IL IL - Debbie Fijan, 10, DuPage County, 11 Feb 1966 - #2

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  • #61
I forgot to post these two last night and wanted to before I forgot. Nothing big but a bit more info.

Daily Herald (Chicago) Sept. 1, 1955

This was a big ad in the paper: "Auction Sale".

JS said that since his boys had been called to the army and he was busy with his job as road commissioner he had to put up to public auction his 23 herd of dairy cattle.


Daily Herald (Chicago) June 30, 1944

The Schofields of Cloverdale announced the arrival of their son. This had to be their youngest.
 
  • #62
Jmo, I think unless we can tie any allegations or convictions of abuse by priests to the years LS attended grammer school or high school and at those schools, -or- we find evidence he was in attendence in college with any of the accused or convicted priests, this avenue is going to be a long shot.

There could have been any number of 'troubles' Hopf meant by LS' 'past life'.
 
  • #63
I ran into an excerpt of one of the Chicago Tribune articles last night, a snippet from one of the main articles we've seen dozens of times, with a little information regarding the questions from LS's defense.

I'm not sure if I am seeing this out of context being unable to read the entire article, but I caught a snippet that read like LS's defense team asked or commented DuPage couldn't prove this crime occured within DuPage county.

I'll try to find it again, but it struck me as odd. What would the point of arguing the murder itself might not have occured in DuPage county, while Debbies body was found in DuPage county?
 
  • #64
A few more thoughts regarding both ROM and LS have occured to me.

Macek first.

There is an older motel very close to where Debbie went to school, on North Ave. just a little east of St. Charles Rd. (Debbies school on St. Charles road is very close to where it intersects with North Ave.)

The motel is named Du Wayne Motel. Built about the late 1940's.
It occured to me, since ROM later stalked his victims at motels, I wonder if he started lurking around them when he was younger and had any previous crimes around/near motels in the 60's.

This motel is actually closer to Benjamin school than Debbies home.


google map searching the motel name.

When you look at this following link in the small map top right, the two small ponds just above the word North, in North Ave are the Sidwell pond ( one to the left ) which were searched for the weapon used in Debbies murder. This should give readers an idea of the proximity of the motel and the school.

http://maps.google.com/maps/place?h...l&hnear=carol+stream&cid=18211135666291867981
 
  • #65
Now back to thoughts on LS.

Earlier reports indicate a 3rd grade teacher at the schools husband saw Debbie, or a young girl matching Debbies description, talking to a man in a white car about a half block from the school. According to newspaper accounts the husband reports this happening about 5:15, his wife, the teacher, reports this sometime after 5:00 pm.

At 5:35 when the janitor left he saw no one around. He was the last to leave the school that evening after he locked up.

I would like to know if the 3rd grade teacher reported LS left before or after she did that day. Was she the last teacher to leave that day? or did she know other teachers were still at the school, and if so which ones?

If newspaper articles are accurate... and LS claimed to have seen Debbie on the swing at 5:20, it is likely he and the janitor were the last two to leave school that day.

Another thought.

LS would have had to leave prior to 5:35 pm... he would have arrived at his dads home no later than 5:35-5:40. It is only a 5 min drive from the school to the farm-if that. He would have been home at his house on Gary, in approximately 12 minutes, so he should have arrived no later than 5:45.

If Debbie was still walking home when LS left, there is NO WAY he would not have seen her... and told police something along the lines of: I saw Debbie about 50' from the intersection of St. Charles and Fair Oaks, or I saw Debbie about 3 houses from St. Charles on Fair Oaks. Then either his parents or wife would have confirmed an actual time he arrived home.

Was LS's time ever accounted for between 5:30pm and 6:00pm? the neighbor, saw the Schofied family car in the driveway at 6pm. (Media never reported if it was LS's or JS's car seen at 6pm).

