Laura Babcock Murder Trial 11.22.17 - Day 20

[musicaljoke]

Don't think anybody is on DMs payroll at this point, that ship has sailed. I think DMs crew's lack of memory stems more from trying to preserve their own sense of dignity for family and friends. I'm sure that every one of these people had the same response when questioned by parents or friends; "I had no idea what he was up to, if I did I would have done the right thing". But, it is fairly obvious that most, if not all of them, must have had at least a very strong suspicion about what happened to LB. AM's testimony that he and Millard never spoke about LBs disappearance after that initial text speaks louder than words. The guy's ex disappears and nobody ever mentions or discusses her again?

These people have already damaged their reputations simply by being associated with a monster, but they are likely still accepted in society because the public perception is that they were oblivious. What if AM tells the court he knew that Millard killed LB? The fact that he didn't go to police makes him a monster, and directly responsible for not preventing WM and TB's murders. He'd be ostracized and could quite easily be charged with something himself.

Take a look at what's happened to CN. Do you honestly think she's willfully going to school in Poland? She is in exile and she will likely stay there until well after the WM trial is over. Besides Karla Holmolka she is quite possibly the most loathed woman in Canada.

Yes Andrew, no doubt you are right. After a while, these people might actually believe their own testimony and might believe that they are speaking the truth. Time has a way of creating new realities.

 

[andreww]

MS will go down for M1. I have a some small doubt that perhaps he did not do the murder, but them I look at the fact that he was at the residence, there were those pictures, he helped mount the incinerator to the trailer, he said he burned a body, he said to MM don't come back to see us at the burn, and finally the rap video. Perhaps I am even forgetting something.

Most people who did not do the murder, would run from DM, would call police, etc etc.

You wouldn't want to place a bet on that would you? I don't think there is a chance in hell that Smich will get M1 for this. In fact, the case is so weak I doubt Dungey will even present a defence.

 

[andreww]

Yes Andrew, no doubt you are right. After a while, these people might actually believe their own testimony and might believe that they are speaking the truth. Time has a way of creating new realities.

I think it will eat at them. None of these people are destined for greatness. I see things like depression, alcoholism, drug addiction in their futures.

 

[Inspector_North]

I believe she was killed by DM and MS between 7:00 and 7:30pm on the 3rd. I took out some texts to show how I see the sequence of events happening. MOO

My comments are in blue.

From Bill's amazing timeline: It's pretty clear to me (jmo) that MS was in the house when we hear the last of LB, and that he was so fully aware of the homicide plans that he understood the texts without requiring further explanation. I believe that MS is asking DM for payment for his part in the KKK horrors that were about to transpire. What exactly was the present at the top of the stairs? Was it a case of beer? Was it the bullets? Was it both? I don't believe that MS was innocent of the plans.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Hb6kEtpLa8cHCVorBuy4yqfHymGvhfHeM6s8QMWGVW8/pubhtml

Jul 3 6:19 pm Millard texts Jackson: "it says '32 long' on the side of it. can send pic as soon as I'm home."
This was reference to getting the correct ammo
Jul 3 6:30 pm Approximate time Millard picks up Babcock from Kipling Station. He brings her back to his Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 6:39 pm Millard texts Smich: "ayak." Are You A Klansman (AYAK) - reference to kkk text from MS
Jul 3 6:42 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ayak?"
Jul 3 6:51 pm Millard texts Smich: "I'll be back in 15 mins, don't be out front." Returning from picking up LB
Jul 3 7pm-1am Phones belonging to Babcock, Millard, and Smich all ping near Millard's Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 7:03 pm Babcock's phone calls her voicemail, the final call reported on her phone records. It pings a tower near Maple Gate.
LB is killed in this timeframe??
Jul 3 7:33 pm Millard texts Smich: "tru. I'm on a mission, back in 1 hr." Did he go to the hangar to get tarp, or go get ammo? Pings during this time are important. If ammo, she may still be alive at this point.
Jul 3 7:33 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ok. Let's grab something after. It's all good. Would DM and MS go out after if LB was there? Doesn't jive with DM wanting MS not be out front when he returned.
.

 

[THXGuru]

Don't see that at all.

