Jason Young to get new trial #2

[MyBelle]

While I agree with you that it is more reasonable that JY or someone changed her clothes over washing them, I contend that it is abundantly more reasonable that no one either changed her clothes nor washed them, but that the amount of blood found on the clothes is consistent with the amount of blood that CY actually got on the clothes. In other words, no one either washed them, replaced them, nor removed her from the home.

In fact, I would argue that it is more likely that CY did not wake up until after the murder took place and the perpetrators left the house.

Agent Holley testified a chemical analysis showed blood on the CY's clothes. Considering her bloody footprints were all over the floor and up the walls of her bathroom, I think her "shockingly clean" pajamas afterward are an impossibility unless they were washed.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

[modsnip]

No matter how many times y'all state your false "facts," it doesn't make them true. It's misleading, which you're well aware of. Thank you.[/quote]

Agent Russell Holley testified her pajamas tested positive for blood. Blood soaked through seat of her pants.[modsnip]

http://www.wral.com/specialreports/michelleyoung/video/10735811/#/vid10735811

 

[otto]

Yet no trace of blood in the drains,

What sort of blood evidence could we expect to find in the drains? Evidence of Michelle's blood in a drain should not mean anything. She lived in the house. There is a possibility that her blood is in the drains. Michelle's blood in a drain says nothing about when it was put there. I'm also wondering how much blood should we expect to see in a drain if the blood is a secondary transfer.

 

[otto]

I think it is both cruel and unhealthy to expect a dog to go for 12 hours without being walked. No indication that the Young's pet was expected or routinely went that long.

JMO

Dogs have the same routines as their owners. The household would normally be active by 7AM because of work and daycare schedules. The dog would have been teeth floating really holding it if he normally went out at 7AM and, on the day of the murder, he had to wait another five hours.

 

[otto]

While I agree with you that it is more reasonable that JY or someone changed her clothes over washing them, I contend that it is abundantly more reasonable that no one either changed her clothes nor washed them, but that the amount of blood found on the clothes is consistent with the amount of blood that CY actually got on the clothes. In other words, no one either washed them, replaced them, nor removed her from the home.

In fact, I would argue that it is more likely that CY did not wake up until after the murder took place and the perpetrators left the house.

It seems to me that one theory that has been completely discarded by people in favor of a guilty verdict is the possibility that the child never woke up ... no drugging with adult medication, no child witnessing the murder, no locking the child in the bathroom, no washing and changing clothes, no interpretation of child play by a daycare worker ... just a child that wakes up, goes to her mother's room, sees her mother, and cannot comprehend that she is dead.

Is she carrying the doll that she places with her mother, or does she return to her room to get the doll. The next thing she does is go to the bathroom to get bandaids. Wasn't this in during the 911 call ... "she's gotto booboos" and bandaids? At some point, she stepped in the blood, most likely after she tried to do something with the bandaids.

What happened next? Did she go back to the bathroom? Did she lie down on the floor and think about it? Did she lie on the floor and call for her mom? How did the blood get onto the interior of the bathroom door? Was there blood on towels or a bathmat in the bathroom?

How tall was the child? Wasn't she tall for a 2 year old? What was the height of the bed? Was there something at the end of the bed that she could have climbed on when she crawled into her parent's bed? Michelle was a cheerleader and Jason was photographed balancing the child on one hand. They probably encouraged athletic behaviors like climbing.

At what point did the child wander back to her bedroom and put one shoe on each foot from two different pair of shoes. Adults in the middle of covering up a murder are very conscious of details that will look suspecious. It would almost be instinct to ensure that the shoes matched. I'm of the opinion that only a child could make a dress shoe with a flip flop choice. Why did she put on her shoes? What was she thinking?

At some point she must have realized that there was nothing to be done, which is most likely when she would lie down on her father's side of the bed. She knows that he will there at some point soon enough.

If she slept through the entire murder, the evidence still fits: blood smears on the bedroom door, the doll, the shoes, and where she was found?

