ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #15

[ILOKAL]

The "campsite" is part of the mountain but not all inclusive of the mountain. The "mountain" could include the campsite or not, while "campsite" can only mean their campsite, not the whole mountain.

If they're using precise language, which I'm not sure they are.

The entire campsite in on the mountain, however, the mountain encompasses more than the campsite.

 

[flourish]

Right the mountain includes the campsite. But the campsite doesn't contain the entire mountain.


Okay like 1) my cat Henry isn't in my house.

2) My cat Henry isn't in my living room.

Not the same thing. In the first scenario, Henry can't be in bathroom or bedroom or anywhere in my house.

In the second scenario, Henry can be anywhere in the house EXCEPT the living room.

Because my living room is part of my house, but not my entire house.

The campsite is part of the mountain but not the entire mountain.

So it's possible to have been on the mountain but not in the campsite.

 

[blefuscu]

Mountain lions don't use lairs. They use day rest areas and don't stay in one place likes wolves, for example.

Would they move their food around? Or just eat it in one place? I hate writing that. But I'm struggling to see how after all this time remains wouldn't have been found if a mountain lion had grabbed him. There was a fairly extensive search of the area wasn't there? There would be evidence of bones or something somewhere surely.

 

[ILOKAL]

Would they move their food around? Or just eat it in one place? I hate writing that. But I'm struggling to see how after all this time remains wouldn't have been found if a mountain lion had grabbed him. There was a fairly extensive search of the area wasn't there? There would be evidence of bones or something somewhere surely.

They will usually move their kill to what is considered a safe location and then begin consumption in quite a precise manner. When there is anything remaining (from large kills) they often (not always) move it again and cover it with leaves, branches, debris, to keep other animals from finding it and also to keep it fresh. An adult will consume about 25# before leaving the remainder for a future meal. Mountain lions leave very little in the way of bones.

 

[iluvmua]

Since KI ruled out animal attack, I tend to believe what they say.

jmo

and I believe that LE knows WAY more than they are telling the public.

I hope this case is solved very soon.

jmo

 

[webweaved]

Since KI ruled out animal attack, I tend to believe what they say.

jmo

and I believe that LE knows WAY more than they are telling the public.

I hope this case is solved very soon.

jmo

I get that feeling about LE too. JMO.

 

[pepelepolecat]

The "campsite" is part of the mountain but not all inclusive of the mountain. The "mountain" could include the campsite or not, while "campsite" can only mean their campsite, not the whole mountain.

If they're using precise language, which I'm not sure they are.

I don't think they're being precise in this particular case.

Similar scenario:

"We're going to the lake for our vacation."

That could mean they're going to a houseboat on the lake, a camper near the lake, a hotel in the vicinity of the lake or a vacation home on the shores of the lake. "The mountain," imo and moo, is being used somewhat interchangeably with "the campsite." That said, he's obviously not at the campsite (imo), but it's quite possible (and probable, imo) that he's elsewhere on the mountain or quite nearby.

 

[flourish]

I wish they would be precise! Argh! Where's this baby?

 

[neesaki]

It is going to be really hard to let go of the mountain lion attack theory. My personal favorite.

Something tells me you're not really serious, woodsman But as you probably know, the mountain lion theory has been among my top picks, among others .... yes, for real.
Well, if nothing else, it did keep the thread going for a while. That said, I still can't see how they could have ruled it out "beyond a reasonable doubt". That would be a tough one.
And that said, again, I do have other theories, probably similar to yours.

Glad I checked in, something was telling there would be some kind of news. It is interesting to say the least.

 

[Aunt_Tulip]

Did anyone else see the Klein Investigations comment that Mr. Vilt left the case over a disagreement with the family about offering a reward? I wanted to go back and re-read it to make sure I understood if it was the family not wanting to offer a reward or if Mr. Vilt thought it was a bad idea. Now I can't seem to find it again. I thought it was in the open Q&A thread on their page.

 

[iluvmua]

Did anyone else see the Klein Investigations comment that Mr. Vilt left the case over a disagreement with the family about offering a reward? I wanted to go back and re-read it to make sure I understood if it was the family not wanting to offer a reward or if Mr. Vilt thought it was a bad idea. Now I can't seem to find it again. I thought it was in the open Q&A thread on their page.

IIRC, PI Vilt wanted to offer a reward ($10,000) but the family did not want to offer a reward.

and that is why he left.

 

[Aunt_Tulip]

Thank you! I thought that's how I read it, but I couldn't think of a reason a family wouldn't want to offer a reward so I wanted to double check. I'm glad someone else saw it.

