ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 71

[iamshadow21]

The PCA also mentions some activity on her phone. Doesn't say if she was awake or sleeping, but that there was some activity on her phone. Maybe DM was texting or calling her.

Activity, or an activity log? Because if there was no activity, it could have supported her saying she was asleep and didn't wake until morning, for example. Though I don't know how that could narrow down the window of the attack, except by proving it didn't happen earlier, which you'd think the Door Dash and D's eyewitness statement would do more conclusively.

 

[schooling]

The PCA also mentions some activity on her phone. Doesn't say if she was awake or sleeping, but that there was some activity on her phone. Maybe DM was texting or calling her.

My opinion, informed by info from the first few days of the murders is….

BF and DM both woke up to noises. BF dismissed them more quickly. After DM saw the murderer (BK) she went back to her room and texted all her roomates. Only BF responded.

and BF exchanged texts. Both are scared.

BF and DM went to sleep together, woke up in the same bed.

MOO

 

[Cool Cats]

There were a lot of inconsistencies early on. There were too many cooks in the kitchen, IMO, and everyone seemed to have something to say. For instance, a lockdown followed by no threat to the community, then it was a crime of passion, then the target was the house vs an occupant, then it was they were all asleep at the time of the killing, then it was that some were asleep, they were all in bed, then we find out at least one may not have been in bed. I think LE was wise to hire a communications person, though I'm not sure it did much good. They eventually got it together, but there were definitely inconsistencies.

Idaho cops slammed for 'grave contradictions' and poor probe

Idaho police have been accused of contradicting themselves and mishandling evidence as their probe into the slaying of four University of Idaho students approaches its third week.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Mysterious Idaho student killings compounded by police contradictions, experts say

Families are questioning contradictions by Idaho police investigating the deaths of Ethan Chapin, Madison Mogen, Kaylee Goncalves and Xana Kernodle

www.usatoday.com

The only conflicting statement is whether they were targeted or not.

I guess they are back to saying yes, but don't know if some were killed just for being there.

Much ado about nothing. LE did a good job after all. Much of the fuss was because there were no arrests and everyone wanted it solved and were afraid the killer was far long gone.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

He could have followed one of the victims home from work to establish that.

Or even just seen one of the victims on the street after class.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Still sounds like speculation and social media rumour to me. I'm sorry for her loss, but this doesn't prove anything, especially not any kind of action or inaction D would have to answer for.

There is not much verified in this article you respond to--it's "[a]n account believed to belong to Ethan's sister-in-law..." and on a Reddit thread she "supposedly" called the others girls in the house....

"Believed to belong," she "supposedly called." And on Reddit. Three strikes and out for me.

 

[RonSwanson33]

An account believed to belong to Ethan's sister-in-law made several posts online before the arrest affidavit was unsealed for suspected quadruple killer Bryan Kohberger.

The court document detailed how surviving roommate Dylan Mortensen came face to face with a masked man on the night of the murders.

Ethan, 20, his girlfriend Xana Kernodle, 20, and Maddie Mogen, 21, and Kaylee Goncalves, 20, were all killed as they slept in the house on November 13.

His sister-in-law has since revealed that Dylan, who was in the property at the time of the killings along with Bethany Funke, called all of the roommates after she heard 'screaming and crying' coming from their rooms.

Posting in a thread on Reddit, she said: 'D supposedly called all the girls in the house after the crying and screaming stopped and no one answered – and she still didn't call the police.

Family of Ethan Chapin question why Dylan Mortensen didn't call cops

An account believed to belong to Ethan's sister-in-law made several posts online before the arrest affidavit was unsealed for suspected quadruple killer Bryan Kohberger.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Is it just me or do none of those headlines match with the links? Link #1 is about the lady who is in love with BK, Link #2 is about Xana's mom, Link #3 is how they lost BK on his drive east, Link #4 is about BTK...am I missing something?

