Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom, stepfather found* #14

[tresir2012]

I just went back and looked and I had not seen the one she has a swimming suit under a t shirt. Totally different angle too MOO

They look so smug. WTH are they hiding?

 

[squareandrabbet]

Yep. I grew up hearing about jimsonweed, I think because it is toxic to cattle. But I don't think angels trumpet is. I live "mauka" in Hawaii, upslope from the ocean at about 1300 feet, much cooler and more humid so it thrives.

There are so many plants here with folk remedy stories. Angels trumpet is one of them. I've heard the Hawaiians somehow used it as a sea sickness remedy. Nowadays scopolamine is used the treat sea sickness. Go figure.

Fun fact: scopolamine mixed with morphine also used to be the primary anesthesia for women in labor , aka the "Give me drugs!" scene of many a major motion picture cliche. I hear the ladies liked it fine, lol, as long as they could be guaranteed to wake up afterwards. Didn't remember a thing!

 

[jjenny]

Ah ok so the coroner signed the death certificate as she is an EMT. That answers my question in my previous post. Agree about the name for a coroner but it is also a coincidence compared to Lori's profession.

ETA. "Embalmed and interred for close to three weeks" is new info. So was she exhumed earlier than we thought? 3 weeks from burial would be around mid November, approximately when LE first visited the Rexburg apartment and went to the neighbour as Chad and Lori were not in. LE returned a week later on the 26th Nov.

I think the person quoted in the article is incorrect about 3 weeks. Tammy was exhumed in December from what has been reported by numerous sources, not in November.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Since Chad found her "peacefully dying in her sleep" (unlike how they found Alex) I would think it would be more likely a seditive or paralyzing drug was used, something to keep her from fighting back. After the affect takes place maybe place a pillow over her face like somebody suggested upthread. Is there a poison that just lets you slip away peacefully?Alex on the other hand being found the way he was would more likely have been poisoned. Jmo thinking to much

my thinking as well... i think it might have been easy to kill Tammy. What if she was taking some sedative type meds anyway.... easy-peasy. LE must have this info on any meds..if Chad didn't hide them, a doctor would know....

 

[jjenny]

I wonder if any blood or tissue samples were taken initially? It seems ridiculous to me. I hope they can get something from AC's autopsy to give them a clue what to look for.

ETA @holsen I see you have said similar.

I wish. I don't think any samples were taken. Because they wouldn't even need the body if they took blood samples when Tammy died.

 

[tresir2012]

I think the person quoted in the article is incorrect about 3 weeks. Tammy was exhumed in December from what has been reported by numerous sources, not in November.

Maybe they are not correct. I remember her family saying they didn't even know it had happened.

 

[tresir2012]

There are a few plants in Hawaii that are extremely common and you can extract extremely powerful drugs from. One that comes to mind is Angel's trumpet (datura). You can make scopalamine, atropine, and various other drugs from it. One of those is belladona which paralyzes your pupils in the dilated state. It is also a poison.

I have it on my property. One day a few months ago I was working in the yard, mostly weedwhacking and chainsawing. I was wearing safety glasses. I felt a sting in my eye at one point like a bead of sweat got in my eye. My vision in that eye got blurred. I was almost done so I finished up, assuming it was just dirty sweat. I took a shower then looked in the mirror and quickly noticed one pupil was fully dilated and the other was normal. Differential dilation can be a sign of a serious head injury so I was briefly freaked out. I got a flashlight and checked my pupil response and that pupil was unresponsive to light. I vaguely remembered that belladona can do that and wondered if datura did as well. A little googling and I found medical reports about it. So I rinsed my eyes out and waited. It took about two days for everything to return to normal! My exposure would have been incidental because I was not working on a datura plant.

Symptoms of datura poisoning can include very dry throat, loss of balance and coordination, tachycardia, and it can lead to death. Wasn't Tammy coughing (dry throat), fell out of bed....

