Faryion Wardrip. He killed 5 women between the ages of 20 to 25. He stabbed the first victim 11 times. He’s still on Death Row. 1985 and I remember it like it was yesterday. It is absolutely no surprise to me how D.M. reacted and I totally understand why.
Just sharing to help people understand DM.
I honestly think that absolutely no one knows what they would do until the moment they are in that situation.

My opinion

 

[Zella]

I agree but if her name tag or receipt said Maddie instead of Madison that would have given him an opportunity to look her up. Madison may be common but Maddie....probably not.

I'd argue Maddie is just as common. I know so many girls nicknamed Maddie, short for Madison to Madeline. MOO

 

[10ofRods]

He could work in the lab or doing something so he he can stand out from his fellows when he apply a job at local LE department. Auditing some classes are common. I just try to rationalize his appearces in WSU in July

Are you saying there's paid work for pre-first year students in that lab? Could be. I am very doubtful. He apparently didn't stand out at the local LE department (fact) and was denied an internship (presumably unpaid).

Auditing is...occasional (I've only had one in 40 years of teaching, it's a lengthy process for both student and professor to get permission, liability, etc).

He went to WSU because he was free to do so. He was a newly minted graduated student, now admitted to a doctoral program. His parents were proud. He had a new phone and a car. He went to Washington because it is beautiful and different than the Poconos (also beautiful). He was hoping his new life would start ASAP. Grad student housing became available.

The two universities are practically in the same community (there are several colleges within 10 miles of where I sit - I've visited them all frequently).

He went to his new experience and explored. At what point did ideas of stalking and murder enter his head (if they did)? I don't know. I'll go out on a limb and say that when there's digital evidence of stalking, that's when he started.

Maybe he went and hiked all summer. We don't know. Maybe he got a dog and learned it wasn't allowed and rehomed it. I'm not assuming he had an academic reason for how he spent his summer time. If we're going to guess, then I have other guesses, based on knowing grad students. Settling in, knowing the university (including its surroundings) is important, as it's the only time one will have to do that (or so most grad students think). Find that one place to eat that comforts you; figure out how much you can put in your apartment fridge; stock up on necessities. Cruise by your new department and hope someone will make eye contact.

 

[layer]

just remember BK doesn't sleep much so he has more time even when he is driving 12 hrs/day IMO

So you're suggesting he was posting on his phone, while driving, next to his father, while being pulled over by the ISP...

 

[Sundog]

BK lived in graduate student housing at WSU, which is kind of wild to me as that kind of apartment is usually only offered to couples / families, at least at institutions I've studied at. His neighbor who complained about his late night activity had a family, for example.

That being said... I wonder if BK had looked for alternative living situations? I'm sure he looked around. I wonder if WSU has an institutional database for finding apartments or roommates that he might have looked at. I know that was something I looked at when I was moving for graduate school.

According to WSU policy regarding Family and Graduate Student Apartments, one bedroom apartments in Family Housing on campus may be rented by a family with one child, or a single graduate student, or an undergraduate student over the age of 30.

Family Housing Assignment Cancellation Policies | at WSU

Edited to add: Or a married couple with no children

 

[EBW321]

Thanks for the read. Very strange question to ask someone IMHO, who does that?

"Kohberger asked his neighbor, who is not from the U.S., whether he could identify Kohberger’s ancestral background, the man said. The neighbor said he guessed Italy before Kohberger stated that he was of German descent. “He talked about his ancestors,” the 30-year-old neighbor said. “He had some sort of DNA test. I don’t know how he got to that point. … It was just interesting to him.”

https://www.tri-cityherald.com/news/state/article271252642.html

I find this very interesting as well. Made me think back to college which was a very long time again.

MOO-

During my undergrad in my micro or genetics lab (one of the two, most likely genetics)..we did do finger prick and oral swab general test on ourselves.. to learn how to take the sample and apply properly to the slides and to practice on the microscope in identifying certain cellular structure… cellular/genetic markers /looked to see if any of us had a bacterial or viral infection etc.. mainly really basic stuff. To practice/learn more.. learn really how to actually properly use the microscope and properly read samples. Not just the pre-made sample/stain slides with perfect samples on the them.

In a physics lab (I think it was physics but honestly cannot remember… let’s just say another lab).. we gave one another lie detector tests. Learned how to operate the machines, how they worked and how to administer the tests.

My point is… these tests were done in house in a college student setting. - our results did not get uploaded to any major database..And this was year two college level courses. Not masters or PHD program.

I can easily see how in a phd or masters level graduate program in criminology there would be classes on genetic / genealogical/ dna identification of victims and perpetrators. I’d be shocked if there wasn’t such a class in the curriculum. This is something most with criminal justice degrees would need to be well educated in due to the fact it is used by LE / lawyers in crimes across the country. More and more everyday.

Who’s to say Desales or WSU didn’t have such a class where as part of the genetic/criminology class students participated in an ancestral dna sample project. In order to further their understanding of the tests and how they can use these tests to catch criminals or in identifying suspects or even victims. In real life they would not themselves be administering the tests but they would need to know in depth how they work and how they are done in order to maximize success rates in the use of genetics/DNA in the field. Which is why I would think it’s possible BK took the ancestry DNA test himself in such a class for his PHD. (MOO)… If I had to guess where they would receive the most in-depth education on this in a university setting… it would be by Partnering with biogenetics students/professor at the university and have a lab attached to this genetic profiling course im hypothesizing about… this professor would go over the scientific education end of everything and as part of the class he may suggest to give them their own ancestral dna tests… allowing each student to review their results and learn first hand how those results were obtained. Fully explain the break down of dna samples/identification markers they look for.. which samples are best for their line of work… etc.

All could have been done in house in the university.

No national database to connect to.

