Israel - Palestinian militants launch massive attack, 7 Oct 2023 #6

[Cedars]

It's awful but terrorists don't give a damn whether their victims (kibbutzers) helped ordinary Palestinians or campaigned for Palestinian people.

Yes, I don't think there's such a thing as 'those nice, thoughtful, caring terrorists'. I'm wondering when people will give up.being surprised by this.

JMO

 

[Momoffourboys]

Geneva: Families of abducted Israelis are meeting the President of the International Red Cross. It’s important to note that while there’s a discussion regarding humanitarian conditions in Gaza, the Red Cross hasn’t been allowed to see the 204 hostages. 30 of them are children and between 10-20 are elderly people.

https://x.com/Elad_Si/status/1715357353074151623?s=20

 

[Simply Southern]

Israel-Hamas war live updates: Aid trucks wait to cross into Gaza after another night of heavy bombing (nbcnews.com)
3m ago / 5:18 AM PDT

More than 20 of the 200 hostages taken by Hamas are under 18, IDF says​

More than 20 of the at least 200 people taken hostage by Hamas in its unprecedented attack on Israel are under the age of 18, the IDF has said.

Sharing new information on the status of hostages, the Israeli military said that between 10 to 20 of those taken captive by Hamas were over the age of 60.

The IDF said most of those taken hostage were alive, but that there were also deceased people taken into Gaza by Hamas militants. NBC News was not able to independently verify the IDF’s statements.

[...]

Moo .. I think the humanitarian aid was held up until hostages were verified. Will the trucks be released soon?

War cabinet bars humanitarian aid from entering Gaza from Israel until Hamas releases hostages

* * *

www.timesofisrael.com

...
Israel’s war cabinet has decided the following:

1. Israel will not allow any humanitarian aid to be delivered from its territory to the Gaza Strip until the hostages being held by terror groups are returned.

2. Israel demands that the International Red Cross be able to visit the hostages and will work to mobilize international support for this demand.

3. Israel will not thwart humanitarian supplies from reaching Gaza from Egypt as long as it is only food, water and medicine for the civilian population located in the southern Gaza Strip. Any supplies that reach Hamas will be blocked by Israel.

 

[Friday Fan]

As Israel-Hamas war rages, Israelis can now travel to US for 90 days without getting a visa​

(Visa waiver)

Under the waiver program, Israelis first register with the Electronic System for Travel Authorization. That’s an automated system that helps determine whether the person is eligible to travel, Homeland Security said in the news release. The process can take up to 72 hours. Then they can travel to the U.S.

As Israel-Hamas war rages, Israelis can now travel to US for 90 days without getting a visa

As the Israel-Hamas war intensifies, the United States is now allowing Israelis wishing to visit the United States for 90 days or less to come visa-free.

apnews.com

 

[Momoffourboys]

Israeli Father-to-Be Died Preventing Massacre Days After Celebrating First Wedding Anniversary (Exclusive)​

Amir Naim, 27, was killed defending his kibbutz from Hamas terrorists, leaving behind a large family that includes his pregnant wife and his Holocaust survivor grandfather, who says he "died a hero"

….

Amir was the only person who died in Kibbutz Erez, which has a population of about 600, according to the most recent census data. He spent his final moments in a house that was hit by a handheld rocket launcher; he was killed by a single bullet. A mother of two who was hiding in the same house tried reviving him to no avail.
….

more: Israeli Father-to-Be Died Preventing Massacre Days After Celebrating First Wedding Anniversary (Exclusive)

 

[Friday Fan]

3. Israel will not thwart humanitarian supplies from reaching Gaza from Egypt as long as it is only food, water and medicine for the civilian population located in the southern Gaza Strip. Any supplies that reach Hamas will be blocked by Israel.

BBM. Two different subjects.
I believe Israel won't provide any aid to Gaza, but they say they are not going to block supplies from Egypt

 

[Sundog]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1714757689408921870

https://twitter.com/x/status/1714988902174409209

https://twitter.com/x/status/1715160958174175335

411 ANONYMOUS staffers in Congress? Accusing both sides of ethnic cleansing?
They need to do their jobs and if they have issues with any member of Congress' position on the war, they should write individually (or collectively if they prefer) as citizens to their Representative or Senator and express their views. Not as staff in Congress who are paid by the American citizens to support our elected officials. Their role is not to put out public statements as "411" staffers and advise Congressional leaders on what to do or not do.

MO

 

[Cryptic]

They can get fuel to the hospitals. They choose to use it to fuel rockets. IMO

Your point regarding HAMAS's lop sided resource priorities is very true.

