Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #12

[Mex]

I have no idea what you are talking about. Israel doesn't want the land Palestinians are living on. Nobody wants it. Heck, Israel tried to give it to Egypt way back in 1978 but Egypt didn't want it. Israel completely pulled out of Gaza.

This war is being about destroying Hamas, a terrorist organization that seized control of Gaza on 2006

With the world's eyes on Gaza, attacks are on the rise in the West Bank, which faces its own war

Overnight, the West Bank was closed off. Towns were raided, curfews imposed, teenagers arrested, detainees beaten, and villages stormed by Jewish vigilantes.

apnews.com

QUSRA, West Bank (AP) — When Israeli warplanes swooped over the Gaza Strip following Hamas militants’ deadly attack on southern Israel, Palestinians say a different kind of war took hold in the occupied West Bank.

Overnight, the territory was closed off. Towns were raided, curfews imposed, teenagers arrested, detainees beaten, and villages stormed by Jewish vigilantes.

With the world’s attention on Gaza and the humanitarian crisis there, the violence of war has also erupted in the West Bank. Israeli settler attacks have surged at an unprecedented rate, according to the United Nations. The escalation has spread fear, deepened despair, and robbed Palestinians of their livelihoods, their homes and, in some cases, their lives.

settler
a person who arrives, especially from another country, in a new place in order to live there and use the land

settler

1. a person who arrives, especially from another country, in a new place in…

dictionary.cambridge.org

Snip
The international community, including Israel’s closest ally, the United States, considers settlements illegal and opposes construction on occupied territories claimed by the Palestinians for a future independent state.

Israel evacuated the four settlements and unilaterally pulled out of Gaza under the 2005 legislation. The prime minister at the time, Ariel Sharon, argued that Israel would not be able to keep the settlements under a future agreement with the Palestinians.

Since then, Israeli citizens have been officially banned from returning to those locations, though the Israeli military has allowed activists to visit and pray there — a ban that has now been revoked.

Netanyahu’s government has put settlement expansion at the top of its agenda and has already advanced thousands of new settlement housing units and retroactively authorized nine wildcat outposts in the West Bank.

Israel repeals 2005 act that removed West Bank settlements

Israeli lawmakers have repealed a 2005 act that saw four Jewish settlements in the occupied West Bank dismantled at the same time as Israeli forces withdrew from the Gaza Strip.

www.pbs.org

 

[Friday Fan]

@Mex : The Gazans do have a state, though. It's Gaza.
They're not homeless refugees by any means.
No one covets their land and that would include Israel who left.

Israel left in the mid 2000's and the Gazans elected whom they desired.
The Gazan have their freedom and ability to choose.

They chose Hamas, and Hamas chose the Oct. 7th 2023 massacre.

Gaza Strip explained: Who controls it and what to know

The Hamas attack that has killed hundreds was launched from one of the most densely populated and impoverished strips of land in the world.

www.nbcnews.com

In 2005, under international and domestic pressure, Israel withdrew around 9,000 Israeli settlers and its military forces from Gaza, leaving the enclave to be governed by the Palestinian Authority, which also controlled parts of the occupied West Bank.
Palestinian children play outside their home in the Al-Shati refugee camp in the Gaza Strip in August.
Red bolding mine.

The first photo at the above link shows a wide alley where laundry is hanging and kids are playing.
Although the Gazans call them 'camps', they're anything but. Mostly high rises and not a flimsy 'tent' camp like the ones true refugees would live in temporarily.
These are permanent residences.

The ruling leaders of Gaza call them camps because they're getting quite a bit of assistance from other nations, assistance they might not receive if they (Hamas & their supporters) didn't claim to be impoverished.

A look at the billions of dollars in foreign aid to Gaza

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip (AP) — The international community has sent billions of dollars in aid to the Gaza Strip in recent years to provide relief to the more than 2 million Palestinians living in the isolated, Hamas-ruled territory.

apnews.com

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip (AP) — "The international community has sent billions of dollars in aid to the Gaza Strip in recent years to provide relief to the more than 2 million Palestinians living in the isolated, Hamas-ruled territory.
Israel says the heavy restrictions on trade and movement are needed to keep Hamas from enhancing its military capability..."
Red emph. mine.
After the 10/7/2023 atrocities, Israel has once again proven itself to be correct.