To me…. This would explain why BK was excited about learning about his ancestry and excited to tell the first person he saw (the neighbor) all about it because it was one more thing he was now fully educated in and could flaunt his intelligence in. BK seems to really like to learn as much as he can about criminology and this was probably a good day for him.

We know very little about BK… but from my own opinion/observation.. Ive read and watched many interviews with others who interacted with him and knew him and many of them say… he had very little emotion in interactions with others except when he was displaying/showing off his intelligence..or upset. he seemed to have more emotions in his tone and expressions/confidence when he was discussing things he was very knowledgeable in, Knowing the other person was not as well educated in that certain topic. Which to me helps explain the random convo with the neighbor about his ancestry/dna news.

I mean I know it’s a stretch…. But I’m still trying to figure out why I was a sophomore in college reviewing my own blood / saliva under an ancient microscope and why I was learning how to give lie detector tests in physics labs and how to give those tests and operate the testing machine… I am assuming it was my university and professors wanting us to have a thorough broad knowledge of the courses I was taking.

Which is why…. Maybe my thought on…criminology PHD’s having to take a genetic profiling class with a possible lab to where they learned how the tests are done and got to do theirs as a perk/add on lesson…. In house school project dna test …… maybe its not that big of a stretch?!!..

I mean I could be way off and just wasted anyone who actually read this long posts time….

But anyone who did… specifically those who are graduate / PHD criminology students… Have you ever had to take a genetic profiling course to help you further understand the tests being used to your professional advantage once you graduate?

any other college students or graduates ever do in house genetic / blood tests on yourselves?

Again.

All MOO - sorry it’s so wordy.

Ive just read many posts tonight’s on the new the neighbor genetic test discussion and all of a sudden people are wondering if the LE statement on the arrest coming from a familial DNA sample is accurate…. Etc. confusion in general now if BK himself took a national database DNA test on his ancestry.

Personally I am trusting of LE in such a high profile case. I feel like it would be unwise to state that they made the match on a relative in the database and not him if he was actually in there.. So im choosing to believe either he took the test in a non-national database scenario , possibly in a class assignment…. Or the company he took his test with is smaller and didn’t link to the larger corporation his aunts was found on initially. Or…. He’s just a lunatic making strange small talk with his neighbor to feel him out or add to his mystery.

Again, Cannot stress this enough. All - MOO

 

[10ofRods]

A few threads back I shared a similar story.

This was in 1985. I worked 3rd shift 11:00pm to 7:00am. One night when I woke up to get ready for work I noticed my porch light wasn’t on which I had assumed had a broken filament and no longer worked. I walked over to the door to open and check but for some reason I can’t explain, I looked out the peep hole… there was a man standing there! I immediately spun around placing my back to the door and slid down to the floor. The expression of hair standing up on the back of your neck is exactly what it’s like with an intense feeling of heat. I guess huge surge of adrenaline. Anyhow I froze sitting there against the door in the floor. I was to move because I was afraid I would be seen. As I said this was 1985 - no cell phones. I sat there for more than an hour afraid to move until I finally crawled to the room where my phone was. I crawled because I didn’t want to stand up. After I got to the phone my hands were shaking so hard I didn’t know if would be able to dial the number. I was 23. But like a frieghtened child did I call the police ?? NO. I called my mom. I have no idea why but that’s what I did. The scariest part was at the time there actually was a serial killer in my town. His name was Faryion Wardrip. He killed 5 women between the ages of 20 to 25. He stabbed the first victim 11 times. He’s still on Death Row. 1985 and I remember it like it was yesterday. It is absolutely no surprise to me how D.M. reacted and I totally understand why.
Just sharing to help people understand DM.
I honestly think that absolutely no one knows what they would do until the moment they are in that situation.

My opinion

I so appreciate this story (and will share it with students in a couple of weeks - it's relevant). Please keep posting this when people forget.

 

[EncyclopediaBrownJr]

I'd argue Maddie is just as common. I know so many girls nicknamed Maddie, short for Madison to Madeline. MOO

Maybe i'm just getting old.

I wonder how many Maddies there are in Moscow Idaho. He probably just typed it in google on a whim "Maddie, Moscow Idaho" up pops her facebook. Looks like the waitress he saw at Mad Greek. Looks for an instagram account by typing in "Maddie Mogen" up pops Madison May Mogen.

 

[acutename]

So you're suggesting he was posting on his phone, while driving, next to his father, while being pulled over by the ISP...

no- but his father who is 67 probably does go to sleep- maybe even early- leaving BK in a mid-west hotel room doing what? watching cable for 5 hrs? he can't vacuum or use the garbage disposal.

 

[layer]

Yes, but you can't set aside the fact that the posts are time-stamped.

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

Thanks for the read. Very strange question to ask someone IMHO, who does that?

"Kohberger asked his neighbor, who is not from the U.S., whether he could identify Kohberger’s ancestral background, the man said. The neighbor said he guessed Italy before Kohberger stated that he was of German descent. “He talked about his ancestors,” the 30-year-old neighbor said. “He had some sort of DNA test. I don’t know how he got to that point. … It was just interesting to him.”

https://www.tri-cityherald.com/news/state/article271252642.html

POV from someone interested in 'that stuff', it's easy to get into the subject of something you are interested in if it comes up.
The fact that the neighbour is mentioned as not being from the U.S., highlights that they may have got into a conversation about a particular destination (maybe the neighbour is from Europe), so BK says, where you do think my family is from? and then, when the person gets it wrong, he gets to talk about genealogy, that he is interested in.
JMO

 

[acutename]

Yes, but you can't set aside the fact that the posts are time-stamped.

what are the times? ...and can you draft and then post later?

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Didn't SG hire a PI? If the PI found out and SG told the media, I would. MOO.

This is what I think happened, or the PI talked.