 

[otto]

I am uncertain how you can say "that did not happen". As I said earlier my granddaughters have some pj's that are identical so Shelly's testimony could stil fit my theory.

There was blood on the pyjamas. That would rule out the possibility that the child was wearing different pyjamas.

 

[otto]

It seems to me that the "bandaid" timing is interpreted differently depending on which side of the fence one sits. Jason is innocent would assume that the child woke up, saw that her mother was injured, put down her doll, went to the bathroom, got bandaids, presumably tried to apply them, most likely stepped in blood at this time, and then she was in the bathroom (smears on door), her bedroom (shoes), and her parent's bed (where she was found). What was Jason doing while all this was going on ... showering?

I think that the Jason is innocent perspective requires that the child woke up, the murder was happening or had just happened, the child witnessed this murder (from the doorway ... certainly not next to the body), suddenly she had blood on her feet, the father carried the child to the bathroom, locked her in the bathroom while he cleaned up and changed into shoes two sizes too small, he then removed the child's diaper, cleaned the child's feet, gave her adult medication, and put her to sleep on his side of the bed. She woke up at some point, got her doll and placed it with her mom, got bandaids from the bathroom, put on two different shoes, and crawled back into her father's side of the bed - right where she knew he would find her.

If she was awake in the middle of the night and drugged, when did she wake up, why did she pop out of the covers, and why wasn't she groggy when she was found? If Jason washed the child's feet, when did she get the bandaids? Did he let her walk in the blood and get bandaids after she witnessed the murder? Did Jason put the child to bed in her own bedroom ... when she woke up, she put on her shoes, found her mother, tracked blood from three hours earlier to the bathroom, got bandaids and went to bed?

Were any forensics taken from the child? Was she photographed?

 

[otto]

I am stuck on Jason's plan now and when it started and all the things he did to add extra suspicion on himself. like taking out a large Insurance policy and having an affair when he knew the paper trail was going to take LE right to MM's front door, airline tix, excessive phonecalls, and even telling his friends he was sleeping with her.
And, why not leave some signs of a break-in, open/unlocked window in the home? , And, the plans to go to Brevard, why not make them known before, and not so last minute? And, the hotel, why not make a reservation? Because JY was not a planner, and this murder was not planned.

Michelle met with her friend to increase the insurance policy. It seems that she wanted to be sure that her family was cared for in the event of an untimely death. The affair was known by many, and Jason knew that women would come out of the woodwork to document his infidelities. I'm sure that he did not expect to keep that a secret. I recall that the plan to pick up the baby dresser from Brevard hinged on whether Michelle's father was coming to the tailgating party that weekend. Jason had mowed the lawn (leaving the hose dripping) that afternoon in anticipation of his father in law visiting. Jason learned that his father in law was not visiting due to medical concerns, so Jason routed his return trip to Raleigh through Brevard ... and he did a cold call at the Brevard Hospital along the way.

Per his stepfather, the family waited until Jason stopped driving to tell him that his wife was deceased. He fell plumb to his knees, had chills, was in shock, was put in the recliner. During his grief, he made comments to his sister that were taken out of context during trial.

 

[otto]

No one challenged SS's testimony or the evidence presented in court that they were indeed the same pair of pj's she saw on CY when she was at the home that night.

Thanks. So there is testimony that the child had blood on her pyjamas, meaning that she was most likely wearing the same pyjamas she had on when she left the blood smears on the interior of the bathroom door ... unless she stepped, or sat, in the blood twice ... once before and once after she was changed. The simplest explanation is that she wore one pair of pyjamas on the night of the murder.

If she didn't change clothes, the whole theory about being taken away to be washed and given clean clothes just doesn't fit with the timeline or the evidence. What is the basis for the theory that the child was taken away from the house ... Meredith's keys on the car, the child's bloody pyjamas? Are there photos of the child's feet? Are there samples from nails, hands, and feet of child? We've been told that the child's feet were clean ... so where are the photos and where is the evidence. Surely that was documented ... given that it's a point of contention.