No, LS's time was never accounted for... he gave LE a cockamamy story about his route and checking the roads. for which we don't necessarily even know WHY he would be checking the roads. It was a friday, no road work likely that weekend... it was winter, road construction season hadn't started yet. There was no big snow fall that plows would have been out. Let's just suppose LS was checking for pot holes.. he would have told LE so.... AND if by chance there were pot holes so bad that needed fixing Sat am, the township should have had record of that working being done. Not to mention it is unlikely the township would have repaired a rarely traveled rural road on a weekend 44 years ago. They don't do it now, they certainly didn't rush to fix pot holes 40 plus years ago.

Let's just for a moment suppose that the car the neighbor saw in the drive way was in fact LS's and not his dads. That still gives him approximately 40 minutes to have picked up Debbie and murder her. More than enough time for a grown man to murder a 10 year old girl.

I think it is unlikely that NO one saw or heard anything suspicous. A dark rural area.... with no street lights, someone would have seen car lights... the homes on both Fair Oaks and Klein, at least now, are not so far from the road someone wouldn't notice car lights. I imagine at the time, the area was rural enough and houses were spaced enough people did not draw their drapes or window coverings once it got dark out. The neighbors homes were simply not close enough to make that necessary.

I would like to know if the residents who lived on both Fair Oaks and Klein Roads, the two likely routes LS would have driven home that night were ever interviewed by LE if they saw or heard anything suspicious.
 
  • #66
IF LS took Fair Oaks it is almost unlikely that he and Debbies mom would have not crossed paths on Fair Oaks ... They only way that would have been possible for them to miss each other, is if LS was already at his dads when Debbies mom left to pick up Debbie.

Fair Oaks is a narrow road... a little narrower than the standard side streets around here and there is no shoulder. A driver would be very aware of oncoming traffic because there simply is not enough room to not be, even in a smaller mid size car. Cars in the 60's were much bigger than they are today.
 
  • #67
And yet another thought about LS.

LS asked if truth serum would help him after he failed 6 polygraphs. We know polygraphs aren't 100 percent, so for just a moment let's give LS the benefit of the doubt on failing those 6 poly's.

Knowing LS asked how he could help himself, and that LE had plaster casts of the tire tracks where Debbie's body was found, and found matching tracks where it appeared she entered someones car.
Did LE ever ask to cast LS's tires? Did they ever cast LS's tires?
Did LE ever check to see if LS had replaced the tires on his car shortly after Debbies murder?
If he did, did they ever find the old tires he had replaced?

Comparing casts of tires seems like a way they would have eliminated LS back then....
 
  • #68
Jmo, I think unless we can tie any allegations or convictions of abuse by priests to the years LS attended grammer school or high school and at those schools, -or- we find evidence he was in attendence in college with any of the accused or convicted priests, this avenue is going to be a long shot.

There could have been any number of 'troubles' Hopf meant by LS' 'past life'.

My main goal in pursuing this angle (among others) is to see if LS himself had been in trouble. I don't know if one path will lead me to the other but I'll give it a shot regardless. :)
 
  • #69
A couple of my own thoughts in regard to LS (or someone else) getting around. Considering this was farmland at the time, could there have been other "roads" (dirt tracks, really) that someone familiar with the area (like LS) could have used to avoid being seen?
Another thing...If the teacher's husband picked her up regularly, I would think he might already be familiar with LS's vehicle. I'm curious as to why he couldnt definitely identify the car as belonging to LS or not (unless he didnt regularly pick his wife up).
 
  • #70
<snipped> Let's just for a moment suppose that the car the neighbor saw in the drive way was in fact LS's and not his dads. That still gives him approximately 40 minutes to have picked up Debbie and murder her. More than enough time for a grown man to murder a 10 year old girl.

I think it is unlikely that NO one saw or heard anything suspicous. A dark rural area.... with no street lights, someone would have seen car lights... the homes on both Fair Oaks and Klein, at least now, are not so far from the road someone wouldn't notice car lights. I imagine at the time, the area was rural enough and houses were spaced enough people did not draw their drapes or window coverings once it got dark out. The neighbors homes were simply not close enough to make that necessary.