 

[jepop]

That's why I chuckled to myself when posters wrote last night that they were only going to believe official releases from LE. LE hasn't been a model of consistency in this case, at least not in the early weeks. LOL.

I wonder whether such conflicting reports can be introduced by the defense at trial to argue the MPD was untrustworthy from get-go. Between the coroner, the prosecutor and the MPD spokesperson, it was sort of "Keystone Kops" there for a short period.

Or are statements to the media outside the scope of admissible evidence? Anybody know?

(Please note: I'm not saying the MPD or other agencies are incompetent. I understand they were confronted with a particularly horrendous mass-murder in a jurisdiction where they hadn't had any murder for 7 or 8 years.

I'm just asking whether they can be made to appear incompetent, based on erroneous reports from the first weeks?)

IMO, LE entitled to clamp down or not release info to media during an investigation. It was, IMO, a tactic by LE not to let it be known where DM was sleeping and that she had seen a person exiting the house. I think it was so important to LE that they even had to answer persistent enquires with misleading info as has been shown upthread here (twitter enquires by journos). MOO. If LE were inconsistent,then there were reasons for that. MOO. Probably, defense will have a go at that but if keeping quiet re DM did two things; (a) protect DM and (b) make the killer feel safe thinking he hadn't been seen and there was noone else on the second floor, then it would be worth the (IMO small) risk. MOO

 

[iamshadow21]

Is it just me or do none of those headlines match with the links? Link #1 is about the lady who is in love with BK, Link #2 is about Xana's mom, Link #3 is how they lost BK on his drive east, Link #4 is about BTK...am I missing something?

Wow, Daily Mail earning its less than complimentary nickname. None of those links are what they say they are. They're all about the case, but they're just random. You're right.

 

[Shadow@light]

Still sounds like speculation and social media rumour to me. I'm sorry for her loss, but this doesn't prove anything, especially not any kind of action or inaction D would have to answer for.

I agree ,if sister in law did state that, IMO it is grief speaking when faced with a crime your mind and body shuts down you can even say what people regret later yet people will bring it up in a way of " How could you say something so heartless", ie Hoddle Street Massacre, Melbourne ,Australia 9th August 1987, the poor Petrol Assistant Girl staggers in to the shop in total shop, she gasps out "There is someone shooting,......dead bodies everywhere...... Do you still want me to serve petrol?"
When you been in the same situation as the house mate, which I confess ( I am not trying to jump on the bandwagon) but I been like other people in the same situation and been silent, but it took me over thirty years to speak up, I now reported it, it was witnessed, and action was taken. I hope the girl found justice and peace.
I was being interveiwed in regards to a children home I lived in when I was 11 years old, about a certain few House Parents. one of them they were enquiring information regarding a woman , I would just call her" L " during the interveiw I suddenly recalled the "Incidient" first time after so many before and blurted it all out. At the time I had no understanding what had happened it was all just sound but it terrifed me. Years before in the home a teenager was brought in after midnight, put in a room on her own just down the hallway from my room I was awake as I could not sleep, short while later we had the hourly room check, our room doors was nearly clear glass pane they would shine a torch through. Around the same time, I could hear muffled cries, whimpering sounds from her room. I decided to go to the girl, as I stepped into the hallway I noticed her door was open, I could hear L voice inside her room as she was mocking the girl ( words could not hear clearly) I went back in my room, L stormed out shinning torches in all rooms goes back into girls room ,there was some noises then the girl room door slams shut. L walks past my room back to Office, short later, another house parent does room check, room oppisite,,My room then girls room, then I hear House parent scream, runs up hallway, two house parents minus L rush down, they speak comforting words as they carry the girl past my room( I can see as my bed faces the door) girl moaning in pain. Seconds later L is clearing /cleaning the girl room as she drags linen/mattress out she checks all rooms, when the other House Parent comes down L claims she is distressed and unwell she going home could the other House Parent look after everything until the other House Parent gets back from the Hospital. There was four girls and myself in those room, even the House Parent "woke" me up to see if I was Okay, even the other we said none thing about what happened earlier. L was away for a few days, Myself and other children never spoke a word, did not talk to each other. I think, hearing more than seeing can affect so much of a human mind and well being, and I can understand how IMO it can affect the house mates to the point it can be blotted from their mind, even the action of few hours later on why their housemates werent up, why they did not want to check fear of what has happened speaks of them still in shock, you don't want too so delay the horrible truth. IMO. May she and other house mate should not be question about their actions but be given understanding, grief makes you lash out but not at innocent parties.

