ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #22

[K.L.Puyallup]

Instructed by his lawyer, perhaps?

Maybe! If it's under the instructions of his lawyer, that might be to prevent him from self-incriminating as an accessory or other involvement in the crime. Given that he seems to know what happened and wasn't forthcoming with that information in the beginning, I can't think of any way he could escape charges unless perhaps through some sort of immunity deal.

 

[Rayemonde]

In the one where they're sitting on the sofa with JM's parents, some I know think she was either crying or pretending to cry. Remember, she doesn't utter one single solitary word throughout the video. But more than that, I swear she was literally huffing, barely able to contain her fury at having to be there, IMO.

Me too, I bet there were some angry words exchanged afterwards. I get the impression she has quite a temper. And I get the impression that she clashed badly with Vilt, too! Jmo.

 

[DatelineFan]

You could be right! And if he's leaving out these details because they are pertinent to the investigation, that's awesome. That would mean to me that what happened at that campsite, the details surrounding Reinwand's last time seeing DeOrr, and what was really happening when DeOrr was announced missing are both known by law enforcement, and important to the investigation.
Reinwand knows what happened up there. I can only hope that he's supplied LE with that information.

In my experience, LE will say something like, "we cannot tell you that you can't talk about this, but your testimony is very important and we really hope you will not talk about this outside of our office in order to protect the integrity of the investigation..."

He likely heard that little spiel repeatedly.

 

[TxJan1971]

In the one where they're sitting on the sofa with JM's parents, some I know think she was either crying or pretending to cry. Remember, she doesn't utter one single solitary word throughout the video. But more than that, I swear she was literally huffing, barely able to contain her fury at having to be there, IMO.

She doesn't really look at anyone talking either, doesn't nod or signal agreement or approval of what anyone says.

And that agrees with what their first PI ultimately 'fessed up to on 1-27-16:

Vilt: It just didn’t add up. It didn’t make sense to me. It didn’t seem like they were like normal people would be for their son being missing. It seemed like they were concealing something and hiding something, and their body language, too. They wouldn’t look you…particularly Jessica, would not look you in the eye. She always looked down, looked away, and even when I tried to go eyeball to eyeball with her when I’d talk to her she would look away and not look me straight in the eye and answer my questions.

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/former-kunz-p-i/

 

[OSpyder]

:waitasec: Did Vilt answer the question up thread about whether Little D was a "surprise" in that interview? Did he say JM's tubes were tied before Deorr or did I totally hear that wrong? Not that it necessarily matters but it kinda stuck out when I listened again just now.

 

[EllieBee]

Yes! Thank you. This is another video where I see an angry/ sulking JM, not a grief-stricken mother or battered woman. I think Vilt pressured them into at least showing their faces for the cameras, but he couldn't convince them to speak. And JM is NOT happy about even doing that much!
I think the same about the "re-enactment" video, where JM is sulking and glaring at the cameras, and the whole family are avoiding the press and don't speak to them.
JMO.

Egads. That look could curdle milk.

 

[TxJan1971]

:waitasec: Did Vilt answer the question up thread about whether Little D was a "surprise" in that interview? Did he say JM's tubes were tied before Deorr or did I totally hear that wrong? Not that it necessarily matters but it kinda stuck out when I listened again just now.

Vilt:
03:31
FV: Well, I feel there’s uh…one possibility is a … scenario is that uh…it’s only because Jessica giving up custody of her other two kids and because she didn’t really want kids, and when she had Deorr that she was …her tubes were tied and for all intents and purposes sterilized so she could never be reversed.
http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/former-kunz-p-i/

 

[OSpyder]

Vilt:
03:31
FV: Well, I feel there’s uh…one possibility is a … scenario is that uh…it’s only because Jessica giving up custody of her other two kids and because she didn’t really want kids, and when she had Deorr that she was …her tubes were tied and for all intents and purposes sterilized so she could never be reversed.
http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/former-kunz-p-i/

Thanks, TxJan1971!

That is what I got out of it too, except my mind went to a friend of mine whose tubes were tied and she just had another baby last week. It was totally unexpected but it happened. That was what made me question it but looking at what he said in words instead of a spoken interview, it makes a little more sense. I think? Lol

 

[Hatfield]

Yep, the EMT bag. I've brought that up in many posts throughout these threads. There is something very hinky about that, and someone close to the first interview wanted it brought up, which it never was - for another reasonable-sounding excuse? Someone wanted "put paid" to that rumor right at the get go, and they got lucky, SB did it for them, IMO, whatever his thought process might have been. I believe the EMT bag was also to be excused, quite reasonably, as having NO part in this. Maybe so, but I have always believed there was something VERY hinky about that. A bag that size could enclose a small child, and it is gone/poof. Where did it go? Where is DeOrr?

Could be wrong, just a thought, and I have no logistical information to add. It's just a TOOOO strange coincidence for me.

Yea. I have never thrown out the EMT bag yet either. When someone brought it up during the interview they avoided the topic altogether.

One thing I have learned with these cases is sometimes these little things like this do end up turning into something. Whenver there is a news interview I always pay attention to what questions are asked because those reporters usually get the scoop first and know what to ask.

