Josh Duggar charged with Receipt/Possession Child Sexual Abuse Material, 29 April 2021 #2

[RickshawFan]

My very first thought looking at the pictures is "I wonder if there is a program where the computer's camera can take pictures of who is using it at the time the CSAM was accessed." Or there are surveillance cameras in the dealership that only show the hands and feet but are time stamped and can be shown to have been at the same time someone was using the computer at the time the CSAM was viewed. I am also thinking that with the defense saying another dealership employee used the computer, LE has to show that it was accessed by Josh to refute this and there is some way in which his hands/feet were recorded.

The articles linked by @sds71 gave me one more (horrible) thought, which is that hands and feet can be seen in the CSAM itself and there is concern that it was filmed by Josh himself.

Maybe both of these?
I'm finding this concept interesting.
Presumably, in order for the equipment to be on hand, it would have to be used regularly (cost effective 'n' all), so it can't be something unique to JD.
Was he booked at a federal facility?
Perhaps they use it also for bank robberies, bomb setters... it would work for verifying people who were masked and whom they don't have fingerprints for.

 

[RickshawFan]

Is it just papa Jim Bob that's funding his legal bill? How many of the powerful elder males in the community are also chipping in? If JD realizes these charges are going to stick, will he start flipping on other CSAM offenders? They have their own online communities, which bleed into real life.

Snipped for focus.
Are you suggesting that other men in that cadre might be susceptible to the same charges? So they'd be chipping in liberally to JD's defense fund to smother any further investigation beyond JD?
That's interesting....

 

[LaborDayRN]

Josh Duggar Tries to Dismiss Child Charges on Grounds That Trump's Homeland Security Leaders Were Unlawfully Appointed

Motion:
DocumentCloud

Does anyone else find the booking photo in the article to be smug and sleazy looking? It makes my skin crawl.

 

[Cool Cats]

Does anyone else find the booking photo in the article to be smug and sleazy looking? It makes my skin crawl.

He is smirking and looks like he has had one too many.

Very creepy photo. He is highly creepy.

 

[Shamrock1]

Yes, I am suggesting it is a possibility. eta: To explain, he belongs to the Xtn Fundamentalist group, Institute in Basic Life Principles (IBLP), founded by Bill Gothard, a man accused of sexual assault by 30+ women. This link to Religion Dispatches Org does a nice summary of explaining how the sect trains and conditions girls and women that their bodies do not belong to them (NYPost) and if males assault them, it is the female's fault. eta: If there are others, not for pedophilia, but older victims?

Everything you’ve said about Gothard, IBLP, etc is accurate, but I just don’t find it likely that there’s some kind of pedophilic/misogynistic fundraiser for Josh.

Easier to just take out a line of credit on a property or three - or just not pay the lawyers on time, which happens often IMO. Plus, those who would want to “chip in” out of concern for their own hides probably don’t want a trail of those donations. Obviously, there are ways to transfer assets through sophisticated transactions, but we’re not talking millions here IMO.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Does anyone else find the booking photo in the article to be smug and sleazy looking? It makes my skin crawl.

I've always seen it as the expression of someone who has gotten away unpunished with pretty much every foul deed he's committed in life and doesn't think this time will be any different.

 

[Cool Cats]

I believe Josh will cop a plea with Jim Bob's blessing but the prosecution will want some jail time. Anyone else have an opinion?

Reasons?

1.) I think Josh will lose at trial and Jim Bob knows it.
2.) Jim Bob won't want all the sordid details to surface, which is what happens during a trial.
3.) A plea offers Josh a shorter prison sentence, much shorter than if he chances a trial and is found guilty.

• Only 2% of federal criminal defendants go to trial, and most who do are found guilty
• Trial by Jury, a Hallowed American Right, Is Vanishing (Published 2016)

Trials are rare in the federal criminal justice system – and acquittals are even rarer.

Trials have been relatively rare in the federal criminal justice system for decades, but they have become even less common over time.

