Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #122

[MistyWaters]

what does TOS stand for?

Terms of Service (aka The Rules). IIRC it can also be found on the Main Page of the forum.

 

[Andreee]

Terms of Service (aka The Rules). IIRC it can be found on the Main Page of the forum.

thanks, I had often wondered what it stood for and couldn't find the reference for some reason.

 

[MistyWaters]

thanks, I had often wondered what it stood for and couldn't find the reference for some reason.

Yeah I know what you mean, many abbreviations escape me as well.

 

[Charlot123]

Ives left again? link?

If I am not mistaken, he returned shortly after the 2019 April PC. I would not be able to find a link because it was discussed at threads here, likewise, when he left. Again it was discussed in these threads as some bureaucratic issues.

If I run into it, I shall post.

 

[pearl]

Let us please follow TOS. I have noticed several admin postings in the last few days. We do not want this thread closed again. For new members not with us at the time, Abby and Libby's thread was closed for about a month earlier in this year because some posters ignored repeated admin warnings about ignoring TOS guidelines.

 

[Peppersmom]

The neighboring school is called the Cougars. I can see a cat and a paw print and their colors are blue and white.

 

[Peppersmom]

Oops. I read the rules and an trying to remove screenshot but it won't let me. I will know better next time. Sorry

 

[scruffydog]

I

Fox59 also had an article regarding the eye color on the first sketch:
Police release sketch of man accused of murdering Delphi teens Liberty German and Abigai

Fox59 also had an article regarding the eye color on the first sketch:
Police release sketch of man accused of murdering Delphi teens Liberty German and Abigail Williams

I still think that the eye color statement was very very strange. To know that the eye color was not blue, you must have looked at their eyes. So what are you trying to say here?

 

[Awsi Dooger]

I don't believe they did not know how close they were to Abbey's house. These girls were 13 and 14 and had to know this IMO. Abby was not supposed to be on the bridge yet she was on there and photographed by Libby.

I could see it. As the generations have progressed within my family I've long noted how some youngsters are immediately in tune with direction and distance, while others not at all. It is seemingly not related to intelligence. I think lots of kids just jump into the back of a car and inherit a ride...wherever it is going...and then step right out with no ability to recreate or describe the route they just took. That tendency is even more pronounced and logical in this era with the phone face tendencies from an early age.

Besides, the reference points are not obvious or logical on that trail and especially on the bridge itself. Tree cover everywhere. Tons of weaving angles -- like the creek itself -- instead of square to square. Very isolated. Nothing in the background. It's not as if you are crossing the bridge with a huge landmark in the background to gauge exactly where you are.

Basically it's enter and exit, whether it's the Freedom Bridge area or the Mears lot. I think lots of Delphi adults would struggle to pinpoint where they were, if asked to point to something -- like the Carroll County Courthouse -- from the end of that bridge.

However, if Abby and Libby had dashed into those yards beyond the bridge I think they would have quickly figured it out. They would recognize the homes and yards based on often seeing from the other side along the road. It would be a case of, "Hey, I know where we are."

Then they either call Derrick and change the pickup point, or call if off completely and giggle all the way to Abby's home.

 

[Charlot123]

Someone else and I started an exchange about cops. Not cops as killers, but bad cops, and he said they were weeding out the bad seeds, I believe, (post #1066 and post #1068) and I said they weren't weeding them out well enough or fast enough. (I can't say why I said that here.)
Then I switched to referring to doctors, because of a discussion I had with a friend about a surgeon a long time ago. The one she referred to was married to a friend, they had more than three children, he was into kinky things and other sex partners and he expected his wife to put up with everything. I mentioned a 'God complex' , and someone here was righteously indignant, I believe. I apologized. (A 'god complex' has many explanations if you do an internet search. Doctors and psychological magazines, professional websites, etc.)
Do I think it was a doctor? I think it could have been anybody with any profession or no profession on God's green earth. The reason I brought up a doctor was because they said people were going to be 'shocked' or 'stunned' when the truth came out. That would be the profession that would shock me. That and the governor. Now that I think about it, I'd also be shocked if the killer was the age of the girls or younger. That would stun the hell out of me based on the viciousness of the crime. But that voice doesn't sound like a young voice, unless it's distorted by the microphone on the phone.

“Distorted” is one of the explanations we might be missing. I am always looking for something simple, that leads us all astray. Like, “voice”, “not that of a kid”. And why do we assume so?

It seems true that male voices become more “cracked” with age. Is it because of smoking, or maybe long-term effects of testosterone, or something else?

But I have seen smokers who started at 8. So by 20, it could be minimum 12 pack/years, slightly less that needed for emphysema, but maybe, enough for such voice?

Also, BG could have been sick. On some shots it seems like he has some kind of a breathing device sticking out of the mouth, at least I see something odd connected to it, so maybe, if he was really holding something between the lips, that stuff changed his voice?

You know what that tube in his mouth reminds me of? A short blowgun, you could use it for anything, including darts...JMO

 

[sunshineray]

February 2020

ISP: 'One piece away' from solving Delphi homicides

"...He wants you to remember the two sketches are not photographs.

"I believe that eventually, we are going to be able to say this person's the killer, and there's a combination of those two images that will land on his face, whatever that might look like," Carter explained...."

I find it harder and maddeningly harder to understand why the ISP's website info for the Delphi murders and the FBI's website page both no longer display that first released sketch and yet ISP top officer still references it.

ISP came out on April 24, 2019, days after the 2 year press conference and stated the two sketches were NOT the same man. They also stated the new sketch more accurately represents the man in Libby's video.

