IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #7

[mheido67]

Question for those who sail RCCL regularly: Does Royal Caribbean use an electronic key system that tracks passenger's every move? DH and I sail on Princess that now uses an onboard Medallion that opens your cabin door automatically as you approach, tracks onboard purchases and activities, lets your steward know when you're not in your stateroom, etc. Newer Princess vessels are being built for Medallion use while older ships are being retrofitted. The electronic system was optional on our cruise in 2018 but is now mandatory for all passengers. The program is not without a few operational glitches, and it is highly intrusive: Big Brother is watching! I'm wondering if Freedom of the Seas was using this type of technology in July, 2019 and that LE will know the precise movements of everyone in the Weigand's family travel group.

Princess Cruises: Princess MedallionClass™ - Get More From Your Vacation

I know RCCL has introduced the medallion type system on some of the newer ships. It’s a wrist band that looks like a watch. I believe we used them when we sailed on Quantum of the Seas. I don’t think they’ve made their way on to the Freedom class ships as of yet.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

Good thinking to the posters who brought up SA’s reaction to CW falling from his hands. It’s so true that your automatic reaction would be to try to grab the item, especially a child! As stated above, this was a living, breathing toddler who fell to her death from his hands, and he didn’t even TRY to reach/grab for her, no he just flopped backwards dramatically. I can’t get this out of my mind......I’d better not say anymore, but it sure has me thinking.....

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

I know RCCL has introduced the medallion type system on some of the newer ships. It’s a wrist band that looks like a watch. I believe we used them when we sailed on Quantum of the Seas. I don’t think they’ve made there way on to the Freedom class ships as of yet.

The Princess Medallion comes standard on a lanyard, but you can also get a watchband holder as well as other special "jewelry" to hold your Medallion. DH and I kept ours on the lanyards - I kept mine in the small cross-body bag that I carry around onboard, and DH kept his in his pocket.

One afternoon when we were both in our stateroom watching a movie, the steward came in with our afternoon ice bucket. He hadn't knocked because our Medallions indicated that we were not in the cabin. Thankfully, we were dressed and not doing anything other than watching a movie Like I said in my earlier post, the system is not without a few glitches.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

Good thinking to the posters who brought up SA’s reaction to CW falling from his hands. It’s so true that your automatic reaction would be to try to grab the item, especially a child! As stated above, this was a living, breathing toddler who fell to her death from his hands, and he didn’t even TRY to reach/grab for her, no he just flopped backwards dramatically. I can’t get this out of my mind......I’d better not say anymore, but it sure has me thinking.....

BBM Thinking is good.

 

[In vino veritas]

I see recent posts wondering if the judge will dismiss the civil case at this point. But I saw an article already from last week saying that the judge already ruled the case can go forward.

South Bend family's suit against Royal Caribbean over toddler's death can continue, judge says

Snipped from article: "In seeking the dismissal of the lawsuit, Royal Caribbean offered as evidence video footage and still images that it claims show Anello knew the window was open. But at this stage in the case, Graham wrote, a court may not consider such evidence."

That was the judge’s initial ruling. But, since then, RCCL was granted permission to read-file a Morion to Dismiss, provided that kept arguments strictly to the four corners of the plaintiffs complaint.
RCCL has since re-filed, following the instructions of the judge.

 

[JerseySleuth17]

I know RCCL has introduced the medallion type system on some of the newer ships. It’s a wrist band that looks like a watch. I believe we used them when we sailed on Quantum of the Seas. I don’t think they’ve made their way on to the Freedom class ships as of yet.

I'm not sure if the family used what you describe, but the ship could definitely track their movements via security cameras. The ship would also know what drinks were purchased b/c any purchases must be charged to your room card.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

BBM Thinking is good.

 

[Wehwalt]

I'm sympathetic to the position that the plaintiffs don't have a case and the motion to dismiss, by rights, ought to be successful, but I don't see why MW, a very experienced cruise lawyer, would file a pleading with allegations he must know better than any of us would not survive a motion to dismiss, which does nothing more than analyze the pleading and see if it is sufficient to set out a case. Either it sets out a sufficient case or I don't understand why he would file it. Unless the answer is they are trying to damage RCC in the public eye until RCC cries uncle and settles. In which case, if the parents lose here they will appeal to the Eleventh Circuit. Don't ask me on what grounds, they'll think of something.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

I'm not sure if the family used what you describe, but the ship could definitely track their movements via security cameras. The ship would also know what drinks were purchased b/c any purchases must be charged to your room card.

