• #201
Makes taking out a school full of kids seem like carelessness, or worse, if they're capable of that kind of precision.

MOO
I honestly don't know what to say to that. You believe the US and Israel are intentionally targeting schools?

Missile and bomb guidance systems can and do fail (signal loss, hardware issues, propulsion issues).

There is zero comparison between an intelligence agency assassination involving a stationary gun, and a missile launched from hundreds of miles away.
 
  • #202
  • #203
Aaron Boxerman
March 1, 2026, 1:42 a.m. ET10 minutes ago
Aaron Boxerman

Reporting from Jerusalem
Sayyid Abdolrahim Mousavi, the chief of staff of Iran’s armed forces, was also killed during the Israeli-American attack that began on Saturday, Iranian state media just announced. Maj. Gen. Mousavi’s death comes after several top Iranian leaders were killed, most notably Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, the country’s longtime ruler.
Aaron Boxerman
March 1, 2026, 1:04 a.m. ET47 minutes ago
Aaron Boxerman

Reporting from Jerusalem
Iran’s attacks targeting U.S. bases in the Persian Gulf appeared to have resumed Sunday morning, as well. The interior ministry of Bahrain, which hosts the U.S. Navy’s 5th Fleet, said sirens warning of incoming fire had been triggered; there were no immediate reports of casualties.
 
  • #204
  • #205
I honestly don't know what to say to that. You believe the US and Israel are intentionally targeting schools?

Missile and bomb guidance systems can and do fail (signal loss, hardware issues, propulsion issues).

There is zero comparison between an intelligence agency assassination involving a stationary gun, and a missile launched from hundreds of miles away.
I mean if they can't determine between a school and a barracks and hit the right one, perhaps they need to work on their guidance systems or intelligence gathering to make sure they're hitting the right things.

I can't imagine they meant to hit a school of preteen girls, especially as one of the talking points for regime change is increased freedom for women and girls. Killing a hundred of them on day one is a PR disaster if they're going to keep using that justification for hostilities.

MOO
 
  • #206
I mean if they can't determine between a school and a barracks and hit the right one, perhaps they need to work on their guidance systems or intelligence gathering to make sure they're hitting the right things.

I can't imagine they meant to hit a school of preteen girls, especially as one of the talking points for regime change is increased freedom for women and girls. Killing a hundred of them on day one is a PR disaster if they're going to keep using that justification for hostilities.

MOO
You can plan on hitting a particular target, and an internal error occurs where the missile winds up off course. The same can happen with bombs. They have a 90% accuracy rate, but 10% is a lot when you're talking about significant volume. That school was located extremely close to military installations (I've seen 600 meters).

We don't even know who did this, or the circumstances. Air defense fire could also have caused this too.
 
  • #207
War is a sustained, ongoing conflict.

Afghanistan was a war. Iraq was a war. Vietnam and Korea were wars.

They lasted years.

This will be over in days or weeks.
Will it? If I recall wasn’t that the thought about the war in Ukraine, 4 years and it’s still going.
 
  • #208
You can plan on hitting a particular target, and an internal error occurs where the missile winds up off course. The same can happen with bombs. They have a 90% accuracy rate, but 10% is a lot when you're talking about significant volume. That school was located extremely close to military installations (I've seen 600 meters).

We don't even know who did this, or the circumstances. Air defense fire could also have caused this too.
Then, I would question targeting that location during school hours. Barracks are 24/7, schools are not. If they'd hit it a few hours earlier or later, then it would have hit an empty building.

There is no way they didn't know the risk of the timing of the strike could result in this, and they did it anyway.

MOO
 
  • #209
Will it? If I recall wasn’t that the thought about the war in Ukraine, 4 years and it’s still going.
That was a ground invasion, and Russia severely miscalculated their ability to take over the country.

There will be no ground invasion here and the objectives are completely different:

Missile sites, launchers, military infrastructure, leadership, and maybe the nuclear sites again if they don't believe the initial strikes were effective enough.
 