But.... as a nerdy detail, military rockets, whether home made or factory made (and HAMAS's home made rockets are still pretty sophisticated- except when they dont work) use "dry" chemicals instead of liquid fuel such as gasoline.

"Dry" chemical rockets are far easier to handle than liquid fuel ones that need to be individually fueled up before use with alot of safety precautions.

In the end, a military rocket is just a bottle rocket on massive amounts of steroids fuel wise. Instead of starting it with a lighter an electrical current is used.

 

[Brightchaser47]

Israel-Hamas war live updates: Aid trucks wait to cross into Gaza after another night of heavy bombing (nbcnews.com)
3m ago / 6:28 AM PDT

IDF denies Orthodox church in Gaza was target of Israeli strike​

The Israeli military said Friday a Greek Orthodox church in the Gaza Strip, which was sheltering displaced Palestinian families, was not the target of an Israeli air strike.

Parts of the church collapsed in an explosion late Thursday, and Palestinian health officials said 18 people have died and dozens remain under the rubble.

The IDF said in a statement its fighter jets targeted the command and control center belonging to Hamas, involved in the launching of rockets and mortars toward Israel, Thursday night.

As a result of a strike, a wall of a church in the area of the center was damaged, the statement said, and it was aware of reports of casualties.

"The IDF can unequivocally state that the church was not the target of the strike," the statement added.

But the Greek Orthodox Patriarchate of Jerusalem denounced what it described as “the Israeli bombing that targeted one of its church buildings in Gaza City” in a statement.

NBC News has not independently verified either side's claims.

IDF says, "we didn't do it." Media,etc says, "prove it". IDF says, "we have". Media, etc says "we don't believe you". Soo tired of this....

 

[OldCop]

IMO this is the heart of this dilemma.

It’s like having an enormous fish tank filled with goldfish and piranhas. You want your docile goldfish to eat the food you sprinkle in, but the aggressive piranhas are going to take it all.

That leaves you with no choice but to remove the piranhas from the tank so the goldfish don’t starve. But what about the numerous piranhas in the tank that somehow pass themselves off as goldfish?

History shows us that this happens continually where there are terrorists embedded among a population.

IMO

Good analogy, @Arkay.

 

[cottonweaver]

Ordinarily, you would think they would look to their government for assistance. Unfortunately, the government they elected is a terrorist organization that is more concerned with slaughtering innocent Israeli citizens and holding them captive instead of taking care of its' own people. Hamas has had the wherewithal to continously fire rockets at Israel for 13 days but cannot get fuel to it's own hospitals...tragic. MOO

Ordinarily yes but I don't see how we can shed any light on this current crisis without an understanding of the basics & context - that for around 15 years a blockade has been imposed on the movement of goods in and out of the Gaza Strip.

I appreciate that since last week Israel has now also blocked the controlled supply of fuel but how does that impact the sick in hospitals who have nothing to do with Hamas?

Unless you think that every sick patient also elected Hamas and supports the atrocities and therefore deserves to die? Even the children's wards or babies in neo natal units. Do they vote? Are they culpable?
I just can't - sorry - that argument doesn't stack-up for me

TBC

AFAIK we're talking about diesel run power generators here not rocket fuels ( fertiliser based fuel - see below)

short explainer Qassam rocket - Wikipedia.

 

[Simply Southern]

1 hr 4 min ago

UN human rights group calls for "rapid and unimpeded passage" of humanitarian aid for all civilians​

From CNN’s Alex Hardie and Caitlin Danaher in London

The office of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights in a statement Friday implored all parties "to allow the rapid and unimpeded passage of humanitarian relief for all civilians in need, wherever they are."

A spokesperson for the human rights group expressed concern about continuing Israeli strikes across Gaza, including in the south.



It also expressed concern about the rockets being fired from Gaza into Israel and the alarm at the "rapidly deteriorating human rights situation in the occupied West Bank and the increase in unlawful use of lethal force.”

Citing reports of ill-treatment and lack of due process, it called for the end of "arbitrary arrests of Palestinians in the occupied West Bank and Arab Israelis in Israel."

Live updates: Israel-Hamas war rages as Gaza awaits aid in worsening conditions

Two US hostages are being released by Hamas, according to sources. Meanwhile, Gaza's hospitals are facing collapse as aid trucks line up at the Rafah crossing. Follow here for live news updates.

edition.cnn.com

I wish the UN would try, half this hard to have the hostages released.

