Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #143

[Yemelyan]

It's so crazy to me that they wouldn't have DNA with such a quick and vicious crime. The person who did this knew he could be discovered at any time so wouldn't have lingered.

JMO, but there's a difference between "we found zero DNA from the perpetrator at this crime scene" and "there was DNA but it was present in a mix of other contributors to the extent that it is not amenable to analysis under current techniques."

Because in the first scenario you find yourself asking "how did this mastermind criminal eliminate all traces of his DNA from the scene?" Which seems almost impossible. But in the second scenario you realize that he could just be very lucky. Perhaps a victim had his DNA under her fingernails but the DNA of the victim's sibling and even another person was also present. Perhaps some of his touch DNA was on a sweatshirt of one of the victims but that sweatshirt had previously been worn by many high school friends whose DNA was on it too. The power of many probabilistic genotyping programs decreases greatly when either 1. There are more than three contributors or 2. The analyst cannot make a good assumption about how many contributors there were. In my opinion only.

 

[TL4S]

So KAK admits to CSAM during his interview/polygraph on Feb. 25, 2017. He is allowed to remain free for nearly 3 1/2 years before finally getting arrested in Aug. 2020. He sits in jail for over a year, pleads to his charges, and has a pre-trial conference date set. THEN, after all that time and only 10 days prior to his scheduled pre-trial conference, LE gives MP the heads up that they are going to make an announcement. Late-evening, they broadcast a request asking for information regarding the "creator" of the a_shots account (which they've known about since Feb. 2017). It's all very odd.

The very foundation of that a_shots account is built on a lie. KAK's fb is full of lies. Some of his comments have been seemingly inconsistent. Therefore, we don't believe much of what KAK says, which is probably justified. But IMO, those lies are mostly to inflate his online persona. During his interview and polygraph, according to the affidavit, he folded pretty quickly and opened up about his CSAM activity.

But then we have him wiping the iPhone5 clean before turning it in to LE. After the murders, and before they left for Vegas, he easily could have wiped all his devices. He obviously thought he was f'ed already, so why not try to cover his tracks? Instead, he waits until after his polygraph, when he supposedly finds his iPhone5 just sitting on the counter, and suddenly feels the need to delete everything on that singular device.

Next, we have this jailhouse interview where he's jabbering away without a lawyer's representation. He talks about his version of what LE have told him, including that he was the last person to talk to L. This is released publicly. Then we have the talk about his father, which we only find out about because of a presumable "error" in filing. But lo and behold, there it is - what has seemed like an obvious scenario to me since the a_shots/KAK story first broke - Dad did it.

Maybe KAK isn't lying about what LE has told him. These things might deflect from him and his CSAM a bit, but attempting to give his father an alibi while saying LE is trying to pin the murders on his father does absolutely nothing for his own reputation or case. IMO. A case, which remember, took over 3 years to arrest him for. And maybe there are more clues here than we think and we really don't need to take KAK's word for anything.

What if his father really was at the trail on Feb. 13, 2017? And what if he had a younger friend along, who had reddish-brown hair? How did the iPhone5 get missed by police but then show up magically while KAK was away at his polygraph and his dad was at home? Who's idea was it to wipe the phone? I noted that KAK's other phone, the Samsung, was used while they were in Vegas. Where was the iPhone5 then? And with KAK not working, why was his dad okay paying the bill on all these multiple devices?

A_shots was traced back, through subpoenas, to the Peru address. Two people live there. Two people had access. Either one of them might have shared information with countless other people. Jmo. I feel like the 3 years of KAK remaining free gave time for LE to watch him. He's arrested, and then they have over another year to watch his father. Then there's a second raid at the Peru house, the a_shots ask, a flurry of LE interviews, and the BM/KAK interview. HMM...........

ETA: Sorry for being long-winded and rambling, again.

 

[acutename]

Most interesting parts for me:

BM asked KAK if he remembered communicating with Kelsi German the evening the girls went missing. (He said no and she moved on.)

BM said the only person who would have had access to his electronics/accounts was his dad, so it is possible his dad was using the account.