Then ISP Carter also says this in that same article Feb 2020 interview..."I can't think of a time in my entire career, or in many other careers, where we have the voice of the person we believe is the killer, a photograph of who we believe is connected to the murder, and even a snip-it of how he moves," said Carter.

I'm seeing a change in description, BBM, in that statement that if thought upon for too long could lead one to believe he's talking about two people. So one person's image and another person's voice? Why not just continue with the phasing..."is the killer" vs. changing it to "who we believe is connected to the murder", a much milder description.

I don't know why but this just bothers me and makes me think there's so much we really don't realize about what happened that day.

ISP Carter also mentions LE, "...will do everything within our power, and within the parameters of law...". "within the parameters of the law".... and then he also repeats, "Somebody knows. Somebody knows."

I unfortunately think LE's hands are tied and they're at a huge impasse. Just some thoughts and I know it's rehashing a bit. AJMO

 

[Awsi Dooger]

I don't trust Tobe Leazenby. I think he's overly simplistic local cop and that causes him not to be able to see more than 3 blocks in any direction from his office. He's convinced the killer has to be local, and using the strictest definition of local. Since he can't figure it out after 3 years he allows himself to fall into traps like rationalizing it might be multiple perpetrators.

The recent local article indicated that they have conducted polygraphs. Yikes. We've gone from hopes of CeCe Moore deciphering a genealogical family tree to the reality of Tobe Leazenby dishing out polygraphs to a selection of local creeps. I can just picture Leazenby with a few polygraph results he's not fully satisfied with, and using that sample to debate toward the killer.

I hope the FBI and others step in to make sure that if there is an arrest in this case it is consensus driven and evidence driven, instead of Tobe Leazenby relying on his gut and his faith and his impatience.

 

[JnRyan]

I don't trust Tobe Leazenby. I think he's overly simplistic local cop and that causes him not to be able to see more than 3 blocks in any direction from his office. He's convinced the killer has to be local, and using the strictest definition of local. Since he can't figure it out after 3 years he allows himself to fall into traps like rationalizing it might be multiple perpetrators.

The recent local article indicated that they have conducted polygraphs. Yikes. We've gone from hopes of CeCe Moore deciphering a genealogical family tree to the reality of Tobe Leazenby dishing out polygraphs to a selection of local creeps. I can just picture Leazenby with a few polygraph results he's not fully satisfied with, and using that sample to debate toward the killer.

I hope the FBI and others step in to make sure that if there is an arrest in this case it is consensus driven and evidence driven, instead of Tobe Leazenby relying on his gut and his faith and his impatience.

I sort feel the same way except I wouldn't say I don't trust him. I believe his approach to a murder would work with 99% of the murders one would expect in his jurisdiction. However, this isn't your typical Carroll County crime. And trying to overlay your typical local crime procedure onto this case isn't going to work. By the time he realized he was over his head it was too late. Yes, I know he called in ISP and FBI, but how long did his staff muddle around with this crime scene just like they would with any other Carroll County crime? For so long I believe they thought this crime was going to be solved within a a couple of weeks using the usual techniques going after the usual suspects.

Maybe we are saying the same thing, just a different way.

 

[California Sunset]

Just wondering, are you aware the population of Delphi is less than 3000?

Are you from that area? I wondered, because since you know the population, do you know if the people all pretty much know everyone else and the town area is all within walking distance or if it's more spread out?

 

[California Sunset]

“Distorted” is one of the explanations we might be missing. I am always looking for something simple, that leads us all astray. Like, “voice”, “not that of a kid”. And why do we assume so?

It seems true that male voices become more “cracked” with age. Is it because of smoking, or maybe long-term effects of testosterone, or something else?

But I have seen smokers who started at 8. So by 20, it could be minimum 12 pack/years, slightly less that needed for emphysema, but maybe, enough for such voice?

Also, BG could have been sick. On some shots it seems like he has some kind of a breathing device sticking out of the mouth, at least I see something odd connected to it, so maybe, if he was really holding something between the lips, that stuff changed his voice?

You know what that tube in his mouth reminds me of? A short blowgun, you could use it for anything, including darts...JMO

I can't see what you're seeing, and others have said something similar, could it be one of those vaping things? An e-cigarette or whatever they are? I've only seen these things in commercials or on TV.
Ah, that's another thing. A pea shooter. Is that what you meant? Something like that?
Someone said they thought it was a headset. That's something else I'm clueless about.

 

[tresir2012]

I hesitate to say this but are LE positive BG is the killer? What if he just walked on and the girls recorded someone else's voice and the ensuing crime? Why can't they be more detailed about what they have on the recording and how long it is? Why can't they show more video or audio?

 

[tresir2012]

One of the first things LE did was check all sex offenders so this had to be a sexual attack IMO. We need some more info about the crime scene and the DNA that they have. Has everyone known to be on the trails that day given DNA, fingerprints and footprints? What about a voluntary DNA drive?

 

[tresir2012]

The neighboring school is called the Cougars. I can see a cat and a paw print and their colors are blue and white.

What does this mean? I do not see any relevance to this case.

 

[tresir2012]

I'm new here, but someone on reddit suggest I post this here. I enhanced the brightness of the photo, after going frame by frame. Does anyone else think he is wearing a graphic ringer shirt?

Well you would have to explain what a graphic thingy is first. Enhanced pics are not allowed unless they are from official sources eg. MSM or LE.

 

[tresir2012]

Here's where I get into trouble for not researching before I post. There is a law in effect, I don't know if it's federal or state, or if it's in effect in Indiana if it is state, but if you participate in a homicide, you are guilty of the homicide because you were there when it took place. So, in some cases, even if you didn't kill the person, you are charged with murder also. Who's going to clarify this and correct me?

Nobody. You need to post a link yourself before stating any facts.