Winkleman said that SA "had not even bought a bottle of water", but adults are permitted to being wine or champagne onboard to enjoy in their staterooms. There were six adults in the family travel group, which means that each of them could have brought wine or bubbly onboard when they embarked the ship. Even if no drinks were charged to SA, it doesn't mean that he didn't have a couple of early afternoon drinks. Adults can also purchase a pre-paid beverage package. As with many of his other inane remarks, it was silly for MW to suggest that SA hadn't had anything to drink. There was a reason that Grandpa didn't submit to a breathalyzer or blood draw

 

[In vino veritas]

I'm sympathetic to the position that the plaintiffs don't have a case and the motion to dismiss, by rights, ought to be successful, but I don't see why MW, a very experienced cruise lawyer, would file a pleading with allegations he must know better than any of us would not survive a motion to dismiss, which does nothing more than analyze the pleading and see if it is sufficient to set out a case. Either it sets out a sufficient case or I don't understand why he would file it. Unless the answer is they are trying to damage RCC in the public eye until RCC cries uncle and settles. In which case, if the parents lose here they will appeal to the Eleventh Circuit. Don't ask me on what grounds, they'll think of something.

I honestly believe the original intent was to get RCCL to commit to a quick settlement, which explains the very quick indictment of RCCL in the public arena.
The circumstances were highly tragic... the horrific death of an infant. MW likely convinced the Wiegands that RCL would settle to avoid negative public sentiment.

Unfortunately for MW and the family, things did not transpire as planned. Now, they are left scrambling to try to salvage this travesty of a lawsuit.

 

[mheido67]

Winkleman said that SA "had not even bought a bottle of water", but adults are permitted to being wine or champagne onboard to enjoy in their staterooms. There were six adults in the family travel group, which means that each of them could have brought wine or bubbly onboard when they embarked the ship. Even if no drinks were charged to SA, it doesn't mean that he didn't have a couple of early afternoon drinks. Adults can also purchase a pre-paid beverage package. As with many of his other inane remarks, it was silly for MW to suggest that SA hadn't had anything to drink. There was a reason that Grandpa didn't submit to a breathalyzer or blood draw

Not claiming SA had been drinking anything alcoholic but two points;

-Often guests are offered a complimentary glass of champagne when embarking. Not always but in my experience more often then not.

-Even if SA had a prepaid beverage package the ship would still have a record if he’d ordered a drink. Even prepaid package holders need to provide their key card when ordering a drink.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Not claiming SA had been drinking anything alcoholic but two points;

-Often guests are offered a complimentary glass of champagne when embarking. Not always but in my experience more often then not.

-Even if SA had a prepaid beverage package the ship would still have a record if he’d ordered a drink. Even prepaid package holders need to provide their key card when ordering a drink.

I remember complimentary Champagne on a Celebrity cruise in the mid '90s. I'm not aware of any cruise line doing this now unless the embarking passengers have some type of luxury accommodations, i.e. full suite. In that case, it's my understanding that the Champagne is delivered to the stateroom - not presented upon embarkation as ours was on the Celebrity ship in 1996. I have never purchased a pre-paid beverage package and don't know exactly how it works.

 

[JulieBEMT]

Question for those who sail RCCL regularly: Does Royal Caribbean use an electronic key system that tracks passenger's every move? DH and I sail on Princess that now uses an onboard Medallion that opens your cabin door automatically as you approach, tracks onboard purchases and activities, lets your steward know when you're not in your stateroom, etc. Newer Princess vessels are being built for Medallion use while older ships are being retrofitted. The electronic system was optional on our cruise in 2018 but is now mandatory for all passengers. The program is not without a few operational glitches, and it is highly intrusive: Big Brother is watching! I'm wondering if Freedom of the Seas was using this type of technology in July, 2019 and that LE will know the precise movements of everyone in the Weigand's family travel group.

Princess Cruises: Princess MedallionClass™ - Get More From Your Vacation

The Freedom Class ships do not have anything like the Medallions. You simply have your Sea Pass Card that you use to open your stateroom door, and purchase items on board. Some of the newer ships have what are called Wow Bands. They work similar to the Medallions, but are not required. They are wrist bands that can be purchased for an additional fee.

 

[they'll get you]

love from Australia....

