ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #2

[JLSChook]

Just FYI---When LE says things like, "We see no evidence of an abduction", or "We don't suspect foul play at this time"....it doesn't really mean much in the grand scheme of things.

They can NEVER rule anything out (or in, for that matter) until they have significant proof of one or the other.

If I had a nickel for every thread at WS where within the first page or so it was stated that LE says, "There is no sign of foul play"....You know the rest.

I understand that when we're waiting for word on any MP, we tend to over-analyze and scrutinize every word coming from LE, parents, witnesses, etc...but sometimes it will lead you (collectively) down a rabbit hole in which you will never find your way out.

 

[Jovi Girl]

I think poor DeOrr drowned . As far as how news articles are worded, it's very often taken for granted that what an article states is exactly what happened. Journalists and editors make mistakes. Simple word and punctuation errors can change how some sentences and statements are read . IMO

 

[leilarose68]

I think poor DeOrr drowned . As far as how news articles are worded, it's very often taken for granted that what an article states is exactly what happened. Journalists and editors make mistakes. Simple word and punctuation errors can change how some sentences and statements are read . IMO

If he drowned they would have found at least one cowboy boot, don't you think?

 

[sarx]

Just a side note to confuse people even more, many dogs are trained to find bones that have long since lost their flesh. In fact many are trained on the whole range of decomp from fresh to skeletal.

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[flourish]

If he drowned they would have found at least one cowboy boot, don't you think?

Never mind, your edit made my question moot.



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[sunflowerchick]

I'm still waiting for the explanation that he jumped in his truck to drive where he knew where he could get a signal. Since he stated he HAD NEVER BEEN there, how did he know there was a better signal?? From his initial non-stop talking first interview, things have been very quiet. JMO..that sheriff is either the dumbest man or the smartest man in town. I'm hoping for the latter.

He would have known from the trip up to the campsite where the signal went bad. I have taken note of this myself on many a camping trip because it is good information in case of emergency.

 

[sunflowerchick]

I think I am going to need to jump out of this thread for a while. The mods have asked us not to sleuth the parents and as much as you try to dance around it, some of this is, in fact, sleuthing the parents. I, for one, believe them and I am tired of the innuendos, winks and nudges that are being overlooked. I hope little DeOrr is found.

 

[Mickshawn]

Would locals know about mine shafts in the immediate area??
mine shaft
noun
noun: mineshaft

• a deep narrow vertical hole, or sometimes a horizontal tunnel, that gives access to a mine.
  
  
  
  
  

 

[IndianSummer]

bbm
Some do, and which such a small child there wouldn't be any struggle. And you mustn't forget that if Deorr had wandered off and was taken by an animal much later and a mile away, any signs of an attack or prints might well have not been found.

My friend who lives n the piney woods of Texas had an entire litter of baby puppies (kid)napped ...no tracks, no struggle..they looked 4ever...it was like an alien came down and took their puppies away... 12 miles out 2 were found alive! Bite marks on their necks from the carry.

 

[Elainera]

What I was getting at is there has to be decomposing flesh. That they actually are sniffing for a certain chemical reaction (can't remember the name) that occurs once a body starts to decompose. With cremains...there is no decomposition. There are just the remains of burned bones basically....no flesh. If that is in fact true...then the dogs WERE hitting on decomposing flesh...NOT cremains. I know dogs can hit on that chemical way underground and underwater.

It's the same chemical print, apparently, in decomposing flesh as well as cremains. I had linked an article explaining this a page or so back. Plus, their training involves both.

 

[carbuff]

Even without LE's statements and the forum rules, I don't think the evidence is pointing at the parents.

 

[1&2&3]

This statement causes me to stop and analyze it because we hear it so often.

"Cadaver dogs led law enforcement directly to the reservoir but Bowerman said unrelated cremated remains dumped into the water during the search likely prompted the canines' interest. A search of the reservoir using advanced sonar equipment yielded nothing, he said." http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/07/20...idaho-toddler/

The cadaver dogs led directly to the reservoir - so we are to assume the dogs started at the campsite. Right?

The remains were dumped during the search - how many days after Deorr went missing until the dogs were brought in?

Didn't the couple remain at the campsite for some days after Deorr went missing? So how did this unknown person walk from the same campsite the family was staying to the reservoir to dump the remains during the search, thereby alerting the dogs to go directly to the reservoir?? Do you follow this?

It makes this statement by Bowerman a little questionable IMO.

Another factor is using sonar in water can also be misleading. IIRC, sonar was used in another case where it was declared the body was not in the lake. It was just a matter of time until the body floated to the top.

After seeing the location of the campsite, the water jumped out at me as the perfect draw to a 2 yr old. Water and little boys are a deadly match when child is unattended!

 

[leilarose68]

Searchers surely would have come upon mineshafts, no?

 

[leilarose68]

Even without LE's statements and the forum rules, I don't think the evidence is pointing at the parents.

What do you think the evidence is pointing at?

 

[carbuff]

Would locals know about mine shafts in the immediate area??
mine shaft
noun
noun: mineshaft

• a deep narrow vertical hole, or sometimes a horizontal tunnel, that gives access to a mine.
  
  
  
  
  

Most likely yes.

If anybody is grazing cattle or sheep on leased land, they would want to know about abandoned mineshafts so they could keep their animals away. You also want to stay away from active claims in case the owner(s) think you're a claim jumper. And there are people who collect photos of abandoned mines. Looking for crystals or other mineral specimens in the abandoned mine tailings is popular (my mother used to be into that).

So yeah, people might know.

All hypothetical.

 

[sarx]

Searchers surely would have come upon mineshafts, no?

Iirc when looking at the map the mines are nowhere near the campground.

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[carbuff]

What do you think the evidence is pointing at?

I dunno. Sometimes I think it's pointing a particular direction, and then somebody points out more information and I change my mind.

I'm not just on the fence, I'm all over the freakin' map

 

[leilarose68]

Iirc when looking at the map the mines are nowhere near the campground.

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So then it's incredibly unlikely Deorr would've happened upon mineshafts in the time he went missing

 

[4senthia]

Without being specific "who" would it be pointing to?
I'm not pointing towards the parents.
Simply said, I do believe the sheriff when he says he does not believe there was an abduction.
I don't think all media outlets get every statement wrong.
When he said "not at this time" (my remembrance of his words) it seemed he might be searching for answers far away from the campground.
jmo

 

[leilarose68]

--I find it incredibly unlikely a cougar would've taken him and left no blood.

-Unlikely he would've fallen in the water with his boot not found nor clothes snagged.

-mine shafts very far away from campsite.

-random abduction incredibly unlikely with all we know about the site.

Correct me if I'm missing important details here