And here's the fun part - when bees make honey from datura flowers the honey contains the toxic compounds.

The plant is a common source of poisons used for suicide in Europe.

That's just one of literally millions of plant species here that could potentially yield an unusual poison. Given the knowledge of some of our POI's associates in areas like this, they could easily have extracted some novel compound that might not even be tested for.

If Chad (or Lori) was a regular in Hawaii they could easily have gotten ahold of some. It is an extremely common plant and grows wild all over the place.

Same family of plants as our "deadly nightshade". Some history including being used to kill Roman Emperors.

The History of the Deadly Nightshade Plant

 

[jjenny]

Maybe they are not correct. I remember her family saying they didn't even know it had happened.

Didn't know it happened until he (Tammy's father) saw the grave was dug up. I think the claim about 3 weeks is wrong.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

All good questions. I'm not sure if anyone knows the answer. To some extent, some of it (ebooks for books already released) the money will come each month from the various vendors (Amazon, for sure, with several others as possibilities). I'm guessing any new books aren't moving along. Paper books for their backlist have almost surely not been moving since Deseret Book and Seagull dropped them. Possibly one of the sons that are living in their house could be do whatever needs to happen to fill any orders they happened to get for paper books or, depending on how they're set up to distrubte those, it may be outsourced already.

Yes all good questions......... I am surprised we haven't heard more from people around the book publishing, podcasts etc...There must be many opinions of people who worked around Tammy and Chad. With such a sensational case... he could be selling his books like hotcakes right now. Who is taking care of that if so... But someone up-thread got some Amazon data showing virtually no sales. Underneath all of this I just cannot figure out where the money is coming from.......

 

[tresir2012]

Didn't know it happened until he (Tammy's father) saw the grave was dug up.

Here's another link that also confirms it was exhumed two months ago so that three weeks is incorrect it seems. Unless embalming delays composition I don't understand that three weeks quote at all.

 

[tresir2012]

Church on Sunday: So, from their closest LDS church in Princeville (if still there)they are attending the church in Kapaa, 23 miles away.36 minute ride. My opinion from a search on churches and photos of church from below article.

WARD LEADERS SAID REPORTS ABOUT THEM ARE FALSE AND ONE SIDED.
How does the church know that and why do they believe that???? Where is JJ&Tylee?????

Daybells attend church in Hawaii, ABC News obtains beach wedding photos | East Idaho News
Members tell EastIdahoNews.com they approached ward leaders and said media reports about them are false and one-sided. ABC News aired footage of them walking into a church building Sunday.

I think that means Chad and Lori said that to the ward leaders.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

There are a few plants in Hawaii that are extremely common and you can extract extremely powerful drugs from. One that comes to mind is Angel's trumpet (datura). You can make scopalamine, atropine, and various other drugs from it. One of those is belladona which paralyzes your pupils in the dilated state. It is also a poison.

I have it on my property. One day a few months ago I was working in the yard, mostly weedwhacking and chainsawing. I was wearing safety glasses. I felt a sting in my eye at one point like a bead of sweat got in my eye. My vision in that eye got blurred. I was almost done so I finished up, assuming it was just dirty sweat. I took a shower then looked in the mirror and quickly noticed one pupil was fully dilated and the other was normal. Differential dilation can be a sign of a serious head injury so I was briefly freaked out. I got a flashlight and checked my pupil response and that pupil was unresponsive to light. I vaguely remembered that belladona can do that and wondered if datura did as well. A little googling and I found medical reports about it. So I rinsed my eyes out and waited. It took about two days for everything to return to normal! My exposure would have been incidental because I was not working on a datura plant.

Symptoms of datura poisoning can include very dry throat, loss of balance and coordination, tachycardia, and it can lead to death. Wasn't Tammy coughing (dry throat), fell out of bed....

And here's the fun part - when bees make honey from datura flowers the honey contains the toxic compounds.

The plant is a common source of poisons used for suicide in Europe.