 

[sunshine05]

It seems to me that one theory that has been completely discarded by people in favor of a guilty verdict is the possibility that the child never woke up ... no drugging with adult medication, no child witnessing the murder, no locking the child in the bathroom, no washing and changing clothes, no interpretation of child play by a daycare worker ... just a child that wakes up, goes to her mother's room, sees her mother, and cannot comprehend that she is dead.

Is she carrying the doll that she places with her mother, or does she return to her room to get the doll. The next thing she does is go to the bathroom to get bandaids. Wasn't this in during the 911 call ... "she's gotto booboos" and bandaids? At some point, she stepped in the blood, most likely after she tried to do something with the bandaids.

What happened next? Did she go back to the bathroom? Did she lie down on the floor and think about it? Did she lie on the floor and call for her mom? How did the blood get onto the interior of the bathroom door? Was there blood on towels or a bathmat in the bathroom?

How tall was the child? Wasn't she tall for a 2 year old? What was the height of the bed? Was there something at the end of the bed that she could have climbed on when she crawled into her parent's bed? Michelle was a cheerleader and Jason was photographed balancing the child on one hand. They probably encouraged athletic behaviors like climbing.

At what point did the child wander back to her bedroom and put one shoe on each foot from two different pair of shoes. Adults in the middle of covering up a murder are very conscious of details that will look suspecious. It would almost be instinct to ensure that the shoes matched. I'm of the opinion that only a child could make a dress shoe with a flip flop choice. Why did she put on her shoes? What was she thinking?

At some point she must have realized that there was nothing to be done, which is most likely when she would lie down on her father's side of the bed. She knows that he will there at some point soon enough.

If she slept through the entire murder, the evidence still fits: blood smears on the bedroom door, the doll, the shoes, and where she was found?

Re: band-aids - While it's true that the child talked about band-aids, there were no band-aids found anywhere near Michelle's body.

Re: the shoes - I don't think we can reach any conclusions about the shoes except for the fact that one of them had blood on the inside so at some point after stepping in it, she (or someone else) put that shoe on her foot.

re: "What did she do next...back to the bathroom, etc...."? There is no trail of footprints between the body and the bathroom so she couldn't have walked to and from the master bedroom and the bathroom. She had to be carried.

Re: CY allegedly found in the master bed - we can't accept that as fact. We really don't know. I'll say this again --- if Jason did this crime, why wouldn't he have locked her in her bedroom with the child-proof door knob? We have to assume she was loose before he left (thus the blood on her hands and feet and being carried to the bathroom) and that he then cleaned her up and still left her loose. That isn't logical at all when he had a means to confine her in her room.

I think what makes much more sense is that she didn't see the crime, she didn't "happen upon the blood". Someone staged the footprints in the bathroom to make it appear as if she did and that is why they are mostly in one direction, all very dark in color and in many, only the toe prints appear as if she was held while prints are being made.

 

[sunshine05]

Thanks. So there is testimony that the child had blood on her pyjamas, meaning that she was most likely wearing the same pyjamas she had on when she left the blood smears on the interior of the bathroom door ... unless she stepped, or sat, in the blood twice ... once before and once after she was changed. The simplest explanation is that she wore one pair of pyjamas on the night of the murder.

If she didn't change clothes, the whole theory about being taken away to be washed and given clean clothes just doesn't fit with the timeline or the evidence. What is the basis for the theory that the child was taken away from the house ... Meredith's keys on the car, the child's bloody pyjamas? Are there photos of the child's feet? Are there samples from nails, hands, and feet of child? We've been told that the child's feet were clean ... so where are the photos and where is the evidence. Surely that was documented ... given that it's a point of contention.

I don't believe there are any photos of CY from that day.

The idea that she was removed from the house - no blood in bathroom drains, no wet or bloody towels, evidence that she was in the blood yet she was clean when found.

I wonder --- if JY did this and then cleaned CY - Why wouldn't he be concerned with how it would appear that she is shockingly clean when found?

