ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #13

[ILOKAL]

There were many scent dogs used ( forget the cremains dogs) just the regular human scent dogs. Whether the baby was carried off by a lion, dragged or picked up and carried up road to a to a waiting vehicle, a scent should have been picked up. instead the dogs circled .. went to the reservoir and came back. That tells me either all these dogs are incompetent, the baby was there at one time ( but perhaps not another) and that they returned to the campsite because that is where the scent was and they cannot find him after that because he got into his parent's vehicle and went off. Add to that the questionable to no sighting at the convenience store and it appears something is amiss. MOO

Could the other 2 POI be remembering seeing Deorr BEFORE the store trip and not after? Is SB telling the actual story? I guess he can tell us whatever he wants while this is under investigation..right? i don't know? If there is truly a crazy leering man out there this info is lost to the ages, imo. 3 months later and this guy is long gone..IMO

Anything i write is just my opinion

Did the sheriff state that ALL the dogs reacted the same? There were different dogs at different times.

 

[Arnie M]

Back in thread #9, around the 700-750 post area, there was discussion about the use of infrared heat guns being used from the air. I never saw a link to confirm or any details on when they were used. Anyone know?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

It was a Bell 429 from Whitefish Montana operating as "Two Bear Air"
Philanthropist Mike Goguen funded the $11,000,000 cost for two SAR helicopters and there is no cost to the public
http://fireaviation.com/2015/04/05/philanthropist-provides-rescue-helicopters-in-montana/

March 2015 the Bell 429 located a missing teenager at 1:00 AM
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/girl-rescued-after-being-trapped-under-tree-on-lion-mountain/31766670

Mention of the helicopter in the DeOrr Kunz search
http://magicvalley.com/crews-scale-...cle_148e6a40-bb81-5cdc-b561-a02c6f59c2dc.html

 

[ReadySet]

Didn't the dad say in one interview that he got tons of people up (with just a couoke phone calls, I think he said) to help search and the sheriff said they searched outside the official search area? I wonder if that would have helped/himdered the search?

I certainly cannot judge the sheriff's effectiveness and do not mean to sound critical; I do, however, wish his words sounded more...professional? Is that the right word? Some of what he says does not inspire confidence. IMO

I agree that the sheriff sounded low-key and "down home." But, IMO, his primary goal of the interview was not to inspire confidence in us. His main goal was to progress the investigation.IMO, everything he said and how he said it was geared toward that goal.

 

[ReadySet]

Which takes us back to those other campers who just "disappeared"... First they were "assisting" with the search, then they just disappeared. All awhile the EMT bag goes missing. Another problem, IMO.

I have to say I'm bothered by the word "disappeared" also. Could be nothing, but.

 

[ILOKAL]

Which takes us back to those other campers who just "disappeared"... First they were "assisting" with the search, then they just disappeared. All awhile the EMT bag goes missing. Another problem, IMO.

I KNOW! WTH?! It's been over three months and I may be recalling incorrectly, but didn't initial reports (and those since) state that there were no other people camping at the lower OR upper campgrounds?

 

[Mickshawn]

I KNOW! WTH?! It's been over three months and I may be recalling incorrectly, but didn't initial reports (and those since) state that there were no other people camping at the lower OR upper campgrounds?

That's what I remember, too...Could they not have known?

 

[giagreen]

Well they'd have to know cause they reportedly helped search. Unless if you mean the reporter didn't know about the other campers.
I think its just another one of them things that they didn't feel like the public needed to know.

 

[ILOKAL]

Well they'd have to know cause they reportedly helped search. Unless if you mean the reporter didn't know about the other campers.
I think its just another one of them things that they didn't feel like the public needed to know.

We don't know WHEN LE came to realize that these "neighbors" actually helped search. That might have surfaced way after the fact. I don't think the statement that there were no other campers came from a reporter. I thought it came from LE.

 

[Mickshawn]

We don't know WHEN LE came to realize that these "neighbors" actually helped search. That might have surfaced way after the fact. I don't think the statement that there were no other campers came from a reporter. I thought it came from LE.

I can't remember...Did we ever get verification of WHO spread the cremains?

 

[giagreen]

We don't know WHEN LE came to realize that these "neighbors" actually helped search. That might have surfaced way after the fact. I don't think the statement that there were no other campers came from a reporter. I thought it came from LE.

I'm gonna have to go with they new about the other campers. SB says they helped searched the first day and maybe the 2nd and disappeared before they got the chance to interview them.
And I can only remember DeOrr sr in the interview talking about nobody els being there. Or at least I got that impression from him.

 

[ILOKAL]

I'm gonna have to go with they new about the other campers. SB says they helped searched the first day and maybe the 2nd and disappeared before they got the chance to interview them.
And I can only remember DeOrr sr in the interview talking about nobody els being there. Or at least I got that impression from him.

You might be right, but all I know is all along it's been said (don't remember who all said it) that there were no other people or campers around. I've got to run (soccer game) but maybe someone can look into this further. It really is hard to imagine that people are allowed to "disappear" even though they might be witness to something in this case. That is just unacceptable, IMO.

 

[giagreen]

You might be right, but all I know is all along it's been said (don't remember who all said it) that there were no other people or campers around. I've got to run (soccer game) but maybe someone can look into this further. It really is hard to imagine that people are allowed to "disappear" even though they might be witness to something in this case. That is just unacceptable, IMO.

I agree its very unacceptable. I also think that a missing EMT bag being no big deal is also unacceptable. I try and tell myself its all a big deal and sb is just keeping it on the down low. Its the only way i can feel good about any of it. But I'll look into and see what I find. Good luck at the game!!!