BM said ISP told him they know his father did it and if he told them what he knew his charges would go away.

his 5th phone magically appeared
he was a 'bounty hunter" but not really because he never paid taxes
does not know why he did most things he did

he says over and over that he is an "only child."
he must be impossible to interview, IMO

 

[acutename]

is the Monan Bridge Deer Creek area part of a legal deer hunting area? KAK also says in his interview that he was not familiar with Delphi but that his father hunter deer.

 

[ShamelessObserver]

What do people make of ‘they told me they know my Dad did it’?

they must have some decent evidence to say that to him

 

[mekeritrig]

One thing that came to my mind about the Barbara MacDonald interview with KAK is that when KAK spoke about his dad's schedule he said that his dad doesn't work on Mondays and also that he works third shifts. When ISP put out their video and request for info about the Anthony_shots account last December a lot of people were perplexed about why they released it at 9:30pm on a Monday night.

If LE was seeking to put out info which they wanted TK to see, it seems like that would be the ideal time that they would know he was awake and not working. I might be just grasping at straws with that line of thought but it's something I was thinking about since reading the KAK interview transcript. JMO

 

[TL4S]

One thing that came to my mind about the Barbara MacDonald interview with KAK is that when KAK spoke about his dad's schedule he said that his dad doesn't work on Mondays and also that he works third shifts. When ISP put out their video and request for info about the Anthony_shots account last December a lot of people were perplexed about why they released it at 9:30pm on a Monday night.

If LE was seeking to put out info which they wanted TK to see, it seems like that would be the ideal time that they would know he was awake and not working. I might be just grasping at straws with that line of thought but it's something I was thinking about since reading the KAK interview transcript. JMO

I think that's very observant. Not to mention it also leaves him unoccupied during the day and time of the murders.

 

[TL4S]

is the Monan Bridge Deer Creek area part of a legal deer hunting area? KAK also says in his interview that he was not familiar with Delphi but that his father hunter deer.

I'm not sure about the bridge area, but the land surrounding it would be private property. Deer season wasn't open in February, but it did make me curious when BMc asked KAK if his dad knew RL. I wondered, perhaps, if TK (JAK) might have asked permission to hunt on RL's land. Just a random thought.

 

[acutename]

One thing that came to my mind about the Barbara MacDonald interview with KAK is that when KAK spoke about his dad's schedule he said that his dad doesn't work on Mondays and also that he works third shifts. When ISP put out their video and request for info about the Anthony_shots account last December a lot of people were perplexed about why they released it at 9:30pm on a Monday night.

If LE was seeking to put out info which they wanted TK to see, it seems like that would be the ideal time that they would know he was awake and not working. I might be just grasping at straws with that line of thought but it's something I was thinking about since reading the KAK interview transcript. JMO

I think it is weird that KAK knows EXACTLY what he was doing on a Monday night so long ago unless he either without-out-fail-watched PPV TV every Monday night for years, or he was questioned back in time and recalls what he said years ago. Maybe most people anywhere near that area know what they were doing that night because it was an event but we have had people in this forum say that they have relatives in IN who have never heard of this crime-- so...I still find it interesting. IMO.

 

[dotr]

I stumbled upon a case on my YT feed the other day, (sorry can’t remember the specific case, it might have been on Crime Watch Daily), I’ll try to remember because I was reminded of Abby’s and Libby’s case a few times as far as the investigation.

Long story short, a girl was found dead in a field, sexual assault, and the case had gone cold for some time. LE decided to release something much later not previously revealed to the public, re: underwear being found at the scene, and/or the victim(s) strangled with (someone else’s) underwear, and this broke the case wide open.

This tip led to that break because the girlfriend of the killer found underwear in her boyfriend’s truck and was suspicious enough to report it after hearing this new information. A sharp detective was going back on old tips and noticed the mention of “underwear” which immediately flagged his attention. Had this new detail not been revealed, the woman would not have called in.

Point is, we know there could be obvious benefits of crime scene details being revealed, as demonstrated above; however after thinking about this some more, it has occurred to me that IF LE has absolutely nothing, no DNA, then their only hope of absolutely knowing they have the right person may rest on holding back these details. Of course, obviously it’s a double-edged sword, because that may prevent them from getting a specific tip to begin with - It could trigger a tip, or could hurt them in the long run.

I feel somewhat, good, to really come to this conclusion at this stage five years later and truly understand the importance of how imperative it may be to keep details close to the vest, despite the benefits it MAY provide. But again, double edged sword.