The pajamas were + for presence of blood and the blood had soaked through the fabric. It must have been present on both sides of the fabric. If that is true, doesn't that prove that the pajamas were washed? How could blood soak through but not be visible by eye unless they were run through the washing machine? So many questions remain. Maybe before a new trial, someone will look closer at them. Maybe an expert can say for certain that they had to be washed and if they were, that pretty much clears JY as he certainly wouldn't have had time to wash and dry and redress her in the same pajamas.

 

[Grammy Jean]

I would like to ask is it reasonable to expect that a man who leaves his pregnant wife and young child alone for the night would then turn off his cell phone for the night? To me that is suspicious and I feel it could be reasonable to think he did not want his location traced by cell tower pings.

 

[nursebeeme]

reminder: address the post and not the poster and do so in a way that is not snarky. All opinions are welcome. If you state something as a fact please provide a link. If you have a concern with a post please use the alert button.

 

[JusticeFever]

I would like to ask is it reasonable to expect that a man who leaves his pregnant wife and young child alone for the night would then turn off his cell phone for the night? To me that is suspicious and I feel it could be reasonable to think he did not want his location traced by cell tower pings.

I am not sure if JY's cell phone was actually turned off or there was just no cell phone activity from 11:42PM Nov 2, until 7:40am Nov 3rd, and I don't want to tell you wrong,
So, here is the link to Keith Patterson's testimony. AT&T analyst

http://www.wral.com/specialreports/michelleyoung/video/9714915/

I do remember Mr. Patterson stating the numerous phonecalls to JY's Mom that am were consistent with dropped calls.

Just remember that if Jason could not have been reached in his room by the hotel clerk and an emergency or even a non-emergency phonecall had come in from Michelle, the clerk most likely would have went to his room and found him not there! (if you think he had left)

 

[JusticeFever]

It seems to me that one theory that has been completely discarded by people in favor of a guilty verdict is the possibility that the child never woke up ... no drugging with adult medication, no child witnessing the murder, no locking the child in the bathroom, no washing and changing clothes, no interpretation of child play by a daycare worker ... just a child that wakes up, goes to her mother's room, sees her mother, and cannot comprehend that she is dead.

Is she carrying the doll that she places with her mother, or does she return to her room to get the doll. The next thing she does is go to the bathroom to get bandaids. Wasn't this in during the 911 call ... "she's gotto booboos" and bandaids? At some point, she stepped in the blood, most likely after she tried to do something with the bandaids.

What happened next? Did she go back to the bathroom? Did she lie down on the floor and think about it? Did she lie on the floor and call for her mom? How did the blood get onto the interior of the bathroom door? Was there blood on towels or a bathmat in the bathroom?

How tall was the child? Wasn't she tall for a 2 year old? What was the height of the bed? Was there something at the end of the bed that she could have climbed on when she crawled into her parent's bed? Michelle was a cheerleader and Jason was photographed balancing the child on one hand. They probably encouraged athletic behaviors like climbing.

At what point did the child wander back to her bedroom and put one shoe on each foot from two different pair of shoes. Adults in the middle of covering up a murder are very conscious of details that will look suspecious. It would almost be instinct to ensure that the shoes matched. I'm of the opinion that only a child could make a dress shoe with a flip flop choice. Why did she put on her shoes? What was she thinking?

At some point she must have realized that there was nothing to be done, which is most likely when she would lie down on her father's side of the bed. She knows that he will there at some point soon enough.

If she slept through the entire murder, the evidence still fits: blood smears on the bedroom door, the doll, the shoes, and where she was found?

I think all 3 scenarios are possible, 2 of those theories coming from the state were that CY had been removed from the home or that she had been drugged. It's very possible that she did not witness anything at all ,One thing I remember is that if CY was sleeping in M&J's bed that am, there were 3 or 4 phone calls that came in earlier that day, and unless Michelle had turned off her phone (which would seem unlikely) the phone calls may have awakened CY. One of those calls were from Jason, and I am wondering if she would had not picked up when she heard her Daddy's voice. All calls apparently went straight to voicemail, and I don't know what CY's phone abilities were, such as answering the phone. If you look at photos of the bedroom, you will see the phone was in a position that CY could easily reach, right above the side of the bed she was either sleeping in, or at least placed her shoes.

