Laura Babcock: Dellen Millard & Mark Smich charged w/Murder in the First Degree #1

[swedie]

I think though, if anything is found (evidence) in regards to LB and/or WM, that will be a whole separate trial don't you?

My opinion is that if LE have strong direct evidence against DM and/or MS, in Tim's case, the Crown will refuse to allow any plea dealing. They will know it's a win/win case regardless and will not risk a lighter sentence considering the maximum DM and MS will get is 25 years with no chance of parole. AND if they feel pretty certain a jury could find DM guilty of LB's and/or WM's death, the Crown can make application for DM to be classified as a dangerous offender or serial killer and he may never be released from prison. There is a slight hope, if they are found guilty of TB's murder, they may never make parole either. Scary to think if they are guilty and found guilty, they could be out of prison in maybe 12 to 15 years; age 37 and 40 years oldish. GRRR! JMHO.

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_killer"]Serial killer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[Sillybilly]

Scary to think if they are guilty and found guilty, they could be out of prison in maybe 12 to 15 years; age 37 and 40 years oldish. GRRR! JMHO.

<rsbm>

Not if found guilty on 1st degree. The mandatory sentence is 25 years with no credit for pre-trial custody, and the parole ineligibility period runs the full 25 years.

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_sentencing_in_Canada"]Criminal sentencing in Canada - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[bessie]

SL certainly got LB some attention and who knows where that investigation would be without him.

What you quoted was the initial MSM report. What never ceased to confuse me is why, from the second report and on, SL changed his story from he'd been supplying her with cocaine for months to both requests for drugs and a place to stay were denied. Also in later interviews it was unclear whether SL mentioned phone calls in his text messages prior to meeting and if DM denied that many calls took place until he saw the phone records. Realistically that many conversations did not take place because most of the calls were not answered by DM (as we've seen by phone records). In later interviews it doesnt seem like he denied any contact, just the multiple calls.

If he indeed supplied her with cocaine for months, then it would not be unusual to not want to text about it. I am thinking this is the truth, it makes more sense to me. I cannot deny SL has only helped catapult LB to the headlines which is good for her and her caring family, but he lied at some point. Either DM told him he supplied LB with drugs or he didn't. Nobody questioned him on the change in story.

I know he's doing his best and didnt owe anyone any favours, but we cannot focus on the worst parts of each interview SL gave if the information is so inconsistent.

Respectfully, Snoofo, it's unfair to allege SL "changed his story" or "lied" when we have not heard him relate his story, nor was the statement that DM supplied LB with cocaine for months a direct quote.

Lerner said Millard denied receiving Babcock&#8217;s calls until he showed him Babcock&#8217;s phone record. Millard then told him that Babcock had developed a drug problem and that he had been supplying her with cocaine for months.

Read more: http://toronto.ctvnews.ca/police-pr...suspect-missing-woman-1.1286814#ixzz2gAfhcBbc​

When giving an interview for a written article, one is at the mercy of the reporter. Erroneous reporting is common, which is why I always look for the direct quotes and give less weight to anything else.

IMO, the second report likely relays SL's statements with a higher degree of accuracy. For example, I have a notion that whatever words SL used to tell this part of the story morphed into the statement above from the first article.

A month later, Ms. Babcock moved out of her parents&#8217; house. She was going through some drug and mental-health issues, Mr. Lerner said.It was around that time she began hanging around Mr. Millard. http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/n...sing-woman/article12015795/?service=mobile#!/

It's also possible SL expressed an opinion that DM was supplying the drugs; or that he'd heard DM was supplying the drugs. Again, it's just a guess since I haven't heard nor read SL's exact words. Regardless of whether I'm correct or not, the point remains that from the given articles one cannot determine whether discrepancies are attributable to SL, or to poor reporting. (And frankly, I find it hard to believe DM would admit to SL that he'd been supplying LB with cocaine for months. JMO)

(Also interesting they question Lerner but still havent questioned Millard according to DP a couple weeks ago.)

As for DP saying DM has not been interviewed about LB, that might well be true. It doesn't mean, however, that LE hasn't requested an interview, or broached the subject with DM and his attorney.

 

[bessie]

What I still find very bizarre in all of this, is that SL waited about a week before coming forward with his suspicions of DM after DM's very public arrest. Why did it take a week? If that was my missing gf that I actually suspected someone had killed, and that person was charged with another murder, I would have been telling the media that hour, I would not be able to wait a week until the story died down a little, personally. And if I really felt all along that it was that person, the police would have heard from me every day since it was first reported.