Its possible that the car was LSs...If his parents weren't at home, maybe this is where the murder occurred. Or even if they were, and didnt know what LS was up to.
Debbie may have been choked into unconsciousness, then LS would have had time to make up a story about needing to be somewhere on the farm. Its not likely his parents would have watched hiom get out of the car.

We've read that Debbie may have been alive for a few hours after the attack, but we have no idea where she was in that time. She may not have been dumped immediately. She was missing some 5 or more hours (5:30 to 10:30, 11) so, if she were alive after the attack...There's still a couple of hours unaccounted for.
And I'm not liking the thought of that.......
 
  • #71
Thanks Shadow. I keep thinking back to LS going back to the school and burning the 🤬🤬🤬🤬. I could be wrong, but I think he would have had to dump Debbies body before then if he was responsible for her murder. He wouldn't risk being found at the school with Debbies body in his car.... He knew people were out searching while he was burning that 🤬🤬🤬🤬.

I don't know if it was ever released what times LS was back at the school.

I also don't know if the area Debbie was found was searched prior to her being found, indicating she wasn't where she was found for several hours arleady. IIRC LisaW posted that much of the search for Debbie focused on the area closer to the school. I imagine much of the search was between the school and Debbies home before venturing outward.
 
  • #72
It's kind of perplexing why LS wasn't seen at the school Friday evening while the search was going on if he was in fact at the school burning 🤬🤬🤬🤬.
 
  • #73
  • #74
respectfully clipped: I would like to know if the 3rd grade teacher reported LS left before or after she did that day. Was she the last teacher to leave that day? or did she know other teachers were still at the school, and if so which ones?

That is an excellent point. I wonder how we can find out. That would be invauable to our timeline.
 
  • #75
Having grown up in this area, I hung out with some Schofields in HS. I recently found them on FB. they don't spell the surname the same way, they spell it without the H.

I'd be willing to share a little more info with Abbey5 (since she has the ancestry membership) via PM to research whether or not this S family is a relation to LS's family and perhaps changed the spelling of the surname if anyone thinks it would help.

If so and they were related to LS, I think they would be willing to answer some questions for me. If not, nothing lost... we move onto the next avenue to research.

Just thought I would toss this out there.
 
  • #76
Having grown up in this area, I hung out with some Schofields in HS. I recently found them on FB. they don't spell the surname the same way, they spell it without the H.

I'd be willing to share a little more info with Abbey5 (since she has the ancestry membership) via PM to research whether or not this S family is a relation to LS's family and perhaps changed the spelling of the surname if anyone thinks it would help.

If so and they were related to LS, I think they would be willing to answer some questions for me. If not, nothing lost... we move onto the next avenue to research.

Just thought I would toss this out there.

I can give it a shot but I would need to know a bit of info. considering the latest census is 1930.
 
  • #77
thanks Abbey. This may take a little more work/research on my end. I don't even know thieir fathers name..... so let me think about this, look at it a bit more. It might be more than a stretch to think they are related if it takes too much time to research. Especially if the surnames are spelled differently.
 
  • #78
I heard back from the detective handling Debbies case!

:woohoo: :woohoo:

He was very kind and apologized for the delay in replying back to my email sooner. Said he was on vacation and is now catching up and is involved in a trial. He also mentioned he has not yet spoken with Debbies brother a second time and still has to finish reviewing Debbies file as he is new to the case.

He is interested in reviewing and possibly further discussing the info we uncovered regarding Macek and Sally Kandels murder once he is caught up and of course speaks with Debbies brother first.

so things are progressing! even if slowly.

I replied letting him know in my initial email, I had forgotten to mention Sally was only 14 and most, not all, but most of Maceks victims had bite marks which tied him to those cases. and that Macek was known as the 'mad biter'. I didn't get into all we found, just the facts we found.

Hopefully we will be getting some feedback about the progression of Debbies case in the upcoming weeks!

This would also explain why Debbies brother has not posted again in a bit as he has not yet had any news to share here.
 
  • #79
That's great news. It's heartening to know that someone in a capacity to investigate the information we have uncovered is actually paying attention.
 
  • #80
That's great...I'm glad he responded to your email.
 
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