ROYAL CARIBBEAN TO OFFER AUSTRALIAN HEROES FREE CRUISES ON SPECTRUM

Royal Caribbean is to move one of its newest and biggest ships to Australia and free cruises to those who helped fight the bushfires, the line has announced on a blog.
“In light of the ongoing Coronavirus issues in China, Royal Caribbean has announced it will move Spectrum of the Seas to Australia as a gesture to thank the humanitarian efforts put forth to combat the wildfires”, says the Royal Caribbean fans’ blog, an unofficial site run out of the US.

“Spectrum of the Seas will travel to Australia and be deployed on complimentary cruises sailing from Sydney in support of Australia’s first responder community, who worked tirelessly over many weeks of the bush fire crisis.”
Royal Caribbean to offer Australian heroes free cruises on Spectrum - Cruise Passenger

 

[Montrealaise]

I'm sympathetic to the position that the plaintiffs don't have a case and the motion to dismiss, by rights, ought to be successful, but I don't see why MW, a very experienced cruise lawyer, would file a pleading with allegations he must know better than any of us would not survive a motion to dismiss, which does nothing more than analyze the pleading and see if it is sufficient to set out a case. Either it sets out a sufficient case or I don't understand why he would file it. Unless the answer is they are trying to damage RCC in the public eye until RCC cries uncle and settles. In which case, if the parents lose here they will appeal to the Eleventh Circuit. Don't ask me on what grounds, they'll think of something.

And don't forget, the longer this stays in the news, the more publicity MW gets. Being known as the "go-to" lawyer for people who want to sue a cruise line is priceless to him.

 

[MyBelle]

Winkleman said that SA "had not even bought a bottle of water", but adults are permitted to being wine or champagne onboard to enjoy in their staterooms. There were six adults in the family travel group, which means that each of them could have brought wine or bubbly onboard when they embarked the ship. Even if no drinks were charged to SA, it doesn't mean that he didn't have a couple of early afternoon drinks. Adults can also purchase a pre-paid beverage package. As with many of his other inane remarks, it was silly for MW to suggest that SA hadn't had anything to drink. There was a reason that Grandpa didn't submit to a breathalyzer or blood draw

BBM. The reason is that Chloe's parents are an attorney and a police officer. Breathalyzers can be manipulated. LE needed a warrant to obtain a blood draw. They didn't have one.

Not all adults choose to drink if they are around their children and grandchildren especially so if they out among crowds. I also highly doubt the adults popped corks the moment they arrived on the ship earlier that day.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

That was the judge’s initial ruling. But, since then, RCCL was granted permission to read-file a Morion to Dismiss, provided that kept arguments strictly to the four corners of the plaintiffs complaint.
RCCL has since re-filed, following the instructions of the judge.

BBM. Link? Thanks.

 

[Kakidoll]

BBM. The reason is that Chloe's parents are an attorney and a police officer. Breathalyzers can be manipulated. LE needed a warrant to obtain a blood draw. They didn't have one.

Not all adults choose to drink if they are around their children and grandchildren especially so if they out among crowds. I also highly doubt the adults popped corks the moment they arrived on the ship earlier that day.

JMO

Actually many get a drink as soon as they board as a 'start vacation' celebration. And you don't need to use your own Sign and sail card. once person can buy all the drinks. I cruise a few times a year and our first stop is atrium bar to get that first 'cheers' drink. Its tradition.

 

[Jax49]

BBM. Link? Thanks.

NEW DOCUMENT

ROYAL CARIBBEAN CRUISES LTD.’S AMENDED MOTION TO DISMISS THE COMPLAINT FOR FAILURE TO STATE A CAUSE OF ACTION
Case 1:19-cv-25100-DLG
Document 30 Entered on FLSD Docket 02/12/2020

New Motion to Dismiss 2-13.pdf

23 PAGES

Reading through it now but for the most part, appears to be the same as the previous motion to dismiss just without the parts about the video and the photos.

 

[mheido67]

I remember complimentary Champagne on a Celebrity cruise in the mid '90s. I'm not aware of any cruise line doing this now unless the embarking passengers have some type of luxury accommodations, i.e. full suite. In that case, it's my understanding that the Champagne is delivered to the stateroom - not presented upon embarkation as ours was on the Celebrity ship in 1996. I have never purchased a pre-paid beverage package and don't know exactly how it works.

On our most recent Celebrity cruise 2 1/2 years ago they were handing out glasses of champagne to adults at embarkation. It’s a nice touch.

Several of our RCCL cruises have been inaugural sailings so I’m sure that was the reason they were doing it on those cruises.

Getting the first class treatment on my next cruise this summer. 7 nights around the Baltic on Seabourn Ovation. All dining and drinks included.