Kaine explains the car swap

[Noway]

I'm sure this is completely against the TOS to quote TWO of your own posts but what the heck!

This was not a science fair.

From Gwenabob, a local:

No judging. Exhibits only. Not really even a science fair. IB exhibit. Different things.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - The Science Fair-IB Expo and the Electric Project

The other exhibits were gone by June 5.

As posted in :

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5421442&postcount=160"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - The Science Fair-IB Expo and the Electric Project[/ame]

 

[txsvicki]

Wonder if Kaine thought it odd that Terri wanted the truck to "pick up" the science project yet it wasn't there when he worked at home that afternoon. Why not pick Kyron up from school and the project at the same time at the end of the day. I'm wondering if she told Kaine to go to the bus stop with her that afternoon because Kyron might need help getting his project from the bus....

 

[Donjeta]

If they didn't talk about Terri not picking the project up I don't see why he should have been concerned about the project right away because even if it wasn't visible when he came home it would have been easy enough for Terri to put it out of the way, in a closet or in Kyron's room which he may have had no need to go in, or even leave it in the trunk for time being. I don't think it would necessarily have been a red flag at that point unless he was asking questions about it and felt she answered awkwardly.

 

[DairyGirl]

I'm sure this is completely against the TOS to quote TWO of your own posts but what the heck!

This was not a science fair.



The other exhibits were gone by June 5.

As posted in :

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - The Science Fair-IB Expo and the Electric Project

Thank you for posting that picture. That was how I remembered it, too, that all the projects were gone from the classroom except Kyron's. That really stands out to me as I can see why it would have been stressed to the parents that the projects needed to be picked up by Friday afternoon so that the classroom could be used on Monday. Makes me even more suspicious of TH since you would think that since she was home anyway why wouldn't she plan on picking up Kyron and his project instead of him taking the bus. It's not like she had better things to do. Kaine said she was on the computer when he got home. What reason could she have given for not picking it up? Why wasn't the plan for them both to go pick up Kyron unless Kaine had assumed that TH had already taken care of picking up the project?

 

[Sparky]

Photo of truck in here p. 9

plus a whole lot more
http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Kyron Horman -OR-/

The day it was being towed ...

I've been following along and came out of lurking to ask...the left side of the back window...is that a picture of Kyron? I tried to blow it up and it looks like it, but as I enlarge it, it gets fuzzy.

If it is, as I think...then why is it there and when was it placed there? It looks like a picture only. No flier.

 

[sorrell skye]

Sorry, I realize that you all jumped on the project at school the day before thing lol! I have another question though. Was Terri known by the students of the school for driving her Mustang to school or the white truck? If she drove her car normally then the kids would know her car well. I have to wonder about the7th grader boy who said that he saw the truck outside that morning. How would he know that was her truck?

bbm

Excellent question. Although the 7th grader wasn't specifically quoted as IDing KH's white truck (he said he "saw the truck"), it seemed to be implied in the way the article was written that he meant KH's truck.

Based on the way the article was worded, I, too, have the same question. How would he have positively known whose truck it was? Unless he saw TH & K getting out of it when they arrived @ school. Otherwise, it could have been someone else's truck.

IIRC, the LS also drove a white truck, according to media reports.

Not to mention, locals have posted that white trucks are very common in the area.

 

[Donjeta]

If he lives nearby or knows Kyron from school and pays attention to vehicles he may have seen Kyron getting into that truck before, the family driving past in it several times etc.

Alternatively, if he was interviewed after the questionnaire was published he might have remembered seeing a white truck and now thinks it was the truck he saw in the questionnaire.

 

[sorrell skye]

All we have is Kaine's word that Terri was the one who initiated the car swap for the reasons he states. While it is compelling, it is unsubstantiated. I could very easily see him saying "Hey, lemme drive the 'stang today."

Hard to prove, and taking things on faith anymore in this case.....well, color me jaded.

IANAL, but my guess is that in the legal sense, the whole car swap statement is hearsay.

 

[twzzlrgirl]

Wonder if Kaine thought it odd that Terri wanted the truck to "pick up" the science project yet it wasn't there when he worked at home that afternoon. Why not pick Kyron up from school and the project at the same time at the end of the day. I'm wondering if she told Kaine to go to the bus stop with her that afternoon because Kyron might need help getting his project from the bus....

My guess is she told him she couldn't bring it home after all (for whatever reason); I don't believe he thought Kyron would have the project on the bus. It would be crazy to assume that she needed a truck to take the project, but a 7 year old could bring it home on the bus.

 

[Kimster]

I'm sure this is completely against the TOS to quote TWO of your own posts but what the heck!

<snipped>

:read: Naw, you can quote two of your own posts. But THREE! Well, :snooty:. We have to draw the line SOMEWHERE!

:crazy:Just jokin':crazy:

 

[twzzlrgirl]

I've been following along and came out of lurking to ask...the left side of the back window...is that a picture of Kyron? I tried to blow it up and it looks like it, but as I enlarge it, it gets fuzzy.

If it is, as I think...then why is it there and when was it placed there? It looks like a picture only. No flier.

