ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 69

[IDK]

If he attended it - he will have alibi.
But, did he?
Are there any records of him being in the gym on those dates?

See that’s the issue right there, IMO— we are not privy to any possible exculpatory evidence. Which is as it should be, also IMO.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

It’s my opinion that he did not want to get caught, and had he not left the sheath behind, it’s also my opinion that he would not be behind bars today. He might have been under the umbrella of suspicion, but not behind bars. My opinion only

The car would probably have been his undoing in any event. The WSU cop had already flagged the PA registered Elantra and eventually BK would float to the top of the suspect list because he matches the roommate's description. Remember that the killer had to get to the house somehow. He could walk but that would put him at great risk of being seen. And where would he leave his car to get back to Pullman? Walk a mile or two at 4 am in a college town, and a camera will catch you out and about. But we can be very glad that the sheath was left and had his DNA on it to put him with the knife, the roommate to put a bushy-eyebrow guy in the building, and his car was on video arriving, driving around and leaving at the time of the killings.

 

[ktm44]

And wouldn't a gym -- especially a 24-hour one -- have cameras?

Gyms track their clients pretty closely because of liability issues. Mine is a small town gym and you need confirmation of membership or payment for one time use, sign in upon arrival and sign out when you leave.

If this were the case, I would suggest it would be strongly documented and backed by cameras.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

BBM in your post for focus. I'm not comfortable framing the defense's job as to "come up with any and all excuses." I don't think wanting a thorough investigation of any and all evidence means looking for excuses. I'd hope the defense would not just accept this sort of evidence without questioning it. For all we know this was BK's occasional jogging route. A defendant has the right to counsel who will examine all evidence. MOO.

Right. Excuses don't cut it. The defense needs evidence. If he went to a gym in Moscow, miles away from his home, in the middle of the night [eyes rolling] there will be video. The person in charge there would have seen him. He would have signed in somehow. Why was he driving around a house where a murder was taking place at 4 am? Why did he speed away? What EVIDENCE will there be to support his alternative story? The defense can't just make up a lot of BS. They have to show he wasn't there, the knife belonged to someone else, his car had been stolen and he reported it....So no. If he had a concrete alibi, the defense would be jumping to a hearing to get him out of jail with the charges dropped. That isn't happening for a reason.

 

[maskedwoman]

IIRC isn't there a 24 hour gym in the area?

Yes, but both of them are about 20 minutes away from BK's apartment. One of the same gyms has a Pullman location less than half that distance from his apartment.

 

[Karin1974]

A defense attorney commented:

"Based on the evidence outlined in the probable cause affidavit, Mr Levin said that Mr Kohberger did a poor job of “covering his tracks” and that the prosecution has a “very strong case” against him."

“In short, he should get an F in criminology class,” he said. “He did not do a good job of covering his tracks.”

Exactly MOO. I’m also curious about whether there are any cameras near BK’s apartment & whether the police now have camera/video evidence of him leaving his home on the night of the murders & perhaps returning wearing different clothing a few hours later?

 

[Karin1974]

If he attended it - he will have alibi.
But, did he?
Are there any records of him being in the gym on those dates?

Are 24 hour gyms more likely (than non 24 hour businesses) to have some kind of security cameras installed, just wondering?

 

[maskedwoman]

See that’s the issue right there, IMO— we are not privy to any possible exculpatory evidence. Which is as it should be, also IMO.

If BK had evidence that he was in the area all those times going to a gym, he would be a fool to just sit in jail and await trial instead of having his attorney present evidence that he has an alibi and they have the wrong guy. And even if he was that dumb, surely his PD would be quick to let LE know she can prove they have the wrong guy, instead of letting her client just sit and wait for that June hearing. And, as an officer of the court, wouldn't his PD also have an obligation to make sure LE knows as quickly as possible that they are barking up the wrong tree? Because that would mean there is still a murderer on the loose. Right? Or am I mistaken about how these things work?

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

Don't most states follow ABA guidelines to develop rosters of attorneys qualified to lead the defense in capital cases (or in potential capital cases if a DP decision hasn't been made)? I always thought that was typically required. It was my understanding that attorneys with lesser qualifications could sit "second chair" but couldn't serve as the lead attorney. Sitting as second chair was one way to become more qualified to to be a lead. But a public defender's offices may not have the resources to provide a second attorney.

I may be wrong but it's my understanding resources for public defenders offices are stretched pretty thin. But Idaho is something like 3th or 40th out of the 50 states in terms of population. So I'm not really sure the resources there are unusually lacking given the size of the population. It's always possible any location could have mass murders but realistically, demands for public defenders are much less in a less populated state than say in California, Texas, or New York. And training public defenders to work on capital cases takes them away from doing other kinds of defense work that more typically needs to be done. (Drug cases, for example)
JMO

I’ve shared this several times before but seems a good time to share this again:
https://pdc.idaho.gov/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/IdahoCapitalCounselRoster20221215.pdf

Anne Taylor is the only first chair capital qualified PD left in all of north Idaho.

For those interested in learning more about how things work here:
Home

HTH!