If the report is accurate, when the story broke, he first contacted the parents, and they in turn contacted police. IMO as a parent, he did the right thing. Had the parents not contacted LE, then I expect he would have called them himself, as he did when he filed the MPR. I don't find it bizarre in the least not to run to the media immediately. In fact, we don't know if he contacted them, or vice versa. JMO

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/n...sing-woman/article12015795/?service=mobile#!/

 

[Juballee]

If the report is accurate, when the story broke, he first contacted the parents, and they in turn contacted police. IMO as a parent, he did the right thing. Had the parents not contacted LE, then I expect he would have called them himself, as he did when he filed the MPR. I don't find it bizarre in the least not to run to the media immediately. In fact, we don't know if he contacted them, or vice versa. JMO

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/n...sing-woman/article12015795/?service=mobile#!/

How would the media have found out about him and LB if he did not come forward with the story that he has the phone records to accuse DM as the last to contact LB? Could the media have gotten the information from LE after the PB, and how would they have the information if they claim that they have no record of receiving the phone records the first time? I can't see TPS wanting to leak that story to the MSM because it reeks of their possible incompetence, in my opinion.

 

[bessie]

How would the media have found out about him and LB if he did not come forward with the story that he has the phone records to accuse DM as the last to contact LB? Could the media have gotten the information from LE after the PB, and how would they have the information if they claim that they have no record of receiving the phone records the first time? I can't see TPS wanting to leak that story to the MSM because it reeks of their possible incompetence, in my opinion.

All they needed was his name as the person who filed the MPR, and I don't believe it would've been difficult to obtain. The details about the phone calls were provided by SL, himself.

 

[Juballee]

All they needed was his name as the person who filed the MPR, and I don't believe it would've been difficult to obtain. The details about the phone calls were provided by SL, himself.

What I mean is, how would anyone in MSM have known to look for his name, or for LB's MPR for that matter, when LE claimed to have no knowledge of the phone record connection and seemed to be treating the LB MPR like another dead file prior to SL coming forward a week after DM's arrest? The only way LE could have tied DM to LB at that point was if they did have access to the phone records or the interview notes from when SL says he gave it to them last year, which they are claiming that they did not have. So to me that seems to follow logically that it was not an LE leak that tipped off the media to search for SL's name on a MPR, since they would then be making themselves look bad for no reason. Which then leads me to believe that it was SL himself who approached the media, in my opinion, only, of course.

 

[matou]

It is possible that many of DM's friends were aware of the connection he had with Laura. Once DM's name came out in the media, Laura's name could have emerged immediately from ANY one of these people who knew she was still missing, including her own relatives. JMO

 

[bessie]

What I mean is, how would anyone in MSM have known to look for his name, or for LB's MPR for that matter, when LE claimed to have no knowledge of the phone record connection and seemed to be treating the LB MPR like another dead file prior to SL coming forward a week after DM's arrest? The only way LE could have tied DM to LB at that point was if they did have access to the phone records or the interview notes from when SL says he gave it to them last year, which they are claiming that they did not have. So to me that seems to follow logically that it was not an LE leak that tipped off the media to search for SL's name on a MPR, since they would then be making themselves look bad for no reason. Which then leads me to believe that it was SL himself who approached the media, in my opinion, only, of course.

The first reports only said LB's investigation was being re-opened. When LE released that information, the media would've scrambled to find details about LB. Once they started asking around, SL's name could have come from someone within LE, or from one of DM's friends, like Matou said. The media (like many others) were already snooping around FB checking out DM's contacts. Maybe they even found a FB post which mentioned SL and LB. On the other hand, maybe SL did approach them first. I tend to think it was the other way around, but we don't know.

 

[cansleuther]

What I mean is, how would anyone in MSM have known to look for his name, or for LB's MPR for that matter, when LE claimed to have no knowledge of the phone record connection and seemed to be treating the LB MPR like another dead file prior to SL coming forward a week after DM's arrest.

Both AM and DM's girlfriend are/were members of the "Help Us Find Laura" FB group. MSM could have discovered the connection and contacted the group moderator, who is SL, to ask if LB was connected to DM.

 

[Sillybilly]

Both AM and DM's girlfriend are/were members of the "Help Us Find Laura" FB group. MSM could have discovered the connection and contacted the group moderator, who is SL, to ask if LB was connected to DM.

IIRC, when I was questioning when AM et al may have added the "Help Us Find Laura" to their FB, another poster pointed out that AM had a prior tweet or FB post to the effect (paraphrased) "anyone seen Laura". At the time I checked out our WSer's info, and they were correct ... AM's comment predated the Bosma investigation and would have been available for media to see

 

[Juballee]

Are we then to suppose that MSM contacted and investigated every interest, group and comment AM and DM's GF made on Fb and twitter to see if there was any connection to DM before they found the LB connection?

 

[cansleuther]

Are we then to suppose that MSM contacted and investigated every interest, group and comment AM and DM's GF made on Fb and twitter to see if there was any connection to DM before they found the LB connection?

AM's FB has been sleuthed very zealously right from the time of DM's arrest, when many people assumed him to be the second suspect. He belongs to three FB groups, and only one of them is for a missing woman - which may have piqued MSM's interest enough for them to investigate whether or not DM had a connection to the missing woman as well.