—

eta:
I’m remembering more about the case, girl abducted from her friend’s couch on a sleepover after going to a casino. They had a sketch because a previous victim was raped on a college campus parking lot but let go, one of two victims iirc, and came forward afterwards to provide a sketch, and in this case iirc they were able to match the DNA.

o/t Wondering if you are referring to this case?
Murder of Brianna Denison - Wikipedia
Brianna Dennison 19yo Reno NV #9 | Page 29 (websleuths.com)

 

[Prime8]

Only of they ordered it through their cable provider, which in 2017 is pretty unlikely, given the WWE Network offered the event for only 9.99 per monthly subscription.

My point was that TV isn't an alibi.

 

[minazoe]

I think it is weird that KAK knows EXACTLY what he was doing on a Monday night so long ago unless he either without-out-fail-watched PPV TV every Monday night for years, or he was questioned back in time and recalls what he said years ago. Maybe most people anywhere near that area know what they were doing that night because it was an event but we have had people in this forum say that they have relatives in IN who have never heard of this crime-- so...I still find it interesting. IMO.

Couldn't her remember because A&L were all over the news? I mean I remember what I was doing when Diana was killed etc...mOO

 

[MistyWaters]

Couldn't her remember because A&L were all over the news? I mean I remember what I was doing when Diana was killed etc...mOO

I think it’s unusual because if he was watching PPV then he wouldn’t have seen the news. I don’t believe anything he says.

 

[Prime8]

I think it is weird that KAK knows EXACTLY what he was doing on a Monday night so long ago unless he either without-out-fail-watched PPV TV every Monday night for years, or he was questioned back in time and recalls what he said years ago. Maybe most people anywhere near that area know what they were doing that night because it was an event but we have had people in this forum say that they have relatives in IN who have never heard of this crime-- so...I still find it interesting. IMO.

You're right. At first I was thinking that since it was so close to the warrant being executed, that could solidify the memory in his head. But I would be hard pressed to tell you what I did 11 days ago. However, I may be able to piece it together through texts (it if he and his dad were texting about watching wrestling, errands, etc.).

 

[acutename]

Couldn't her remember because A&L were all over the news? I mean I remember what I was doing when Diana was killed etc...mOO

maybe- I have no idea what I was doing when Diana was killed... He presumably has been questioned a lot so maybe he has unearthed memories or researched his activities....

 

[AC4RD]

.... At first I was thinking that since it was so close to the warrant being executed, that could solidify the memory in his head. But I would be hard pressed to tell you what I did 11 days ago. However, I may be able to piece it together ...

Just MHO but I suspect that KAK came up with the "wrestling PPV" during that search, as you say. If you're a slug with felonious behavior on your computer and phones, and the police are questioning you while they search your house, it's probably easy to 'remember' what you were doing 11 days earlier, if it's an alibi you need to keep from being arrested.

KAK: "Oh, yeah ... that day? Yeah .. oh, that Monday! Yeah, sure I was ... ahhh ... I was watching a pay-per-view wrestling event! That's what I was doing! I remember it clearly, now."

LE: "Can you prove you watched that program? What did you see in that program?"

KAK: "Ahhh ... yeah ... wrestling! There were some ... some really big ugly guys with lots of tattoos and weird costumes, and ... they yelled into the MC's microphone a lot, and ... yeah, they threw each other around ... I remember! And they jumped on each other and beat each other with folding chairs and stepladders!"

One LE to the other LE officer: "Yep, I saw that PPV wrestling match, too. That's what was on it, and he couldn't have known that unless he had seen it ..."

 

[IceIce9]

Couldn't her remember because A&L were all over the news? I mean I remember what I was doing when Diana was killed etc...mOO

There are people here in Indiana who didn’t know about the murders weeks or months later. Many people don’t watch the news.

Also, not everything is important to everyone. You remember where you were when Diana died, I remember where I was when the breaking news of Diana’s death was announced, but to many people it wasn’t important enough to them to remember where they were.

I remember where I was and what I was doing when President Reagan was shot, when Michael Jackson’s death was announced, when each of the space shuttle tragedies occurred, when Pope JP2 was shot, when Anwar Sādāt was assassinated, and when John Lennon was shot. But to many or most people, some or all of those events aren’t important enough to them to remember.