It seems far fetched to think that the parents would commit another crime around the same time as the boy going missing but when you stop and think about it then it could make perfect sense. Lets suppose the searchers were moving in the direction to where the boy was hidden and they may have started to panic the searchers would find him. They would also realize a lot of people have eyes on them wherever they go. But not in the woods when searching.

So what better way to move the boys body than to carry in an EMT bag and then even if confronted by someone they could say they were asked to bring it to a searcher or something along those lines.

I think it is very possible it was used to move the body. Which would not bode well for us ever finding him.

Another way to look at it is this.
You have all these nice volunteers showing up to help find the boy. Just the kind of people who would NEVER think to commit a crime like taking an EMT bag from another searcher or emergency person.

The only people who would stoop so low as to steal an EMT bag during an active search for a lost boy would be someone who has done crimes before or is already in doo doo up to their necks. And right now we only know of 2 people that are alleged liars from LE.

 

[12madelyn]

They may not have even known he was that badly injured and just jauntily carried on with their plans as though nothing was wrong. Then when he took a turn for the worse, they panicked.

You just described parents who must have been very high.

 

[charminglane]

It sounds to me like GGP knew that DeOrr was injured, then died. In trying to lend support to VDK's accounts (with VDK placing emphasis on really odd, seemingly unimportant points), GGP actually contradicts VDK. I think VDK was trying to get the idea out there that DeOrr was FAST. Like, look away and he'd be GONE. But, GGP, knowing that DeOrr was injured, (maybe on the way to the campground, just before, or just after arriving) tries to offer up an excuse for how he could have gotten hurt with the "falling all the time" and the "too big boots" comments. Because surely GGP thought, with all the searchers there, that they would likely find DeOrr quickly and see whatever injuries he had, so he was trying to explain that away in advance. But, in doing so, he contradicts what VDK was trying to emphasize about him being fast.

Also, injuries that GGP thought could be explained away as the result of a fall, sound like head injuries, body injuries of the blunt force trauma type. Not asphyxiation, stab wounds, gunshot wounds.

This is off track a little, but I just wondered if perhaps one of them ran him over. VDK talked about the truck a lot. But, I still don't see why they wouldn't call 911 if that were the case. The only reason I can think of that would keep a parent from calling 911 when their child falls victim to a true accident is if they knew they'd get in trouble for some OTHER reason. Something that would be obvious just by the police showing up there. It would have to be something so evident that they would avoid calling the police at all costs. The only things that come to mind are:

1. Drugs.. would have to be an apparent lab or grow operation OR they would have to be undeniably obviously impaired and couldn't hide it.

2. Signs of other trauma on DeOrr that would become evident and not be explained by the accidental injuries he sustained.

What else??

Illegal poaching.

 

[Donjeta]

The following scenario Vilt thought up didn't really make sense to me. The one in which Jessica wanted to cover up an out of state adoption so VDK wouldn't find out. This doesn't seem like the kind of place I would arrange a transfer in. If VDK, IR and GGP weren't in on it it would leave it too much up to chance that everyone takes their eyes off Deorr for four minutes (or whatever). What if Deorr cries when there's a sudden stranger who grabs him and starts getting away asap? If it was a pedophile abductor they mightn't think twice about silencing him quickly any old way but if it's new "parents" they would not necessarily want to start their new parenthood by gagging their kid. It would make more sense to stage an abduction sometime that she's alone with him.

 

[LookingForClues]

Perhaps the EMT bag had medical supplies in it that would be useful to a person or persons who sustained injuries while killing a child who fought back...or sustained injuries while hiding the body of a child.

 

[jnblsm]

Vilt:
03:31
FV: Well, I feel there’s uh…one possibility is a … scenario is that uh…it’s only because Jessica giving up custody of her other two kids and because she didn’t really want kids, and when she had Deorr that she was …her tubes were tied and for all intents and purposes sterilized so she could never be reversed.
http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/former-kunz-p-i/

I took this to mean that she had her tubes tied after her pregnancy with DeOrr.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

 

[neesaki]

Sorry, jumping in here again.

If this had happened it would be an accident - surely normal parents would have reported it, called 999 (in UK) - it isn't something that needed to be covered up FGS.

On the other hand, if the brain trauma was due to abuse from dysfunctional parents then I suppose they could possibly hope
to avoid prosecution by making up some ridiculous 'abduction' story and disposed of their child's body.