 

[krig101]

From September when they announce reward.

Investigator Frank Vilt said he's convinced Kunz is still alive based on a search of the campsite.

“No remains, no clothing. Nothing up there. The cadaver dogs couldn't find anything. The search dogs couldn't find anything,” said Vilt.


http://m.localnews8.com/news/10000-reward-offered-for-leads-in-missing-toddler-case/35229162

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[krig101]

Did anyone else see the Klein Investigations comment that Mr. Vilt left the case over a disagreement with the family about offering a reward? I wanted to go back and re-read it to make sure I understood if it was the family not wanting to offer a reward or if Mr. Vilt thought it was a bad idea. Now I can't seem to find it again. I thought it was in the open Q&A thread on their page.

http://www.postregister.com/article...ation-continues-deorr-kunz-jr’s-disappearance

Private investigator Frank Vilt, a retired U.S. Marshal who previously worked with the family, said he backed out of the case after offering a reward for information leading to DeOrr. Vilt said the family disagreed with posting a reward.

ETA link not working now. Its on the Post Register Site.

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[aaarrrggghhh]

LEMHI COUNTY SHERIFF DEPUTY: “WE HAVE NEW LEADS IN DEORR CASE”

LEADORE — Investigators with the Lemhi County Sheriff’s Office say they have developed new leads in the case of missing Idaho Falls toddler DeOrr Kunz, Jr.

<modsnip>

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/lemhi-county-sheriff-deputy-we-have-new-leads-in-deorr-case/

 

[webweaved]

LEMHI COUNTY SHERIFF DEPUTY: “WE HAVE NEW LEADS IN DEORR CASE”

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/lemhi-county-sheriff-deputy-we-have-new-leads-in-deorr-case/

oh wow. gut feeling confirmed lol how about that. LE was holding back. thank god they have leads!! LE has been very wise in keeping their cool.

 

[krig101]

LEMHI COUNTY SHERIFF DEPUTY: &#8220;WE HAVE NEW LEADS IN DEORR CASE&#8221;

LEADORE &#8212; Investigators with the Lemhi County Sheriff&#8217;s Office say they have developed new leads in the case of missing Idaho Falls toddler DeOrr Kunz, Jr.

<modsnip>

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/lemhi-county-sheriff-deputy-we-have-new-leads-in-deorr-case/

"The leads were obtained from previously withheld information,&#8221; Chief Deputy Steve Penner told EastIdahoNews.com late Saturday night. &#8220;The investigation is continuing.&#8221;

<modsnip>
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[Lilibet]

A few thoughts...keeping in mind that Mr. Klein is not an exceptionally precise writer IMO. Although his strange wording actually may be more clever than it appears to be.

His team has ruled out a "forced abduction." By definition, an abduction IS forced, so his wording seems redundant. I think he may mean that "stranger abduction" has been ruled out in this context since under this point he has specifically ruled out two sets of strangers who could have participated in a "forced abduction." DeOrr would not have gone with them willingly and would have to be "forced."

https://www.facebook.com/KleinInves...3864945696095/939454592803792/?type=3&theater

However, if DeOrr went voluntarily with someone he knew, that would not be initially "forced." But it would become an "abduction" (within the definition that an abduction is forced) when DeOrr was not returned. So it seems possible that Mr. Klein, by using the redundant word "forced," is leading our thinking toward DeOrr having gone with someone he knew, rather than strangers. This possibility would also tie in with the legal use of the word abduction... the illegal removal of a child from parents or guardians. (See link below for all definitions.)

I may be trying to make sense of what is simply sloppy writing, so I'm not at all sure this is what he meant.

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/abduction

 

[ClaireNC]

LEMHI COUNTY SHERIFF DEPUTY: &#8220;WE HAVE NEW LEADS IN DEORR CASE&#8221;
LEADORE &#8212; Investigators with the Lemhi County Sheriff&#8217;s Office say they have developed new leads in the case of missing Idaho Falls toddler DeOrr Kunz, Jr.<modsnip>
http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/lemhi-county-sheriff-deputy-we-have-new-leads-in-deorr-case/

Wow! Great news!

 

[krig101]

LEMHI COUNTY SHERIFF DEPUTY: “WE HAVE NEW LEADS IN DEORR CASE”

LEADORE — Investigators with the Lemhi County Sheriff’s Office say they have developed new leads in the case of missing Idaho Falls toddler DeOrr Kunz, Jr.

<modsnip>

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/lemhi-county-sheriff-deputy-we-have-new-leads-in-deorr-case/

When asked if the new leads could lead to arrests, Penner would not comment.

IMO this is very telling

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