That actually gave me the chills. I don't think its a photograph....I'm not sure what it is. It looks like a face for sure, but not like something on the truck.

 

[Chewy]

I've been following along and came out of lurking to ask...the left side of the back window...is that a picture of Kyron? I tried to blow it up and it looks like it, but as I enlarge it, it gets fuzzy.

If it is, as I think...then why is it there and when was it placed there? It looks like a picture only. No flier.

Wow that is a good observation. If Terri was dealing was some sort of creep the person would know exactly which kid was her kid. Hmm. I'm curious when the picture was posted there.

 

[Barry]

I zoomed in on it to see what it was. It might be the the pattern of the trees and light, as distorted and colored by the tint on the back window, but it is really hard to tell.

ETA: Refering to what looks like a poster of a person on the back of the pic of the white pickup truck on the flatbed.

 

[mtnone]

This statement from Kaine answering a question, once again, leaves more questions than answers. Just like him choosing to answer the question about the doctor appointment that didn't answer anything at all. This one answers almost nothing.

The added part about her not having stayed until the end of the 'fair' is very confusing since he doesn't say if she had said she was going to. He doesn't say when she was going to bring it home, why she didn't or why they couldn't just have planned to go together and pick it and him up after school. He really explains nothing other than it not being the way they usually choose to drive what car.

I guess that is all he wants us to know, that Terri gave him a reason to drive the truck in a way that makes no sense later. I think he says this to throw more suspicion on her without giving enough info out to make sense of it all.

Like we don't all suspect her enough and yet have no clear facts to come to any clear understanding.

 

[sorrell skye]

I posted this earlier in the thread - my theory:

Oh boy, do I believe she planned this now. TH told KH that she needed the truck to pick up the project. In order to CYA, she went home and emailed the teacher (IF that is true) about it knowing FULL WELL she never planned on picking it up or that it even needed picking up that day. The teacher more than likely said, "Monday is fine" or something to that effect. THIS WAY, she could justify using the truck and not picking up the project. Both bases covered.

BUT, a logical person would see it like we do...why have Kyron ride the bus home? Simply go and pick him up and while you are there drop in the classroom and pick up the project. There really is no need to email the teacher about it.

Based on this hypothetical scenario, how could Th have anticipated the teacher saying in her mythical e-mail, "Monday is fine" in order for TH to cover both bases & justify not picking up the project?

IMO, she couldn't have anticipated the teacher's answer. She could just as likely have said, "Today is the best time", so as not to clutter up the classroom.

 

[Donjeta]

Based on this hypothetical scenario, how could Th have anticipated the teacher saying in her mythical e-mail, "Monday is fine" in order for TH to cover both bases & justify not picking up the project?

IMO, she couldn't have anticipated the teacher's answer. She could just as likely have said, "Today is the best time", so as not to clutter up the classroom.

I suppose she could just have driven there to pick it up and they'd have found out Kyron was missing an hour or two earlier.

But I don't really see why Monday morning wouldn't be okay since a lone project in the classroom wasn't going to bother anybody during the weekend while the classroom was empty. It might have been a cleaning issue if there were lots of them but one or two can always be stashed somewhere out of the way.

 

[gwenabob]

IANAL, but my guess is that in the legal sense, the whole car swap statement is hearsay.

No, it is not hearsay. It would be hearsay if Desiree told us what Kaine said. Since the conversation was between Kaine and Terri, and Kaine is telling us about it, it would be direct testimony. It would be up to a jury to decide if he is telling the truth.

 

[sorrell skye]

Regardless of the legal terminology, IMO it's a case of "he said/she said" unless there is another witness who overheard the conversation who can corroborate what was said.

 

[sorrell skye]

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/hearsay

It is the job of the judge or jury in a court proceeding to determine whether evidence offered as proof is credible. Three evidentiary rules help the judge or jury make this determination: (1) Before being allowed to testify, a witness generally must swear or affirm that his or her testimony will be truthful. (2) The witness must be personally present at the trial or proceeding in order to allow the judge or jury to observe the testimony firsthand. (3) The witness is subject to cross-examination at the option of any party who did not call the witness to testify.

In keeping with the three evidentiary requirements, the Hearsay Rule, as outlined in the Federal Rules of Evidence, prohibits most statements made outside a courtroom from being used as evidence in court. This is because statements made out of court normally are not made under oath, a judge or jury cannot personally observe the demeanor of someone who makes a statement outside the courtroom, and an opposing party cannot cross-examine such a declarant (the person making the statement). Out-of-court statements hinder the ability of the judge or jury to probe testimony for inaccuracies caused by Ambiguity, insincerity, faulty perception, or erroneous memory. Thus, statements made out of court are perceived as untrustworthy.

ETA: If KH was to make this statement under oath in a court of law that TH requested the truck for the purpose that he stated, I would be more willing to accept it as a factual statement.

Since this statement was made in an e-mail Q & A, I will consider it hearsay for the time being.

 

[Donjeta]

We don't know if Terri has denied this discussion took place so it may be a case of "they both said", for all we know.