I agree, jessie. If it had been an accident any responsible, caring, compassionate person, especially a parent, would have called 911 ( here in US ) and/or rushed him to the ER if they didn't have a phone. Why on earth ignore it? Even if unrealized in the beginning due to inexperience or just not knowing what to watch for, eventually they would have observed something wrong and taken care of him. What reason would there be to hide it if an accident, unless as some have suggested here there was some illegal activity going on surrounding the incident. Or, if it was the result of physical abuse or extreme neglect. jmo

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Just spotted this great article from this week that Claire just posted on the media thread. This quote stood out - Sheriff Bowerman seems totally and utterly sure the parents know more than they're saying:

“We know that the parents aren’t telling the truth, and they know that we know that they’re lying,” Bowerman said. “I know that they know where the little boy is and what happened to him.”


http://www.idahostatejournal.com/me...cle_b4d359f2-0b13-55d2-9aec-178b359a5683.html

 

[Onebest]

I might be in the minority here, because I know there's been a lot of scrutiny around him, but I actually feel that there's a fair amount of quality information Isaac Reinwand supplied in his interview. He did hire counsel pretty quickly, and he is selective about the questions he is willing to answer. But I think the selectiveness and silence speak volumes. Klein stated, "I know for a fact that law enforcement has not asked him to be quiet. They have not put any restrictions on him. Nobody has put any restrictions on him."
Assuming Klein is correct, every time Reinwand elects not to answer a question, that is a careful, intentional, personal choice.

Interviewer: Were you surprised that the parents were named as suspects?
Isaac: Pause-Yeah. Actually. I kinda was. A little bit.
Interviewer: Why is that?
Isaac: It's just, you know, it's just 'cause of all the theories and everything that's been going around, just doesn't feel like, or seem like, anyone knows what's going on.
...
Interviewer: What do you remember, what happened up there?
Isaac: Uh- I would.... I don't wanna comment on that.
Interviewer: Do you remember the last time you saw little DeOrr?
Isaac: Extended Pause I don't, no comment.
Interviewer: Okay. But he was up there?
Isaac: Yes, that, he was.
Interviewer: He was up there, you saw him, you know he was there.
Isaac: Yes.
...
Interviewer:Do you know anything as far as Robert Walton, the grandfather?
Isaac: All I can say about Walt, uh, Robert Walton is he's always been a good friend to me. We've gone fishing, on fishing trips many occasions, camping. So.
Interviewer: And you guys met before all of this took place, right?
Isaac: That's correct.
Interviewer:Are you still friends today?
Isaac:I haven't heard from Walton all winter long.
....
Interviewer:Do you think that this- How has this experience kind of changed your life? Has it?
Isaac: A little. I'm a little bit more, you know, I try to be a little bit more 'skeptimistic' [skeptical] about what's going on around me and the public. Just, people can change in the blink of an eye, and you don't even realize until it's too late.
....
Interviewer:Are Jessica and Deorr your friends? Did you know them before all this?
Isaac: No, I did not.
Interviewer: And so you only really spent a couple hours with them once you got up there.
Isaac: More like a couple days.
Interviewer: A couple days. Alright.
Interview Assistant(?): Where were you when you first heard that someone was missing? Like, were you... What were you doing? And like, what was going through you mind, when you heard that?
Interviewer:Is it fishing?
Isaac: Was I fishing?
Interviewer: Yeah, were you downstream when you heard?
Isaac:Um.... Yeah, I'm not supposed to disclose any information, still. I've been asked not to.
Interviewer: I guess that will all come out in court.
Isaac: Exactly.


I think that when Reinwand speaks about what happened that day, he wants it to be the honest truth. When he's asked a question that could be detrimental to himself of his friends, he chooses not to answer. So I think the key details are in those silences.

-Reinwand had not met Jessica or Vernal before this camping trip.
-DeOrr was at the campsite
-Something happened at the campsite that he doesn't want to talk about
-He doesn't want to talk about the last time he saw DeOrr
-Reinwand will not confirm that he was fishing when he found out that DeOrr was missing.
-Reinwand thinks highly of Robert Walton, and appreciates his friendship, but he hasn't heard from him all Winter. *This could be due to Walton's health issues.
-Reinwand is a little bit surprised that the parents were named as suspects. Not because they didn't do it, but because it doesn't seem like anyone knows what's going on.
-This experience has taught Reinwald to be more skeptical, and to be aware that things can change in the blink of an eye, and by the time you realize it, it's too late.

Sorry cant figure out how to snip for brevity on an ipad but my comment about this and pretty much all the interviews that Nate does is that he doesnt just ask a question, he supplies an answer for the person in the interview to agree with. THAT is not objective reporting! Its leading the conversation! JMO

 

[MBK]

I took this to mean that she had her tubes tied after her pregnancy with DeOrr.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

Most mature and intelligent decision she's made in years, I'm sure.

 

[LaLaw2000]

I have to agree with this. Obviously it's illegal, and irresponsible but I really don't think it's that serious.

It is serious. I was hit by a young driver with no insurance (and plenty of tickets) and had to have 6 surgeries because of the accident that was his fault. I now have a titanium plate with screws in my neck and arthritis in elbows and knees. Thank goodness my B/C paid for my surgeries when I signed an agreement that if I recovered the surgical expenses I would pay them. Of course I never did because he did not have insurance and no money. It cost me money, time, and a great deal of pain I will always have to deal with.

So yes, it is illegal, and it is serious!

 

[Deleted member 718]

Instructed by his lawyer, perhaps?

Yes. I imagine during his interview with Nate that his lawyer was just out of view, and instructing him when not to answer certain questions.

From everything Bowerman has said about Isaac, he's been cooperative even going to the campsite a couple of times with LE. Yes, he hired counsel soon after the incident, but I would do the exact same thing if I was dealing with these parents. He knows something very hinky happened.