 

[Grammy Jean]

I am not sure if JY's cell phone was actually turned off or there was just no cell phone activity from 11:42PM Nov 2, until 7:40am Nov 3rd, and I don't want to tell you wrong,
So, here is the link to Keith Patterson's testimony. AT&T analyst

http://www.wral.com/specialreports/michelleyoung/video/9714915/

I do remember Mr. Patterson stating the numerous phonecalls to JY's Mom that am were consistent with dropped calls.

Just remember that if Jason could not have been reached in his room by the hotel clerk and an emergency or even a non-emergency phonecall had come in from Michelle, the clerk most likely would have went to his room and found him not there! (if you think he had left)

Thanks for the link, I will have to listen when I have more time.

 

[sunshine05]

I would like to ask is it reasonable to expect that a man who leaves his pregnant wife and young child alone for the night would then turn off his cell phone for the night? To me that is suspicious and I feel it could be reasonable to think he did not want his location traced by cell tower pings.

If I recall, he did testify during the 1st trial that he turned it off so he could sleep. In an emergency, Michelle could always call his hotel room if she was unable to reach him by cell.

If he's thinking along the lines of "I better keep my phone in my hotel room so it doesn't ping elsewhere" he's clearly already thinking about an investigation. If he's cognizant of an impending investigation, is he going to call his girlfriend first thing or is he going to be more careful about his choice of phone calls?

If he's planning ahead and thinking about his phone, is he going to leave it to chance that he could be stranded, having possibly run out of gas on highway 52? The State would argue that he "slipped up". That slip-up isn't consistent with a person planning ahead - Coach papers, cell phone, hotel alibi.

 

[sunshine05]

I think all 3 scenarios are possible, 2 of those theories coming from the state were that CY had been removed from the home or that she had been drugged. It's very possible that she did not witness anything at all ,One thing I remember is that if CY was sleeping in M&J's bed that am, there were 3 or 4 phone calls that came in earlier that day, and unless Michelle had turned off her phone (which would seem unlikely) the phone calls may have awakened CY. One of those calls were from Jason, and I am wondering if she would had not picked up when she heard her Daddy's voice. All calls apparently went straight to voicemail, and I don't know what CY's phone abilities were, such as answering the phone. If you look at photos of the bedroom, you will see the phone was in a position that CY could easily reach, right above the side of the bed she was either sleeping in, or at least placed her shoes.

Also, is there any logical reason that JY would have put her in that bed in that room with the body? No way. The only way JY is involved is if he opts not to confine her safely in her room for no known reason so that she is free to roam and then she herself chooses to sleep there or hide there or whatever. (assuming she can even climb up on that bed) Wouldn't one expect to find her in the play area or her bedroom or getting into Halloween candy in the kitchen? The story about her being found in the master bed is very odd, imo.

 

[JusticeFever]

Thanks for the link, I will have to listen when I have more time.

You're welcome, Grammy Jean. I have to admit phone evidence is not the most interesting and this was a rather long testimony and I do not want to steer you wrong!

 

[JusticeFever]

If I recall, he did testify during the 1st trial that he turned it off so he could sleep. In an emergency, Michelle could always call his hotel room if she was unable to reach him by cell.

If he's thinking along the lines of "I better keep my phone in my hotel room so it doesn't ping elsewhere" he's clearly already thinking about an investigation. If he's cognizant of an impending investigation, is he going to call his girlfriend first thing or is he going to be more careful about his choice of phone calls?

If he's planning ahead and thinking about his phone, is he going to leave it to chance that he could be stranded, having possibly run out of gas on highway 52? The State would argue that he "slipped up". That slip-up isn't consistent with a person planning ahead - Coach papers, cell phone, hotel alibi.

Once again, if JY did leave his room , he lucked out again. No one noticed his door ajar, even though the night clerk/auditor went to his room twice. Good thing there was no fire or any kind of emergency evacuation or any kind of incoming calls coming to his room.