  • #210
Then, I would question targeting that location during school hours. Barracks are 24/7, schools are not. If they'd hit it a few hours earlier or later, then it would have hit an empty building.

There is no way they didn't know the risk of the timing of the strike could result in this, and they did it anyway.

MOO
They couldn't. Those targets had to be hit at the exact same time the window opened on Khomeini. They knew exactly where he was going to be and when he was going to be there. They took out the leadership with him, and leadership in other locations.

That's a risk they take every single time.
 
  • #211
  • #212
They couldn't. Those targets had to be hit at the exact same time the window opened on Khomeini. They knew exactly where he was going to be and when he was going to be there. They took out the leadership with him, and leadership in other locations.

That's a risk they take every single time.
They could. They could have hit it at a later time, or chosen a different target altogether.

There are always choices.

This was the wrong one, because they missed their target completely and killed a bunch of kids. There is no upside, and I'm not willing to dismiss it as an acceptable thing. We have whole threads here for single children murdered or killed through neglect or carelessness of adults. I'm not going to just accept a hundred gone in an instant because of the choices of adults just because they used a missile rather than a car or their fists. It's an obscenity.

MOO
 
  • #213
These are the deceased Iranian leaders (so far) ...

Iranian army’s chief of staff, Abdul Rahim Mousavi
Defence Minister Aziz Nasirzadeh
Security adviser, Ali Shamkhani
IRGC commander-in-chief Mohammad Pakpour
Ayatollah Ali Khamenei

IRNA said more commanders of the armed forces were also killed and that their names will be announced later.

Israel’s air force says it dropped more than 1,200 munitions on Iran over the past day in its joint attack with the US.

 
  • #214
They could. They could have hit it at a later time, or chosen a different target altogether.

There are always choices.

This was the wrong one, because they missed their target completely and killed a bunch of kids. There is no upside, and I'm not willing to dismiss it as an acceptable thing. We have whole threads here for single children murdered or killed through neglect or carelessness of adults. I'm not going to just accept a hundred gone in an instant because of the choices of adults just because they used a missile rather than a car or their fists. It's an obscenity.

MOO
If they hit it at a later time their targets are not there. If there is any hope of regime change, you need to take out the leadership.

These decisions are pragmatic, and not based on emotion. You try to avoid civilian casualties, but there are no guarantees.

You cannot negotiate with terrorists, and you cannot fight them with cars or fists. You kill them with bullets and bombs.
 
  • #215
"Videos, verified by Al Jazeera’s Sanad fact-checking unit, show protesters setting fire to and smashing the windows of the US diplomatic mission in the Pakistani city of Karachi.

Local sources said Khamenei’s assassination triggered the protests."

(Updated a few minutes later) ... "Pakistan’s Edhi rescue service has said six people were killed and several injured in riots that broke out near the US consulate in Karachi."


 
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  • #216
Aaron Boxerman
March 1, 2026, 3:09 a.m. ET5 minutes ago
Aaron Boxerman

Reporting from Jerusalem
Omani state media said the Gulf country — which had sought to mediate between the United States and Iran to prevent war — had been targeted by multiple drones. At least one person was injured, the Oman News Agency said. While Oman did not say who had fired the drones, Iran has fired missiles and drones at several Gulf states that host U.S. bases over the past few days, including Bahrain, Qatar, and the United Arab Emirates.
 
  • #217
I will agree with some of what you say, but we have to recognize that those in the US are of a certain group. They fled. They were likely those aligned with the Shah. I'm not sure this is a diverse group.

Having said that, I think almost everyone would agree that the Iranian government is repressive! Citizens aren't free. But this is true in other countries, yet the US doesn't pursue agression in those countries. Why not?

Perhaps it's about the oil or about Israel. The US admin said they kidnapped Maduro in Venezuela because they were concerned about the people of Venezuela. Yet the US hasn't done one tiny thing in support of the citizens. All they did was take the oil. I would love to see them do something in support of the citizens. Nada.