Shadow of Israel's pullout from Gaza hangs heavy 10 years on

It would, said then prime minister Ariel Sharon, a former major-general not given to self-doubt, "grant Israeli citizens the maximum level of security". Other optimists said it would turn Gaza into the Hong Kong of the Middle East.

www.reuters.com

"... thousands of rockets from Gaza having rained down on Israel since 2005 and a peace deal with the Palestinians even further out of reach."
Notice Israel has endured bombing since 2005 !
And a peace deal is impossible for people who refuse it.
But the Gazans are free and not homeless by any means.
Omo.

Gaza has a local government, but they aren't a country. They don't have Palestinian passports. Palestine only has observer status at the UN. There is no citizenship. Most residents of Gaza have no citizenship in any country. Hence, they are refugees. Until they become a country, they will be considered refugees because they are stateless.

Israel controls the Gaza Strip's northern borders, as well as its territorial waters and airspace. Egypt controls Gaza Strip's southern border, under an agreement between it and Israel. Neither Israel or Egypt permits free travel from Gaza as both borders are heavily militarily fortified.


Despite the 2005 Israeli disengagement from Gaza, the United Nations, international human rights organisations, and the majority of governments and legal commentators consider the territory to be still occupied by Israel, supported by additional restrictions placed on Gaza by Egypt.


__________________

Gaza doesn't have an airport. It can't fly planes. Residents can't take their boats out past 3 miles. Israel has a blockade on Gaza.

 

[Dotta]

"Nearly 30 premature babies born in Gaza have been evacuated to Egypt."​

Nearly 30 premature babies born into Gaza warzone evacuated to Egypt

The premature infants were moved inside their incubators from the Al-Shifa Hospital into emergency vehicles across the border at Rafa to hospitals based in Egypt

www.dailymail.co.uk

28 premature babies evacuated from hospital are transferred from Gaza

Twenty-eight premature babies evacuated from Al Shifa hospital were wrapped up in hats and blankets as they were transferred from the Gaza warzone to Egypt today.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Momoffourboys]

Finally, Hamas has a website fit for the 21st century >>> http://Hamas.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726741797072781335

 

[Momoffourboys]

Unlike Hamas who butchers Israeli babies and hides behind their own…

The IDF, in cooperation with COGAT, helped facilitate the safe evacuation of newborn babies from the Shifa Hospital to receive medical treatment in Egypt. IDF teams on the ground assisted UN teams in the evacuation using incubators provided by Israel. We will continue to assist in the humanitarian efforts in Gaza.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726616499211612452

 

[PrairieWind]

I would guess that part of the negotiation for a cease fire in exchange for whatever number of hostages is that Hamas must give proof that those hostages are still alive.

 

[Mex]

@Mex : The Gazans do have a state, though. It's Gaza.
They're not homeless refugees by any means.
No one covets their land and that would include Israel who left.

Israel left in the mid 2000's and the Gazans elected whom they desired.
The Gazan have their freedom and ability to choose.

They chose Hamas, and Hamas chose the Oct. 7th 2023 massacre.

Gaza Strip explained: Who controls it and what to know

The Hamas attack that has killed hundreds was launched from one of the most densely populated and impoverished strips of land in the world.

www.nbcnews.com

In 2005, under international and domestic pressure, Israel withdrew around 9,000 Israeli settlers and its military forces from Gaza, leaving the enclave to be governed by the Palestinian Authority, which also controlled parts of the occupied West Bank.
Palestinian children play outside their home in the Al-Shati refugee camp in the Gaza Strip in August.
Red bolding mine.

The first photo at the above link shows a wide alley where laundry is hanging and kids are playing.
Although the Gazans call them 'camps', they're anything but. Mostly high rises and not a flimsy 'tent' camp like the ones true refugees would live in temporarily.
These are permanent residences.

The ruling leaders of Gaza call them camps because they're getting quite a bit of assistance from other nations, assistance they might not receive if they (Hamas & their supporters) didn't claim to be impoverished.

A look at the billions of dollars in foreign aid to Gaza

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip (AP) — The international community has sent billions of dollars in aid to the Gaza Strip in recent years to provide relief to the more than 2 million Palestinians living in the isolated, Hamas-ruled territory.

apnews.com

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip (AP) — "The international community has sent billions of dollars in aid to the Gaza Strip in recent years to provide relief to the more than 2 million Palestinians living in the isolated, Hamas-ruled territory.
Israel says the heavy restrictions on trade and movement are needed to keep Hamas from enhancing its military capability..."
Red emph. mine.

After the 10/7/2023 atrocities, Israel has once again proven itself to be correct !!
They were --and are -- right to be on their guard.