 

[Deleted member 718]

Are 24 hour gyms more likely (than non 24 hour businesses) to have some kind of security cameras installed, just wondering?

My gym requires us to scan a fob or a code from an app on our phone to get in. Doors are locked 24\7 so only members can enter. Its all computerized. Plus I see cameras everywhere. If he was there, there's a record.

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

It's almost like he wanted to get caught, very confusing, the things he did prior to and after considering his education.

Including driving across the WA/ID state line from a state with no death penalty into a state with the death penalty. Very curious indeed.

 

[Justice101]

Right. Excuses don't cut it. The defense needs evidence. If he went to a gym in Moscow, miles away from his home, in the middle of the night [eyes rolling] there will be video. The person in charge there would have seen him. He would have signed in somehow. Why was he driving around a house where a murder was taking place at 4 am? Why did he speed away? What EVIDENCE will there be to support his alternative story? The defense can't just make up a lot of BS. They have to show he wasn't there, the knife belonged to someone else, his car had been stolen and he reported it....So no. If he had a concrete alibi, the defense would be jumping to a hearing to get him out of jail with the charges dropped. That isn't happening for a reason.

Exactly!

The prosecution says X, Y and Z... and the defense has to give evidence or at least a PLAUSABLE REASON that X, Y and Z are not true.

If it was only a one-way street, he could just make up 20 incredulous unprovable lies. He might just do that... but the jury has to determine if that his explanation is reasonable or not.

If you have 20 pieces of evidence all SPECIFICALLY pointing to the suspect, then he'd have to make up 20 excuses. That just isn't going to play in Peoria. The weight of a growing mountain of even circumstantial evidence becomes incredibly powerful.

My money would be on a plea agreement ahead of time....or a conviction if it even makes it to trial.

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

Great point. The Walmart in Moscow is currently open 6am-11pm, so he would not have been at Walmart. Albertsons is 6am to midnight. Marshall's is 9:30-9:30. I don't see shopping as an explanation for his late night presence. JMOOoooo

OTOH, that’s Fast Food Row in Moscow, although I’m far too old to know those hours! YMMV & MOO, of course!

EBM: we don’t have an Albertsons in Moscow. Did you mean WinCo? AFAIK, it’s open 24 hours.

 

[PrairieWind]

If BK had evidence that he was in the area all those times going to a gym, he would be a fool to just sit in jail and await trial instead of having his attorney present evidence that he has an alibi and they have the wrong guy. And even if he was that dumb, surely his PD would be quick to let LE know she can prove they have the wrong guy, instead of letting her client just sit and wait for that June hearing. And, as an officer of the court, wouldn't his PD also have an obligation to make sure LE knows as quickly as possible that they are barking up the wrong tree? Because that would mean there is still a murderer on the loose. Right? Or am I mistaken about how these things work?

I don't think you understand the way this works. The MPD, SO, ISP, FBI, Washington State investigators have been working on this since mid November. The defense has just been appointed. The PD is already gotten some info, but it will be arriving by the box load (electronically) over the next few months. The PD probably has one investigator to work on this.

 

[maskedwoman]

OTOH, that’s Fast Food Row in Moscow, although I’m far too old to know those hours! YMMV & MOO, of course!

EBM: we don’t have an Albertsons in Moscow. Did you mean WinCo? AFAIK, it’s open 24 hours.

My bad. It's Safeway. I thought I had read he stopped at Albertsons, so I googled that. It came back as "Albertsons Moscow ID" but was really Safeway. Can't even trust Google today.

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

My bad. It's Safeway. I thought I had read he stopped at Albertsons, so I googled that. It came back as "Albertsons Moscow ID" but was really Safeway. Can't even trust Google today.

Safeway isn’t in that WalMart/Palouse Mall/Fast Food Row area, but the 24 hour WinCo is. Lots of students from both universities as well as lots of residents from both towns shop at WinCo — that’s why it’s able to justify being open 24 hours. MOO

 

[SophieRose]

Great point. The Walmart in Moscow is currently open 6am-11pm, so he would not have been at Walmart. Albertsons is 6am to midnight. Marshall's is 9:30-9:30. I don't see shopping as an explanation for his late night presence. JMOOoooo

Did anyone mention WinCo, a 24 hour grocery store in Moscow?

 

[Bluebythec]

If he attended it - he will have alibi.
But, did he?
Are there any records of him being in the gym on those dates?

We don't know much of anything yet, actually! I asked because I was wondering if the gym was in the area of the phone pings,

 

[Chloegirl]

Let's be honest, they have a Walmart they have a gym they have lots of other shopping other than WinCo. You don't typically go to a sister town 10 miles away to do shopping you could do in your own area. More gas, not exactly a thrifty idea. JMHO

 

[PrairieWind]

I’ve shared this several times before but seems a good time to share this again:
https://pdc.idaho.gov/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/IdahoCapitalCounselRoster20221215.pdf

Anne Taylor is the only first chair capital qualified PD left in all of north Idaho.

For those interested in learning more about how things work here:
Home

HTH!

If this is true, then the death penalty is pretty much already off the table.