Jul 3 6:28 pm Millard texts Smich: "I'll scoop some heini." (I'll pick you up some Heineken)
Jul 3 6:28 pm Smich texts Millard: "Kkk my ." (both my kids will answer my texts with "kkk" or just "k". Just means "okay")
Jul 3 6:30 pm Approximate time Millard picks up Babcock from Kipling Station. He brings her back to his Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 6:39 pm Millard texts Smich: "ayak." (Not sure what this means?)
Jul 3 6:42 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ayak?" (Apparently Smich doesn't either)
Jul 3 6:51 pm Millard texts Smich: "I'll be back in 15 mins, don't be out front." (IMO this shows Millard is keeping the plan from Smich)
Jul 3 7pm-1am Phones belonging to Babcock, Millard, and Smich all ping near Millard's Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 7:03 pm Babcock's phone calls her voicemail, the final call reported on her phone records. It pings a tower near Maple Gate.
Jul 3 7:26 pm Millard texts Smich: "present for you at the top of the stairs." (This is likely the Heineken Millard picked up for him)
Jul 3 7:32 pm Smich texts Millard: "Thank u. I need a small favour. Some change for food. I'm out of cash." (If there is any sort of plan, why would Smich interfere?)
Jul 3 7:33 pm Millard texts Smich: "tru. I'm on a mission, back in 1 hr." (Millard never leaves the house, so one can only assume the "mission" is LB's murder)
Jul 3 7:33 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ok. Let's grab something after. It's all good." (Again, if there was any kind of plan why his he suggesting this?)


The only possible thing that I can see that suggests that there is any kind of plan between them is that Smich asks for money for food at 7:32, but he doesn't ask Millard to join him, suggesting that he knew Millard was up to something even before he was told Millard was on a one hour mission. After learning that the plan changes to eating together. IMO there is a good possibility that Millard wouldn't want to eat when he got back, but that is very circumstantial.

None of your interpretations written in red have anything to back them up. Reading too much into meaning. Evidence suggests that MS was involved.

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

You wouldn't want to place a bet on that would you? I don't think there is a chance in hell that Smich will get M1 for this. In fact, the case is so weak I doubt Dungey will even present a defence.

Presenting a defense has little to do with how strong of a case the crown has. MM has been on the stand who would be his alibi if he had one. Besides MS himself who else would he call even if it was an airtight case?

 

[saulgoodman]

DM didn't want MM out front.
Jul 3 6:28 pm Millard texts Smich: "I'll scoop some heini." (I'll pick you up some Heineken)
Jul 3 6:28 pm Smich texts Millard: "Kkk my ." (both my kids will answer my texts with "kkk" or just "k". Just means "okay")
Jul 3 6:30 pm Approximate time Millard picks up Babcock from Kipling Station. He brings her back to his Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 6:39 pm Millard texts Smich: "ayak." (Not sure what this means?)
Jul 3 6:42 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ayak?" (Apparently Smich doesn't either)
Jul 3 6:51 pm Millard texts Smich: "I'll be back in 15 mins, don't be out front." (IMO this shows Millard is keeping the plan from MM )
Jul 3 7pm-1am Phones belonging to Babcock, Millard, and Smich all ping near Millard's Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 7:03 pm Babcock's phone calls her voicemail, the final call reported on her phone records. It pings a tower near Maple Gate.
Jul 3 7:26 pm Millard texts Smich: "present for you at the top of the stairs." (This is likely the Heineken Millard picked up for him)
Jul 3 7:32 pm Smich texts Millard: "Thank u. I need a small favour. Some change for food. I'm out of cash." (If there is any sort of plan, why would Smich interfere?)
Jul 3 7:33 pm Millard texts Smich: "tru. I'm on a mission, back in 1 hr." (Millard never leaves the house, so one can only assume the "mission" is LB's murder)
Jul 3 7:33 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ok. Let's grab something after. It's all good." (Again, if there was any kind of plan why his he suggesting this?)

 

[THXGuru]

You wouldn't want to place a bet on that would you? I don't think there is a chance in hell that Smich will get M1 for this. In fact, the case is so weak I doubt Dungey will even present a defence.

Sure let's place a bet. The only thing that could save MS is if someone could explain what he was doing at the residence on those days.

 

[THXGuru]

Presenting a defense has little to do with how strong of a case the crown has. MM has been on the stand who would be his alibi if he had one. Besides MS himself who else would he call even if it was an airtight case?

MS criminal record get mentioned if he takes the stand. All 5 or 6 of his crimes get mentioned. The jury will hear that he has a previous M1 conviction, date and sentence. At that point it really does not matter what he says.

 

[andreww]

None of your interpretations written in red have anything to back them up. Reading too much into meaning. Evidence suggests that MS was involved.

What are you talking about with "nothing to back them up?" most of the texts are quite clear. What specifically do you want explained?