Shadow of Israel's pullout from Gaza hangs heavy 10 years on

It would, said then prime minister Ariel Sharon, a former major-general not given to self-doubt, "grant Israeli citizens the maximum level of security". Other optimists said it would turn Gaza into the Hong Kong of the Middle East.

www.reuters.com

"... thousands of rockets from Gaza having rained down on Israel since 2005 and a peace deal with the Palestinians even further out of reach."
Notice Israel has endured bombing since 2005 !
And a peace deal is impossible for people who refuse it.
But the Gazans are free, and not homeless by any means.
Omo.

@Chimera

Israel repeals 2005 act that removed West Bank settlements​

JERUSALEM (AP) — Israeli lawmakers on Tuesday repealed a 2005 act that saw four Jewish settlements in the occupied West Bank dismantled at the same time as Israeli forces withdrew from the Gaza Strip. The development could pave the way for an official return to the abandoned West Bank areas in another setback to Palestinian hopes for statehood.

It was the latest move by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s far-right government, which is dominated by settler leaders and allies, to promote settlement activity in the territory.
________________________________________________

Netanyahu’s government has put settlement expansion at the top of its agenda and has already advanced thousands of new settlement housing units and retroactively authorized nine wildcat outposts in the West Bank.

Israel repeals 2005 act that removed West Bank settlements

Israeli lawmakers have repealed a 2005 act that saw four Jewish settlements in the occupied West Bank dismantled at the same time as Israeli forces withdrew from the Gaza Strip.

www.pbs.org

There is a reason why this land is referred to as - the occupied West Bank.

 

[fred&edna]

Finally, Hamas has a website fit for the 21st century >>> http://Hamas.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726741797072781335

That's a BIG donate button... Must be Abu-bu's doing.
They either need more weapons or more Hamas headbands.
Maybe they will give personalized bombs to the first 25 who donate?

jmo

 

[Momoffourboys]

Israel-Gaza war: What latest IDF videos tell us about alleged Hamas tunnels at al Shifa hospital​

Historical satellite imagery shows the tunnel in the east of the hospital complex was located underneath a white building which was constructed some time after April 2021.

Gaza war: What latest Israel Defence Forces videos tell us about alleged Hamas tunnels at al Shifa hospital

Historical satellite imagery shows the tunnel in the east of the hospital complex was located underneath a white building which was constructed some time after April 2021.

news.sky.com

 

[Momoffourboys]

That's a BIG donate button... Must be Abu-bu's doing.
They either need more weapons or more Hamas headbands.

Nice website. Lots of graphics to show their dedication to barbarism.

 

[Chimera]

@Friday Fan ; Yes, that's been discussed earlier.
I know how some other nations and the Gazan leadership themselves view their country, pretty much as you've described.
The truth can be uncomfortable.
Why is there a blockade if the Gazans are peaceful and have never attacked Israel ?
Except the truth is far different.

Here's a question : A ton of money has been poured into Gaza that might not be given if they chose dual statehood ?
Not certain about that, except without the leaders of Gaza saying they're impoverished and with recognition of statehood (nation) the funds could dry up.

The Gazans live as though it's their country and when elections were held, they chose Hamas.
The Gazans are well-provided for and if they relinquish their refugee status they might not receive those billions in assistance.

I think my point is that even if they feel it's not their country they are content to live there ... and who else gets money just because they're refugees ?
They could build a paradise with those funds.

IF they stopped attacking Israel as I pointed out in my post that you've quoted (I didn't want to quote it myself as it's self-explanatory and a little lengthy, sorry.) , the blockade could be lifted.

Israel is under constant threat and yes they need to be on high alert, especially now.
The viewpoints expressed from possibly the Gazan media and other sources make this (current state of life in Gaza) look like something it is not.


There is no real agreement with Israel as I see it b/c Gaza's leadership cannot be trusted.
Not today, not ever.
A "blockade" in this situation means self-protection.
Who wouldn't protect their home from violent incursion ?

All of this has been going on for many years (Gazans bombing Israel and Israel defending itself time and again) :

Gaza has long been a powder keg. Here's a look at the history of the embattled region

Gaza has long been a powder keg, and it exploded after Hamas fighters stormed southern Israel on Oct. 7 and began killing and abducting people.

apnews.com

BY JULIA FRANKEL
Updated 5:37 PM CST, October 20, 2023

Through four wars and countless smaller battles with Israel that devastated Gaza, Hamas has only grown more powerful. In each subsequent conflict, Hamas has had more rockets that have traveled farther. The group has displayed a growing array of weapons.
This article is somewhat skewed, imo -- but provides a brief explanation of the constant turmoil.
IF Gaza is devastated, they have only themselves to blame for the constant attacks on their neighbor.
They could use those donations for better buildings and public places.