 

[Nova]

IMO, LE entitled to clamp down or not release info to media during an investigation. It was, IMO, a tactic by LE not to let it be known where DM was sleeping and that she had seen a person exiting the house. I think it was so important to LE that they even had to answer persistent enquires with misleading info as has been shown upthread here (twitter enquires by journos). MOO. If LE were inconsistent,then there were reasons for that. MOO. Probably, defense will have a go at that but if keeping quiet re DM did two things; (a) protect DM and (b) make the killer feel safe thinking he hadn't been seen and there was noone else on the second floor, then it would be worth the (IMO small) risk. MOO

Protecting DM and BF makes perfect sense to me, as you explain it.

I was thinking more about "they were all asleep in their beds", "the intruder targeted one person; no threat to the community" v. "the intruder targeted the house", "crime of passion" v. "premeditated and carefully planned", etc.

I am well aware that SCOTUS allows LE to mislead suspects and I assume it is legal to release false info to the media. But that in itself doesn't preclude a defense attorney from arguing that given all the erroneous info released, LE is not to be trusted in this case.

 

[Megnut]

Layout is one thing but home decor can add hazards one should be aware of.

Tripping over and unexpected potted plant, chair or other decorative items would wake the household.

It's possible he invited himself into their house previously. Secretly. Including while everyone was sleeping. He may have had some confidence in his stealth.

JMO

 

[iamshadow21]

It's possible he invited himself into their house previously. Secretly. Including while everyone was sleeping. He may have had some confidence in his stealth.

JMO

Yeah, he strikes me as someone who would get off on 'creepy crawling'. Both for tactical reasons for the future attack, and just for the enjoyment of knowing that he'd violated their home without them knowing. No evidence at this time that he did this, but if it comes out in the future I won't be surprised.

MOO

 

[Helechawagirl]

I just can’t wrap my head around the fact that he was able to kill 4 people in such a relatively short period of time

I’m having trouble with the timeline as well. It would seem the food delivery guy and the killer would have had to be there at the same time. And you’d have your light on to eat so if he was watching, he’d know someone was up unless he approached from the back of the house and couldn’t see the light on in Xana’s room. Do we know where the car parked? I thought it was parked on Xana’s and the bottom floor side. Have the police ever said that they are confident that one person did this? Or did I just assume that? If the car was parked on Maddie’s side of the house, it might be easier to leave wo being spotted. Could there have been a driver? Was the comment about anyone else being arrested BK wondering if someone ratted him out? Or could he be asking if they were looking at other suspects or just him? (I’m rewatching Secrets and Lies so it has me rethinking things a bit.) I’ll have to wait for the rest of the information as to point of entry, additional DNA evidence, etc. if it wasn’t forced entry, and the police had to block the door with stools, was the lock on the sliding glass door broken? IDK—still a lot of holes in this story. JMO

 

[jepop]

Protecting DM and BF makes perfect sense to me, as you explain it.

I was thinking more about "they were all asleep in their beds", "the intruder targeted one person; no threat to the community" v. "the intruder targeted the house", "crime of passion" v. "premeditated and carefully planned", etc.

I am well aware that SCOTUS allows LE to mislead suspects and I assume it is legal to release false info to the media. But that in itself doesn't preclude a defense attorney from arguing that given all the erroneous info released, LE is not to be trusted in this case.