The USA has a history of only attacking countries with resources. (OK, also Afghanistan when they were pursuing Al Queda, even though the main attackers in 9-11 were almost all from Saudi Arabia.)
I think you're mostly right about this. But, even though I think they've been a bit misleading as to the reasons for this attack on Iran, I still come back to it being an overall positive to reduce its capabilities to arm terror groups in the middle east or further afield.

I don't think Iran was planning to use nukes to destroy the entire world. I do think it wanted a nuclear deterrent to protect the regime from an attack like this. A valid fear for them. But that would have protected their capability to arm terror groups and repress their population who doesn't get a say in their own government. I've heard people say that the leaders of the US or UK are dictators, but I think there's a difference between four or five yearly elections where you really can choose a different party (albeit imperfect choices) and places like North Korea, Russia, or Iran.

I am very disappointed for the people of Iran that I think we've been misled as to how much this will help them. I hope I'm wrong and they can overthrow the government, but it's so complex there with how the Mullahs are connected to the Revolutionary Guard, and then the regular military and various police forces. In Venezuela they had an opposition government that had apparently won the elections, ready to take over if Maduro was dethroned, But I don't see anything as organised as that being ready for Iran? How many of the people in Iran actually want this Shah's son to come in and form a government? But a small chance against a weakened government is more of a chance than they've had for decades, so I hope they can succeed.
 
  • #218
I am very disappointed for the people of Iran that I think we've been misled as to how much this will help them. I hope I'm wrong and they can overthrow the government, but it's so complex there with how the Mullahs are connected to the Revolutionary Guard, and then the regular military and various police forces. In Venezuela they had an opposition government that had apparently won the elections, ready to take over if Maduro was dethroned, But I don't see anything as organised as that being ready for Iran? How many of the people in Iran actually want this Shah's son to come in and form a government? But a small chance against a weakened government is more of a chance than they've had for decades, so I hope they can succeed.

Apparently there are three groups in Iran. Those who supported Khamenei, those who didn't, and a grey area in between. It is hard to tell who are the majority at the moment. There are thousands in the streets, beating their chests in sorrow (as per linked article).



"We are dealing with polarisation when it comes to the social fabric in Iran.

The public mood is a mixture of different sentiments. Part of society is in support of the political establishment, and as state TV footage shows, there are many people taking to the streets in Tehran and other cities across the country, such as Mashhad and Qom.

Then, we have another segment of society where we see public dissatisfaction. Last December, we witnessed protests driven by economic hardship that people were facing, which later moved into other social and political spheres.

So, there are three camps of people: a group of pro-government people, people dissatisfied with the performance of the political establishment, and a grey zone in between.

Regardless of all these camps, there is a sort of frustration and anxiety considering that Khamenei’s killing happened while the country was under attack.

In June last year, Iran experienced a war, but now the scope and scale are not comparable – the stakes are higher."

 
  • #219
They could. They could have hit it at a later time, or chosen a different target altogether.

There are always choices.

This was the wrong one, because they missed their target completely and killed a bunch of kids. There is no upside, and I'm not willing to dismiss it as an acceptable thing. We have whole threads here for single children murdered or killed through neglect or carelessness of adults. I'm not going to just accept a hundred gone in an instant because of the choices of adults just because they used a missile rather than a car or their fists. It's an obscenity.

MOO

Well said. It's a disgrace.
 
  • #220
No sign of things easing.


"DEVELOPING: The Israeli Home Front Command has announced that sirens are sounding across large areas of Tel Aviv and its surrounding region, as well as in Jerusalem and the occupied West Bank.

Sirens have also sounded in the cities of Haifa and its bay, as well as Acre and its surroundings, according to official Israeli sources."

***************

"Iran’s state-run IRNA news agency reports the sound of “terrible explosions” caused by missile and air attacks in Tehran.

As we just reported, the Israeli army announced a few minutes ago it had carried out a large aerial attack on the “heart of the capital”."

 

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