 

[Juballee]

AM's FB has been sleuthed very zealously right from the time of DM's arrest, when many people assumed him to be the second suspect. He belongs to three FB groups, and only one of them is for a missing woman - which may have piqued MSM's interest enough for them to investigate whether or not DM had a connection to the missing woman as well.

If they did that right from the time he was arrested, it still shouldn't have taken them a week to find SL then, in my opinion. Wasn't at least one of the other groups for vehicles or something related to that, wouldn't that have equally piqued their interest since DM was charged with theft of a vehicle?

 

[Sillybilly]

If they did that right from the time he was arrested, it still shouldn't have taken them a week to find SL then, in my opinion. Wasn't at least one of the other groups for vehicles or something related to that, wouldn't that have equally piqued their interest since DM was charged with theft of a vehicle?

<bbm>

There's nothing to indicate they weren't sleuthing out that group as well.

 

[bessie]

Also, as you reminded us, cansleuther, one had simply to google her name and the FB page would have popped up. There was also the post on The Dirty where people who knew LB were posting. Once her name was released, it was a piece of cake to find SL, IMO.

And, as I was looking over the articles again this popped out at me. It's from one of the very first reports about LB on the afternoon of May 17, before SL was interviewed. Apparently, the media first learned of the phone records from LE, and they were already talking to "friends". At this point, SL was referred to only as the ex-boyfriend.

The two were friends, and other friends say they had a romantic relationship immediately before Babcock went missing.

Police say they have phone records showing calls between Babcock and Millard, including the last call made from Babcock's phone before she disappeared.

Read more: http://kitchener.ctvnews.ca/investi...n-with-dellen-millard-1.1286519#ixzz2gDbCva1F

 

[bessie]

If they did that right from the time he was arrested, it still shouldn't have taken them a week to find SL then, in my opinion. Wasn't at least one of the other groups for vehicles or something related to that, wouldn't that have equally piqued their interest since DM was charged with theft of a vehicle?

I'm sure they were finding many interesting things in their searches. I know WS'ers sure were. I'd go as far as to say some members of the media knew about DM's connection to LB very soon after his arrest, but there might have been reason to hold off on reporting the story until after LE made their announcement.

 

[Alethea Dice]

Also, as you reminded us, cansleuther, one had simply to google her name and the FB page would have popped up. There was also the post on The Dirty where people who knew LB were posting. Once her name was released, it was a piece of cake to find SL, IMO.

And, as I was looking over the articles again this popped out at me. It's from one of the very first reports about LB on the afternoon of May 17, before SL was interviewed. Apparently, the media first learned of the phone records from LE, and they were already talking to "friends". At this point, SL was referred to only as the ex-boyfriend.
Read more: http://kitchener.ctvnews.ca/investi...n-with-dellen-millard-1.1286519#ixzz2gDbCva1F

The afternoon of May 17th is when CTV interviewed SL. If you scroll down on the Find Laura Facebook page, at 4:44 on May 17th, SL posted that he had just finished the interview and said to watch the news at 6:00.

My feelings are that media contacted SL, LE confirmed that they were looking into the phone records and then the interview was broadcast that same night.

A small piece of the interview is here.

http://www.cp24.com/police-probe-link-between-bosma-suspect-missing-woman-1.1286890

Interestingly, CITY TV says, still on the 17th, that SL talked to them on "Saturday", which would have been May 11th. If that's not an error, it's odd that it took them almost a week to announce it.

http://www.citynews.ca/2013/05/17/family-says-missing-toronto-woman-knew-dellen-millard/

Another piece of the interview here, as well as one with her brother.

http://www.citynews.ca/2013/05/18/brother-of-missing-woman-speaks-out-about-millard-connection/

LB's mom interviewed on May 17th -

http://toronto.ctvnews.ca/police-probe-link-between-bosma-suspect-missing-woman-1.1286814

JMO

 

[swedie]

CHCH shed some more info for me regarding bold. From June 4th

Although LB was working for an online escort service her and DM were not linked through the sex trade in that way but they did have a romantic relationship.

*Reported missing July 14
*Last call to DM July 3
*Further investigation of LB's phone records show she had contact with other people after July 3
*Detective M Carbone claims no phone records turned over to 22 division last year
*DM was not interview last summer
*Now referring to WM's death as sudden death instead of a suicide
*911 call made from WM's home Nov. 29 and LE are not saying who or whether it was DM who called

http://www.chch.com/toronto-police-update-babcock-case/

 

[hopingforjustice]

Just posted on Laura Babcock FB page by SL

http://m.thespec.com/news-story/4136670-opp-will-co-ordinate-bosma-investigation/


the murder of Tim Bosma, the disappearance of Laura Babcock and the death of Wayne Millard are now officially part of a single, multi-jurisdictional police investigation.

After establishing an "investigative link" between the three cases, Ontario Provincial Police are directing the streamlined case under the province's Major Case Management (MCM) system.