BBM: I got the feeling in hindsight that LE wanted to keep tight lipped on the asleep in beds things partly in order to protect DM and also not to alarm the perp. But also I genuinely think in the earlier stages of the investigation they were also piecing together who was up (out of bed) and who wasn't so, infact, did not know exactly what the situation was.MOO. And hard to say for sure who was alseep at the time attacks started in those early days and even now we know nothing definite but can make some inferences via PCA. MOO.

Apart from the uncertainty re targeted or not, I'm not sure that LE really contradicted themselves around crime of passion vs premeditated (MOO), but my memory could well be tricking me! In any event LE's press conferences at the time didn't strike me as inherently untrustworthy. There was a list of people on MPD page that showed who MPD believed was not involved. I thought at the time that LE were carefully trying to control rumours and flow of info info that had potential to damage the investigation and alarm the perp, MOO

People did get all worked up because of the tight lipped factor, no doubt. But, IMO, were the defense to take the angle that LE can not be trusted in this case, I think the prosecution would be able to answer to such a charge with strong evidence to the contrary and such an approach would fall flat on it's face for the defense. Just MOO!

ETA: Re who was asleep when attacks began, I believe at a minimum that DM and and XK were likely awake and I also infer from the PCA that the attacks began in Maddie's room. I think it's possible XK awoke EC. or he awoke himself. I do tend to believe, at this moment, that KG and MM were both in MM's bed and likely asleep. MOO

 

[iamshadow21]

I just can’t wrap my head around the fact that he was able to kill 4 people in such a relatively short period of time

Bundy attacked four at the Chi Omega house in under fifteen minutes. He'd never been in the house before, he improvised a murder weapon from a piece of firewood, and had ample time to also sexually assault the two girls who died. He also did it in near complete darkness.

It is more than possible, the fact that Bundy did it means BK knew he could do it. MOO

 

[Kemug]

I've missed quite a bit lately, so apologies if this possibility had already been mentioned. I'm just wondering if at 4am BK was already in the house, and it was he who answered the door and took in the food delivery? Although I suppose the delivery person has already given a description.

 

[iamshadow21]

I've missed quite a bit lately, so apologies if this possibility had already been mentioned. I'm just wondering if at 4am BK was already in the house, and it was he who answered the door and took in the food delivery? Although I suppose the delivery person has already given a description.

As far as I know he has. I also think Door Dash would be able to tell LE if someone other than Xana ordered the food and sent it to the house in her name.

EDIT: Of course, this doesn't mean he wasn't in the house, but I think the timestamps on the videos of the car rule that out.

 

[katydid23]

My opinion, informed by info from the first few days of the murders is….

BF and DM both woke up to noises. BF dismissed them more quickly. After DM saw the murderer (BK) she went back to her room and texted all her roomates. Only BF responded.

and BF exchanged texts. Both are scared.

BF and DM went to sleep together, woke up in the same bed.

MOO

How did they wake up in the same bed? One of them would have had to walk past E and X's bodies, wouldn't they?

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

My opinion, informed by info from the first few days of the murders is….

BF and DM both woke up to noises. BF dismissed them more quickly. After DM saw the murderer (BK) she went back to her room and texted all her roomates. Only BF responded.

and BF exchanged texts. Both are scared.

BF and DM went to sleep together, woke up in the same bed.

MOO

So DM who, per the PCA, was shocked and went back into her room and locked the door and was (IMO) too scared to check on Xana on the 2nd floor left the bedroom to go downstairs to the 1st floor? I totally buy that she was too scared to do anything (I actually posted on one of the first days after the murders that if the 2 roommates were awake, they were likely scared and hiding until morning), but I can't picture her willingly coming out of that 2nd floor room to go down to the first when she had no idea what she'd find down there.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

The only conflicting statement is whether they were targeted or not.

I guess they are back to saying yes, but don't know if some were killed just for being there.

Much ado about nothing. LE did a good job after all. Much of the fuss was because there were no arrests and everyone wanted it solved and were afraid the killer was far long gone.

I'm not denying they did a good job, absolutely. But there were a number of inconsistencies.