Working with the public and having the opportunity to discuss news events on a daily basis, I am often amazed that people just don’t care much about things that don’t affect them or their families personally. Often anything short of 911 doesn’t stay in the minds of some.

While we here on WS are all very involved and invested in Abby and Libby, I can tell you that even here in Indiana, many people have all but forgotten about the case. When I have mentioned it people have lost interest in it, sometimes they think has been solved or that it will never be solved. But outside of Delphi itself it generally isn’t a top news event. JMO

 

[AC4RD]

What do people make of ‘they told me they know my Dad did it’?
they must have some decent evidence to say that to him

Just MHO, but because KAK said "they told me my dad did it" doesn't mean that LE really did say that. My opinion of his facebook page, when I looked a while back, is that there were a lot of claims I found hard to believe ('armed security guard at national park, casino card dealer, ad-hoc guitarist for some band') and I'd not be too quick to believe anything just because KAK said it.

The other thing MOO, though, is even if LE did tell him that, that doesn't mean they have any decent evidence, or any evidence at all. If you read the "true crime" books with details of police investigations, you'll see that LE questioning seems often to use "faux-facts." A lot of the time it's given in the books as "What explanation would you have if someone saw you at the (crime scene) that day?" or "What would you say if we told you we found her fingerprints in your car?"

They may have asked KAK "what would you say if we told you that your father murdered the girls?" just to see his reaction. And if he really doesn't know anything, he might assume that means they're looking at his dad as a suspect.

FWIW. MHO is that they might have said something like that, either A.) because they do suspect him, or B.) just to pull KAK's chain. Or they might not have said it at all and he's making it up. IMO.

 

[MistyWaters]

If anyone would like to refresh the background on KAK’s arrest outlining what a despicable character he is, here’s the link to the Probably Cause Affidavit keeping in mind he was under oath when he was interviewed by ISP and FBI, but not when speaking to a HLN reporter. It appears to me he’s spent his whole adult life telling fabricated stories (to sexually exploit minors) and earlier on we also noted he’d created a fictitious life working in Las Vegas. This is not a person who’s word mean anything at all unless he’s backed in a corner, in fact he seems to fit the criteria of a compulsive liar IMO. Furthermore IMO it’s really unfortunate that HLN gave him a voice because he doesn’t deserve the attention.

https://www.wishtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/Kegan-Anthony-Kline-PC.pdf

 

[TL4S]

Just MHO, but because KAK said "they told me my dad did it" doesn't mean that LE really did say that. My opinion of his facebook page, when I looked a while back, is that there were a lot of claims I found hard to believe ('armed security guard at national park, casino card dealer, ad-hoc guitarist for some band') and I'd not be too quick to believe anything just because KAK said it.

The other thing MOO, though, is even if LE did tell him that, that doesn't mean they have any decent evidence, or any evidence at all. If you read the "true crime" books with details of police investigations, you'll see that LE questioning seems often to use "faux-facts." A lot of the time it's given in the books as "What explanation would you have if someone saw you at the (crime scene) that day?" or "What would you say if we told you we found her fingerprints in your car?"

They may have asked KAK "what would you say if we told you that your father murdered the girls?" just to see his reaction. And if he really doesn't know anything, he might assume that means they're looking at his dad as a suspect.

FWIW. MHO is that they might have said something like that, either A.) because they do suspect him, or B.) just to pull KAK's chain. Or they might not have said it at all and he's making it up. IMO.

I completely agree with this assessment of KAK, and I do think we need to be wary of his reliability. He's a predator.

However, I don't really think what KAK had to say is all that important.

Right now, five years after LE obtained a search warrant for the Peru house, over a year-and-a-half after KAK was charged, arrested, and jailed, and shortly after a second LE presence at the Peru house, LE gives MP a heads up and comes out at 9:30pm on a Monday night to requests tips into the A&L tip line regarding the "creator" of a_shots. KAK admittedly is that "creator," unless there was another a_shots account created by somebody different, at a different IP address we don't know about, using the same model and setup as KAK's account.

I don't need KAK to tell me that LE are looking at him and his father in connection to the murders. The affidavit and LE's "a_shots ask" tells me that. They are the only likely people with direct access to that a_shots account...

Moo