That's just one of literally millions of plant species here that could potentially yield an unusual poison. Given the knowledge of some of our POI's associates in areas like this, they could easily have extracted some novel compound that might not even be tested for.

If Chad (or Lori) was a regular in Hawaii they could easily have gotten ahold of some. It is an extremely common plant and grows wild all over the place.

And remember Jonestown....much work goes into "finding the right poisons" to control large groups of people. Maybe Chad had been doing this kind of research for his doomsday projections all along... Didn't LE confiscate computers ?? I am so sure they have so much more data regarding some of these issues we can only question and summize ....

 

[investigatefred]

Didn't know it happened until he (Tammy's father) saw the grave was dug up. I think the claim about 3 weeks is wrong.

Wasn't she exhumed in December, the day before Alex died?

 

[simlyme]

I think that means Chad and Lori said that to the ward leaders.

Yes! I know that now and posted a few posts down from that, with another question.

 

[tresir2012]

Reports about them are false and one sided is what Chad and Lori told ward leaders.

So, presumably, therefore they have nothing to do with 3 deaths, the kids are not missing or in serious danger and they have not abandoned friends and family for an island paradise.

Where are Tylee and JJ then, Chad and Lori?

 

[tresir2012]

Yes! I know that now and posted a few posts down from that, with another question.

Ok, saw that after I posted.

 

[simlyme]

OK, I take that back, BUT, Lori and chad approached ward leaders and said that to the ward leaders, so the ward leaders know what is going on, right? Still, what do the ward leaders think about that and do they believe lori and chad???

This is what I said after I realized I was mistaken. @tresir2012

 

[indicolite22]

A 15-minute clip from "True Crime Live" with Mike Galanos on HLN contains an interview with a mental health professional, who sees Chad as the mini-cult leader and Lori as his follower:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=491514571521577

 

[Tortoise]

I suppose I hope this could be what happens. But then he has a lot of explaining to do to his children, Tammy’s family, and other family and friends. Depending on how much he knew, or even participated in whatever has happened to the many victims, I don’t see how that happens. Plus, he may be a threat to whoever else might have committed atrocities, and he would know what they are capable of doing. MHO.

If he did bolt for home leaving Lori in Hawaii, with the aim of getting off the hook as regards Tammy's death and complicity in the other deaths and disappearances, (not saying the police would do as he hopes) I think he would have to divulge everything about Lori and her associates in crime and say he found out since he married her, so that police could afford him witness protection. I think he'd have to offer proof of the crimes they committed, they're not going to make arrests based on his word.

He still wouldn't know if police would continue to go after him for Tammy's death but 'I'm the fall guy' would be his only hope at this stage. That way they get to pit Chad against Lori in court. I'm mindful of the fact that he has time to come up with (fabricate) explanations for everything since he is on the inside and has that advantage.

Lori, plus living under clouds of suspicion, being stalked by media, being talked about worldwide on the net in unfavorable light, and not being able to live a normal life with his kids and grandkids, can't be feeling as attractive a prospect as it once did, at this point. It's sexual infatuation and new clothes versus his life and survival on the plate. Who can cope with this much adrenaline in their daily life?

He'd have to really hope that police haven't gathered any incriminating evidence against him from his electronic devices or otherwise, on the

- children's disappearances/deaths,
- foreknowledge of wedding and travel plans,
- Tammy's death and the masked man incident,
- Alex's death,
- the attempted murder of BB and
- Charles' murder.

It might not be possible. He might be in too deep. Others may have proof against him. But he might be that sociopathic and of invincible mindset that he tries. Hopefully it would bring forth information on the children to those who love them.

speculation and moo

 

[Tortoise]

Hopefully police have been able to swab the couch/mattress/carpet where Tammy died, for saliva, sweat or vomit. It's a long shot but who knows what could show up, even sedatives. I will say smothering is unlikely unless she was sedated because she would have struggled and I'm sure she would have had mouth, nose and finger injuries from fighting for her life.

moo