Experts have offered a range of explanations for the long decline in criminal trials. Among the most common is what critics refer to as the “trial penalty”: Individuals who choose to exercise their constitutional right to trial can face much higher sentences if they invoke the right to trial and lose, according to a 2018 report by the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

 

[Shamrock1]

I believe Josh will cop a plea with Jim Bob's blessing but the prosecution will want some jail time. Anyone else have an opinion?

Reasons?

1.) I think Josh will lose at trial and Jim Bob knows it.
2.) Jim Bob won't want all the sordid details to surface, which is what happens during a trial.
3.) A plea offers Josh a shorter prison sentence, much shorter than if he chances a trial and is found guilty.

• Only 2% of federal criminal defendants go to trial, and most who do are found guilty
• Trial by Jury, a Hallowed American Right, Is Vanishing (Published 2016)

Trials are rare in the federal criminal justice system – and acquittals are even rarer.

Trials have been relatively rare in the federal criminal justice system for decades, but they have become even less common over time.

Experts have offered a range of explanations for the long decline in criminal trials. Among the most common is what critics refer to as the “trial penalty”: Individuals who choose to exercise their constitutional right to trial can face much higher sentences if they invoke the right to trial and lose, according to a 2018 report by the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

I agree and think it will be along the lines of “I’m innocent but doing this to spare my family and now I can minister to the REAL criminals.” His wife’s family was heavily involved in prison ministries, so he may already have a leg-up on whatever book comes out in 5 years.

I wonder if Josh has been trying to shift some blame to family members - pointing out that siblings had keys to office or the wireless password. He hasn’t argued this to my knowledge - I’m just using this as a hypothetical.

 

[Cool Cats]

I agree and think it will be along the lines of “I’m innocent but doing this to spare my family and now I can minister to the REAL criminals.” His wife’s family was heavily involved in prison ministries, so he may already have a leg-up on whatever book comes out in 5 years.

I wonder if Josh has been trying to shift some blame to family members - pointing out that siblings had keys to office or the wireless password. He hasn’t argued this to my knowledge - I’m just using this as a hypothetical.

Yes there are other witnesses that the defense has mentioned that they say could have accessed on the car lot computer. And at his preliminary hearing Josh threw his brother under the bus.

Josh tried to imply that one of his brothers who worked at the car lot with him could have downloaded the CSAM, because they had access to the computer.

Josh Duggar's defense team is trying to shift blame onto one of his employees who admitted to watching on the job

 

[Shamrock1]

Yes there are other witnesses that the defense has mentioned that they say could have accessed on the car lot computer. And at his preliminary hearing Josh threw his brother under the bus.

Josh tried to imply that one of his brothers who worked at the car lot with him could have downloaded the CSAM, because they had access to the computer.

Josh Duggar's defense team is trying to shift blame onto one of his employees who admitted to watching on the job

Oh, I didn’t realize the employee was a sibling. Interesting…

 

[Cool Cats]

Oh, I didn’t realize the employee was a sibling. Interesting…

The article mentions witness #1, #2, and #3, but does not say if any of them are Josh's brother.

Jim Bob, Mr. Money Bags, is footing the gigantic legal bill so I believe he would never in a million years allow the defense team to throw another one of his sons under the bus.

To push blame onto a Duggar brother by Josh I don't see JB allowing it. I do not think JB was pleased when Josh mentioned in court that his brother had access. Implies his brother could be the one who downloaded the .

Pretty sick for Josh to toss brother under bus if that is what he was trying to do.

 

[BeckyF]

I believe Josh will cop a plea with Jim Bob's blessing but the prosecution will want some jail time. Anyone else have an opinion?

Reasons?

1.) I think Josh will lose at trial and Jim Bob knows it.
2.) Jim Bob won't want all the sordid details to surface, which is what happens during a trial.
3.) A plea offers Josh a shorter prison sentence, much shorter than if he chances a trial and is found guilty.