Kinda one sided in my mind.
Moo

 

[Brightchaser47]

4min ago

Russian envoy in Israel says Moscow in talks with Hamas to release hostages​

Russia’s Ambassador to Israel Anatoly Viktorov says Moscow is in talks with Hamas to release the 200 to 250 hostages that terror groups are currently holding in Gaza.

Russia appears to be one of at least half a dozen countries that claim to be in talks with Hamas to release the hostages.

Interesting....

 

[Brightchaser47]

I wish the UN would try, half this hard to have the hostages released.

Kinda one sided in my mind.
Moo

IMO, the UN cannot appear to be "taking sides". To some folks (crazy as it sounds), demanding the release of Israeli hostages would be considered taking sides..

 

[Chimera]

The innocent Palestinians of the Gaza are indeed impacted very, very negatively as a result of this; no denying that by me or anyone.

I supposed where we diverge is upon the question of whose actions resulted in their plight.

I hope the IDF is able to get rid of Hamas so that their plight improves significantly and they can enjoy a freedom and peace brought about by self-governance without terrorists at the helm. It seems that other Arab nations may have sadly let them down on this front IMO.

Bbm.
Agreed.

It also doesn't help if other nations are funding and supporting Hamas !
Omo.

 

[dotr]

Israel says two Americans held hostage by Hamas, a mother and daughter, have been released

Hamas on Friday freed an American woman and her teenage daughter who had been held hostage in Gaza, Israel said.

apnews.com

BY NAJIB JOBAIN, SAMYA KULLAB AND JOSEPH KRAUSS
October 20, 2023
''KHAN YOUNIS, Gaza Strip (AP) — Israel said Friday it does not plan to take long-term control over the Gaza Strip after an expected ground offensive to root out Hamas militants that rule the territory. The Israeli military punished Gaza with airstrikes, and authorities inched closer to bringing aid to desperate families and hospitals, as people across Muslim countries protested in solidarity with Palestinians.''

Gallant did not say who Israel expected to run Gaza if Hamas is toppled.''

''Israel occupied Gaza from 1967 until 2005, when it pulled up settlements and withdrew soldiers. Two years later, Hamas took over. Some Israelis blame the withdrawal from Gaza for the sporadic violence that has persisted since then.''

 

[cottonweaver]

I wish the UN would try, half this hard to have the hostages released.

Kinda one sided in my mind.
Moo

afaik the UN has been demanding/calling release of hostages for over a week now

It's been in a lot of older WS posts on previous threads

ETA
I can see the posts going back to at least the 13th of October ( as well as being in the UN Security Council resolutions - votes on Tues or Weds?)
Here's today's call

https://twitter.com/x/status/1715258627135619567

 

[Momoffourboys]

Ordinarily yes but I don't see how we can shed any light on this current crisis without an understanding of the basics & context - that for around 15 years a blockade has been imposed on the movement of goods in and out of the Gaza Strip.

I appreciate that since last week Israel has now also blocked the controlled supply of fuel but how does that impact the sick in hospitals who have nothing to do with Hamas?

Unless you think that every sick patient also elected Hamas and supports the atrocities and therefore deserves to die? Even the children's wards or babies in neo natal units. Do they vote? Are they culpable?
I just can't - sorry - that argument doesn't stack-up for me

TBC

AFAIK we're talking about diesel run power generators here not rocket fuels ( fertiliser based fuel - see below)

short explainer Qassam rocket - Wikipedia.

But do you truly believe Hamas will not hijack fuel deliveries?
They’ve already stolen fuel from a hospital last week, per UNWRA.

UNRWA indicates Hamas stole supplies from its Gaza premises, then walks back claim - The Times of Israel

Now-deleted posts say Gaza's rulers grabbed humanitarian supplies; UN, Israeli officials stress the incident did happen

www.timesofisrael.com

 

[Simply Southern]

Maybe they are getting fuel to the hospitals.

Those press conferences were a few days ago. Things constantly change.

JMO

No, the agreement was no fuel and only 20 trucks.

Hamas has fuel, as long as rockets are being fired.

Maybe these authorities need to be speaking with Hamas and the Palestinians leaders to share fuel with hospitals and give up the hostages.

Moo.

 

[cottonweaver]

Riot police out in Egypt right now
Big demonstrations.

hard to post links because most Western MSM not covering it yet
Here's one reporter. City is #Tahrir.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1715357990184690123

they are saying that these are the biggest demos there for 10 years ( IDK if that is true )

Channel 4 reporter comments:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1715384093687288071