 

[CJPRINCESS]

Anyone know what “tru” is supposed to mean? I see it often in their texts. Only thing I’m coming up with that would match is “The Real Untouchables “ which is short for a rap band.

 

[andreww]

DM didn't want MM out front.
Jul 3 6:28 pm Millard texts Smich: "I'll scoop some heini." (I'll pick you up some Heineken)
Jul 3 6:28 pm Smich texts Millard: "Kkk my ." (both my kids will answer my texts with "kkk" or just "k". Just means "okay")
Jul 3 6:30 pm Approximate time Millard picks up Babcock from Kipling Station. He brings her back to his Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 6:39 pm Millard texts Smich: "ayak." (Not sure what this means?)
Jul 3 6:42 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ayak?" (Apparently Smich doesn't either)
Jul 3 6:51 pm Millard texts Smich: "I'll be back in 15 mins, don't be out front." (IMO this shows Millard is keeping the plan from MM )
Jul 3 7pm-1am Phones belonging to Babcock, Millard, and Smich all ping near Millard's Maple Gate residence.
Jul 3 7:03 pm Babcock's phone calls her voicemail, the final call reported on her phone records. It pings a tower near Maple Gate.
Jul 3 7:26 pm Millard texts Smich: "present for you at the top of the stairs." (This is likely the Heineken Millard picked up for him)
Jul 3 7:32 pm Smich texts Millard: "Thank u. I need a small favour. Some change for food. I'm out of cash." (If there is any sort of plan, why would Smich interfere?)
Jul 3 7:33 pm Millard texts Smich: "tru. I'm on a mission, back in 1 hr." (Millard never leaves the house, so one can only assume the "mission" is LB's murder)
Jul 3 7:33 pm Smich texts Millard: "Ok. Let's grab something after. It's all good." (Again, if there was any kind of plan why his he suggesting this?)

Or he wanted LB to think that they were alone. Again, nothing in these texts suggest MS knew anything.

 

[THXGuru]

What are you talking about with "nothing to back them up?" most of the texts are quite clear. What specifically do you want explained?

Your interpretations are not evidence. Just basic stuff that makes no sense when he made a video, told a friend he killed a girl and burned a body, told MM don't be out back with them, phones pinging all together. It's hard to believe you would be willing to give this individual any benefit of the doubt.

 

[musicaljoke]

You wouldn't want to place a bet on that would you? I don't think there is a chance in hell that Smich will get M1 for this. In fact, the case is so weak I doubt Dungey will even present a defence.

I remember thinking this exact thought at the TB trial. And then MS took the stand and all doubt was erased.

 

[musicaljoke]

Or he wanted LB to think that they were alone. Again, nothing in these texts suggest MS knew anything.

Or he didn't want LB to know that MS was in the house and that a plan other than what he told LB was about to transpire.

 

[andreww]

I believe she was killed by DM and MS between 7:00 and 7:30pm on the 3rd. I took out some texts to show how I see the sequence of events happening. MOO

My comments are in blue.

This was reference to getting the correct ammo – No, referencing the barrel of the gun

LB is killed in this timeframe?? – Here phone pinged at Maple Gate til 1:00 AM, so probably dead by that point.

Did he go to the hangar to get tarp, or go get ammo? Pings during this time are important. If ammo, she may still be alive at this point. – No, Millard, Smich and LB were all at Maplegate all night.

Would DM and MS go out after if LB was there? Doesn't jive with DM wanting MS not be out front when he returned. – They didn't leave the house.

 

[andreww]

Or he didn't want LB to know that MS was in the house and that a plan other than what he told LB was about to transpire.

Sure, the point is that there is no evidence to suggest that Smich was a part of that plan.

 

[andreww]

I remember thinking this exact thought at the TB trial. And then MS took the stand and all doubt was erased.

In the TB trial there were plenty of texts to show that Millard and Smich acted together. Smich had no choice but to take the stand. Different situation here.

 

[Bluepopsicle]

None of your interpretations written in red have anything to back them up. Reading too much into meaning. Evidence suggests that MS was involved.

What suggests to you that there’s evidence that MS was involved? Just that he was at the residence that night?

 

[CJPRINCESS]

In the TB trial there were plenty of texts to show that Millard and Smich acted together. Smich had no choice but to take the stand. Different situation here.

I dunno, but I’m pretty sure MS taking the stand in TB trial was what sealed his fate! I was on the fence thinking MS was innocent UNTIL he took the stand. I only believed a portion of his testimony and the rest, well that made him look guilty as hell.

JMO