 

[neesaki]

I KNOW! WTH?! It's been over three months and I may be recalling incorrectly, but didn't initial reports (and those since) state that there were no other people camping at the lower OR upper campgrounds?

In re-listening to the Sheriff's interview, he states this at around 5:15 into the interview.

"Right where grandpa's sitting he's within 20 to 30 yards of the only roadway into the campground. And absolutely no one was seen at that lower campground, coming or going, and when my personnel went in nobody was seen leaving".

So the only roadway within 20 to 30 yards of the campground, was also the only roadway into the upper campground according to the map I posted here earlier. Why does Sheriff B. only seem concerned with that lower campground? What difference does that make if someone is using that road to access another campground 1/2 mile up the road. Can someone help me out here? Maybe I'm missing something.

[video=youtube;FV-h82eVQ1M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FV-h82eVQ1M[/video]

 

[bessie]

In re-listening to the Sheriff's interview, he states this at around 5:15 into the interview.

So the only roadway within 20 to 30 yards of the campground, was also the only roadway into the upper campground according to the map I posted here earlier. Why does Sheriff B. only seem concerned with that lower campground? What difference does that make if someone is using that road to access another campground 1/2 mile up the road. Can someone help me out here? Maybe I'm missing something.

[video=youtube;FV-h82eVQ1M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FV-h82eVQ1M[/video]

I took that to mean that no one could get in or out of the upper campground without being seen from ggp's vantage point in the lower campground.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

I think there is a lot of confusion about the camp ground coming from all sides.

According to the USDA website there are: "5 sites with picnic tables and fire rings" The map on the site only puts two icons on there (one each for upper/lower sites)

The parents apparently were camping ~250 metres north of the icon marked lower campground. I guess there are two "sites" at the lower and three at the upper.

This means for example that the only road 20-30 yards away would be the 172A on the map. The 172 would be the road down to the other lower camp ground site and a further 1/2 mile along one of the three upper camp campgrounds.

Well that's where I'm at the minute. Please correct if I have anything wrong!

 

[Hoosier952]

How is GGP's hearing? If GGP turned his head long enough for a child to completely disappear far enough away that hundreds of people can't find him, I can also assume that he could have turned his head long enough for a car to drive by without noticing. How much of the road is actually visible from where GGP was sitting? 20-30 yds doesn't seem like much, but if it was blocked by trees, hills, etc, a vehicle might be hard to see or hear. I still think it would be pretty difficult for someone to sneak in and out without being seen or heard by someone, and I think it would be even harder for someone to sneak in, grab a child, and sneak out without being noticed.

 

[desert-blue]

How is GGP's hearing? If GGP turned his head long enough for a child to completely disappear far enough away that hundreds of people can't find him, I can also assume that he could have turned his head long enough for a car to drive by without noticing. How much of the road is actually visible from where GGP was sitting? 20-30 yds doesn't seem like much, but if it was blocked by trees, hills, etc, a vehicle might be hard to see or hear. I still think it would be pretty difficult for someone to sneak in and out without being seen or heard by someone, and I think it would be even harder for someone to sneak in, grab a child, and sneak out without being noticed.

At the beginning of the investigation, GGP's declining physical and mental health deemed him unfit to be a suspect. I wonder then how solid he is as a witness to whether any cars were coming and/or going on the road. Plus, I was under the impression from DK that from the lower campground, one cannot see the road up above that leads to the upper campsites (but they can see down - he was worried about that). I wonder when the campers at the upper site arrived? Thursday or Friday? (or earlier in the week?)

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Which takes us back to those other campers who just "disappeared"... First they were "assisting" with the search, then they just disappeared. All awhile the EMT bag goes missing. Another problem, IMO.

I have to say I'm bothered by the word "disappeared" also. Could be nothing, but.

Perhaps an eagle took them.

It is mighty strange that these people weren't mentioned before. And it wasn't just an elderly couple, they had family visit them there too. Surely all these people must be accounted for, surely their vehicles have been searched?

 

[Mickshawn]

At the beginning of the investigation, GGP's declining physical and mental health deemed him unfit to be a suspect. I wonder then how solid he is as a witness to whether any cars were coming and/or going on the road. Plus, I was under the impression from DK that from the lower campground, one cannot see the road up above that leads to the upper campsites (but they can see down - he was worried about that). I wonder when the campers at the upper site arrived? Thursday or Friday? (or earlier in the week?)

Perhaps the upper campground folks arrived while:

~The family went to the store
~Maybe IR was fishing
~Maybe GGP was napping

?????

 

[MJ1960]

How is GGP's hearing? If GGP turned his head long enough for a child to completely disappear far enough away that hundreds of people can't find him, I can also assume that he could have turned his head long enough for a car to drive by without noticing. How much of the road is actually visible from where GGP was sitting? 20-30 yds doesn't seem like much, but if it was blocked by trees, hills, etc, a vehicle might be hard to see or hear. I still think it would be pretty difficult for someone to sneak in and out without being seen or heard by someone, and I think it would be even harder for someone to sneak in, grab a child, and sneak out without being noticed.

Yes, but what if nobody had to sneak in and out? What if Deorr wandered not too far away, but far away enough to be taken by someone unnoticed? I once had a dog stolen like this. The lady who was watching him left the back door open, and the dog wandered to an open house next door. The real estate agent saw him and took him. Someone they knew saw flyers, and put two and two together. So this guy jumped their fence, stole the dog back, and brought him back to us. He was missing for 2 weeks. Sometimes life can be a perfect storm for these types of things to happen.