• Only 2% of federal criminal defendants go to trial, and most who do are found guilty
• Trial by Jury, a Hallowed American Right, Is Vanishing (Published 2016)

Trials are rare in the federal criminal justice system – and acquittals are even rarer.

Trials have been relatively rare in the federal criminal justice system for decades, but they have become even less common over time.

Experts have offered a range of explanations for the long decline in criminal trials. Among the most common is what critics refer to as the “trial penalty”: Individuals who choose to exercise their constitutional right to trial can face much higher sentences if they invoke the right to trial and lose, according to a 2018 report by the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

I agree he will take a plea. I didn't feel that way a couple of weeks ago but changed my mind. My reasoning:

He is facing a 20 year sentence if convicted. If he takes a plea deal, he will get a lot less.

His parents don't want the horribleness to be heard at a trial. They want this to go away asap.

Anna will stand by his side if he gets say, 5 or so years. If he gets 10 or more years, maybe not but who knows.
JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

I agree he will take a plea. I didn't feel that way a couple of weeks ago but changed my mind. My reasoning:

He is facing a 20 year sentence if convicted. If he takes a plea deal, he will get a lot less.

His parents don't want the horribleness to be heard at a trial. They want this to go away asap.

Anna will stand by his side if he gets say, 5 or so years. If he gets 10 or more years, maybe not but who knows.

JMO

Anna will stay by his side no matter what.

But what on earth does she tell her children? What does JB say to his younger kids?

What will be said when Anna takes the kids to visit daddy in the Federal Pen?

How do you say daddy/brother made a mistake?

Rhetorical Questions

 

[Ruminations]

Oh, I didn’t realize the employee was a sibling. Interesting…

I had always assumed that the employee who had admitted to spending the night at the dealership without Josh’s knowledge was not a brother. Then again, a brother could sneak out of the house, I suppose. I might prefer to sleep on a hard desk rather than a room with as much privacy as a homeless shelter, at times.

Edited to add- witness #1 admitted to staying overnight at the business, and watching non-criminal on his phone.

Josh Duggar's defense team is trying to shift blame onto one of his employees who admitted to watching on the job

 

[Cool Cats]

I had always assumed that the employee who had admitted to spending the night at the dealership without Josh’s knowledge was not a brother. Then again, a brother could sneak out of the house, I suppose. I might prefer to sleep on a hard desk rather than a room with as much privacy as a homeless shelter, at times.

Hadn't heard of that. An employee sleeping at the dealership.

 

[Ruminations]

I agree and think it will be along the lines of “I’m innocent but doing this to spare my family and now I can minister to the REAL criminals.” His wife’s family was heavily involved in prison ministries, so he may already have a leg-up on whatever book comes out in 5 years.

I wonder if Josh has been trying to shift some blame to family members - pointing out that siblings had keys to office or the wireless password. He hasn’t argued this to my knowledge - I’m just using this as a hypothetical.

Yuck. His smugger Duggar’s face would think he “ministered” to others.

But the interesting book will be the one by his peers in prison who expose all the lies told in his, plus the civil lawsuits for his defamatory lies he created to demonstrate how evil others were until graced by his convicted butt.

 

[Shamrock1]

So the “other employee” was viewing legal materials via his cell phone. Even if that employee was tapped into the business’s wireless, I’d imagine the pros can differentiate between CSAM on a computer vs benign materials on a phone, right?

 

[Cool Cats]

So the “other employee” was viewing legal materials via his cell phone. Even if that employee was tapped into the business’s wireless, I’d imagine the pros can differentiate between CSAM on a computer vs benign materials on a phone, right?

Oh yah.

 

[nyvictoria]

I still don’t think he’ll plead but, if he does or is convicted, will he have to register as a sex offender for life?

I hope they hit him with every possible fine and punishment. 10+ years supervised probation/parole, sex offender for life and a heavy fine and restitution to the children he victimized.

 

[BeckyF]

Don't forget that JD used the same password that he used to access the CSAM images as he did for several other applications such as his bank account. What are the odds another employee at the car dealership knew JD's password he regularly used elsewhere?