Now, the current state of affairs have proven that Israel must continue what they're doing and more.
They need to wipe out the lower ranks of Hamas and then go after the architects of this horror.
Or Oct. 7th will happen again.
Iirc, this has been voiced by some ? (Threats of a repeat ?)
Chilling.
Ymmv.
Omo.

 

[Brightchaser47]

The 36th Division troops also directed several airstrikes in Zeitoun against Hamas operatives, as well as located a rocket-making lab, weapons, explosive devices, a drone, and a tunnel inside a mosque in the neighborhood. (7/7)

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726661721841135751

Convenient. They can go from praying to killing, back to praying again....smh

 

[Chimera]

Israel-Gaza war: What latest IDF videos tell us about alleged Hamas tunnels at al Shifa hospital​

Historical satellite imagery shows the tunnel in the east of the hospital complex was located underneath a white building which was constructed some time after April 2021.

Gaza war: What latest Israel Defence Forces videos tell us about alleged Hamas tunnels at al Shifa hospital

Historical satellite imagery shows the tunnel in the east of the hospital complex was located underneath a white building which was constructed some time after April 2021.

news.sky.com

Thanks for the link !
Interesting information.

Sounds like they purposely built over the tunnel system to hide it.
These tunnels are years in the making.
Good to see where our tax dollars are going.
*insert sarcasm here*
*Sigh*
Omo.

 

[Friday Fan]

Finally, Hamas has a website fit for the 21st century >>> http://Hamas.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726741797072781335

It's fake. That's why I don't trust Israel. They pull stunts like this and a govt official states that they're real.

Israelis hijack Hamas.com, turning it into a display of October 7 atrocities

***

www.haaretz.com

Israelis Hijack Hamas.com, Turning It Into a Display of October 7 Atrocities​

A counter on the site proudly declares 1,400 'Zionist civilians murdered,' 41 'Zionists children & babies murdered and burnt alive.' The website does not appear to be linked to Hamas, whose actual website, Hamas.ps, currently appears to be offline

Nov 20, 2023 3:32 pm IST

A fake Hamas site bragging about the October 7 attack on southern Israel and highlighting the number of Jews killed, wounded and kidnapped went online in recent days, even as the terror organization’s actual website appears to have gone offline.



Snapshots of hamas.com preserved by the Internet Archive’s Wayback Machine show that as far back as 2005 the domain had been acquired by apparent cybersquatters, who used it for posting links to “Jewish Singles,” “Arabsex,” and “Free Casino Games.”

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726486422084030558

 

[MyBelle]

Live updates: Israel-Hamas war, Gaza's Al-Shifa Hospital, tunnel videos

Negotiations are "getting close to the end" on the release of hostages held by Hamas in the Gaza Strip, a White House official said Monday. Follow live updates.

www.cnn.com

Red Cross president meets with Hamas leader in Qatar​

From CNN’s Philip Wang

Mirjana Spoljaric, president of the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC), met with Ismail Haniyeh, political leader of Hamas, in Qatar on Monday, according to an ICRC statement.
The statement emphasized ICRC is not involved in any negotiations to free hostages in Gaza but was “ready to facilitate any future release that the parties to the conflict agree to” — something it has done twice already.

“The ICRC is insisting that our teams be allowed to visit the hostages to check on their welfare and deliver medications, and for the hostages to be able to communicate with their families,” the statement said. It added: “The ICRC cannot force its way in to where hostages are held, nor do we know their location.”

 

[otto]

Israel questions why UN and international agencies have not condemned Hamas use of hospitals

Israel questions why UN and international agencies have not condemned Hamas use of hospitals - Washington Examiner

Israeli leaders are pushing the international community to condemn Hamas's use of hospitals as many, they argue, have remained silent on the subject.Israeli officials have accused Hamas of using the Shifa Hospital in Gaza as a main command post and, since raiding last week, have provided various...

www.washingtonexaminer.com

….


I wonder too, is it because without wars they would be useless?

I think that the UN and international agencies remain silent about the October 7 Massacre because, initially, they felt the murders were acceptable within the context of a decades long war - a boiling over of emotions of sorts. UN schools use the curriculum that includes antisemitism (see link). There's no excuse for minimizing rape of women (see second link) and children, unless the embedded culture at the UN and international agencies is antiquated and out of step with women's rights in Western countries.

I don't think that the UN and international agencies expected to get caught with their name on the circuit box in the tunnel beneath the Rantisi hospital, or that the world would not respond to their demands for fuel (which turned into crying wolf). I don't think they expected anyone would discover that ambulances were used by Hamas as taxis to escort Hamas leaders and weapons. IDF intelligence was under-estimated. Many basic moral and ethical expectations that we have of health professionals were not practiced at the Al Shifa Hospital.

... just an opinion

https://www.terrorism-info.org.il/en/21204/

Internal documents show the World Health Organization paid sexual abuse victims in Congo US$250 each

Earlier this year, the doctor who leads the World Health Organization's efforts to prevent sexual abuse travelled to Congo to address the biggest known sex scandal in the UN health agency's history, the abuse of well over 100 local women by staffers and others during a deadly Ebola outbreak.

www.ctvnews.ca

 

[Momoffourboys]

It's fake. That's what I don't trust Israel. They pull stunts like this and a govt official states that they're real.

Israelis hijack Hamas.com, turning it into a display of October 7 atrocities

***

www.haaretz.com

Israelis Hijack Hamas.com, Turning It Into a Display of October 7 Atrocities​

A counter on the site proudly declares 1,400 'Zionist civilians murdered,' 41 'Zionists children & babies murdered and burnt alive.' The website does not appear to be linked to Hamas, whose actual website, Hamas.ps, currently appears to be offline

Nov 20, 2023 3:32 pm IST

A fake Hamas site bragging about the October 7 attack on southern Israel and highlighting the number of Jews killed, wounded and kidnapped went online in recent days, even as the terror organization’s actual website appears to have gone offline.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726486422084030558

Obviously its made by Israelis. Do you think an actual Hamas website would be marketed for them by the gov’t spox?

 

[Seattle1]

Finally, ..very sound words here that were probably lost on the panel. I'm glad I listened.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1722969513363116273

 

[IDK]

It's fake. That's why I don't trust Israel. They pull stunts like this and a govt official states that they're real.

Israelis hijack Hamas.com, turning it into a display of October 7 atrocities

***

www.haaretz.com

Israelis Hijack Hamas.com, Turning It Into a Display of October 7 Atrocities​

A counter on the site proudly declares 1,400 'Zionist civilians murdered,' 41 'Zionists children & babies murdered and burnt alive.' The website does not appear to be linked to Hamas, whose actual website, Hamas.ps, currently appears to be offline

Nov 20, 2023 3:32 pm IST

A fake Hamas site bragging about the October 7 attack on southern Israel and highlighting the number of Jews killed, wounded and kidnapped went online in recent days, even as the terror organization’s actual website appears to have gone offline.

Hamas, whose actual website, Hamas.ps, currently appears to be offline.

Snapshots of hamas.com preserved by the Internet Archive’s Wayback Machine show that as far back as 2005 the domain had been acquired by apparent cybersquatters, who used it for posting links to “Jewish Singles,” “Arabsex,” and “Free Casino Games.”

https://twitter.com/x/status/1726486422084030558

Thank you for very much for exposing that horrific misinformation. Looks like several people fell for it. People need to be really careful about believing propaganda and clicking links. IMO.

 

[fred&edna]

Gaza has a local government, but they aren't a country. They don't have Palestinian passports. Palestine only has observer status at the UN. There is no citizenship. Most residents of Gaza have no citizenship in any country. Hence, they are refugees. Until they become a country, they will be considered refugees because they are stateless.

Israel controls the Gaza Strip's northern borders, as well as its territorial waters and airspace. Egypt controls Gaza Strip's southern border, under an agreement between it and Israel. Neither Israel or Egypt permits free travel from Gaza as both borders are heavily militarily fortified.


Despite the 2005 Israeli disengagement from Gaza, the United Nations, international human rights organisations, and the majority of governments and legal commentators consider the territory to be still occupied by Israel, supported by additional restrictions placed on Gaza by Egypt.


__________________

Gaza doesn't have an airport. It can't fly planes. Residents can't take their boats out past 3 miles. Israel has a blockade on Gaza.

But, don't forget they DO have their HAMAS terrorist leaders calling for the death of all Jews/Infidels around the globe! And, they cheer when those terrorists bring tortured hostages into their city.

Why should anyone trust the Hamas-led neighbor who declares it's their holy mission to see them dead??