MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #23 Retrial

[HarmonyE.]

(snipped) I still cannot come to the agreement that the CW has proof that KR hit him with her vehicle. John O'Keefe's autopsy photos prove ( to myself) that there is no way a vehicle strike killed him. His body screams " I was in a fight, and I lost".

Even Paul O'Keefe said at the hospital that "He looked like he went five rounds with Mike Tyson."

 

[ShadyLady]

This trial has shown me how compromised judges can be. Judges should be accountable for their actions. IMO

Big thumb on the scale of justice. IMO

 

[Soulmagent]

I think these two things can two things be true at once.
1: Karen hit John.
2: proctor is/was a lazy and shady investigator and planted the taillight pieces to ensure an airtight case against KR (which backfired spectacularly).

Edit: MOO, JMO, etc

It should have been over after the only evidence slightly hitting at KR hitting him are those planted pieces.IMO.
Whats to stop the next SPO ?
He should of went to Jail .IMO.

 

[OldCop]

There is zero physical evidence on John's body that he was struck by any vehicle.

And there was no taillight at the scene that morning. Not a single piece.

Taillight didn't show up until now fired and disgraced ex-Trooper Michael Proctor - the lead investigator and friend of the Alberts - got his hands on Read's vehicle.

And let’s not forget the reversed video of the Canton PD sally port and the fact that the vehicle should have been towed to a state police facility, not Canton PD. Wasn’t it amazing how so many pieces of tail light managed to stay on the vehicle while it was being towed for many miles in a raging blizzard?

 

[MerlinFalcon]

So it's 9 minutes difference in when JM looked out the window? That's why she's lying? What about KR saying she left John at the bar, never drive in a snowstorm and went to the house? Oh now I don't remember even doing that, when you catch me in an outrageous bald-faced lie. It's plain to me who's telling the truth and who's not. MO

Jen was adamant that she saw Karen’s SUV was outside the Albert’s’ home. Karen connected to John’s wifi at 12:36. How can she be at the Albert home and at John’s at the same time? As far as thinking she last saw him at the waterfall, who knows? Karen was obviously drunk and then woke up in a panic.

 

[OldCop]

This trial has shown me how compromised judges can be. Judges should be accountable for their actions. IMO

Big thumb on the scale of justice. IMO

A big thumb and a pile of poop.

 

[Tortoise]

The evidence suggests that JOK was knocked immediately unconscious from the head injury. How do you suppose he got himself up off the road and over to the flag pole?

I'd appreciate it if you could provide a link to him being knocked immediately unconscious, I couldn't find it in Dr Scordi-Bello's testimony, which I've linked here. I see many people referencing it here as if it's fact, but could find nothing in the media either.

I've transcribed the only portion I can find as regards to him maybe being incapacitated, with no time frame given:

Dr Scordi-Bello

Timestamp 57.42

Q. With respect to the injuries to Mr O’Keefe’s head, and the onset of hypothermia, what if any opinion do you have with regard to the timing of those respective to each other?

A. Well I do believe the injuries, the blunt impact injuries, were sustained first, these are not injuries that are immediately lethal, this is not something that would cause death in seconds and therefore Mr O’Keefe may have been incapacitated by the injuries or knocked out if you will, and was not able to get himself into a warmer environment and therefore hypothermia set in. Given the environmental conditions and given the clothing on the body, or the lack of clothing I should say. No big jacket or anything like that.

Q. Now when you say something as far as some type of injury being immediately lethal can you give an example of that?

A. The one that forensic pathologists like to use is a gunshot wound to the head that goes from one side to the other disrupting the neural systems of the brain and causing the person to immediately drop and die within seconds or milliseconds. This is not that kind of injury this is an injury that took a little bit of time to develop as is manifested by the fact that we have some bleeding, which means that the heart is still pumping and blood is still coming out of the vessels.

Q. And so I guess to that point as far as what was it from your examination and your findings and your review of the overall materials that leads you to believe that the head injuries happened prior to hypothermia setting in?

A. Again the findings of hypothermia, the blunt impact injuries, if someone is um, it’s not completely out of the realm of possibility that someone becomes hypothermic and then falls as a result, um but the hypothermia would continue along with the brain injuries that took some time to develop, so in my opinion I believe the impact, the injury to the head came first, Mr O’Keefe was most likely incapacitated or unable to move into a warmer environment and then the hypothermia set in.

Q. If you can, what if anything can you say as to the sort of um in contrast to the sort of the bullet to the head or the instantaneous death, what if anything can you say as to the time that this would take to manifest itself as far as the injury to the head and the hypothermic state?

A. Again I can’t give you specifics, I would say this was definitely in the matter of minutes, many minutes or hours.

 

[shotgun09]

A big thumb and a pile of poop.

Thinking about the perception of Judge Cannone's favoritism for the CW, which has been blatant to many I presume, I have come to believe that she is now just letting it go. She knows this case will end up hung again, or KR will be acquitted. She knows it's a loosah for the CW. It always has been. But her heavy handed tipping the scales just proves to me, that she may be quietly saying to the CW ( DA Morrisey).."I have done everything I possibly can for you in this case...don't re-try it again"

MOO

 

[waldojabba]

Hi, @waldojabba. You’re right, of course, about the biggest disservice being given to John O’Keefe. This case sticks in my craw. I honestly thought early on that KR probably hit JOK, probably didn’t mean to, and probably didn’t even realize it until the next day.
Then came Trial #1. Wait. What?
I agree that LE will often push a little harder when it is one of their own who has died under unexplained circumstances, but what if the outcome points towards other LE or their family? Do you let chips fall where they may or do you circle the wagons? I do not believe in coincidence in most cases nor am I a conspiracy theorist, but my gosh, how do you explain the things that have gone on in this case?
Now comes Trial 2 (which in MOO should not be happening). Why go ahead with a trial that they knew had resulted in 2 ng verdicts in the last trial? Because if they did not retry Ms. Read, it would necessitate a new investigation to find justice for JOK. Hopefully, more experienced and professional investigators would find out how a decent Boston Police officer really ended up dead on the front lawn of another BPD officer. Maybe certain residents the Town of Canton were afraid of what a new investigation would reveal. So, we head into Trial 2 with a cast of characters from the DA’s Office on down that reads like a twisted tale from the twilight zone. We have the DA who announced his opinion before the last trial started, the judge who should have recused herself and who is lovingly referred to as “Auntie” by several of the witnesses in the case, the fired trooper, the drinking ATF agent who was crushing on MS Read, the missing dog, the sold-under-value home where the body was found that had carpet ripped up and new paint in the basement, the multiplying tail light pieces, and the complete lack of evidence that JOK was ever hit by a car. You can’t make this stuff up.
Was MS Read responsible for the death of JOK? Maybe, but why on earth would this circle of friends have needed to lie, to switch stories, to destroy and/or manufacture evidence, to circle the wagons to protect someone. Who is inside that circle? It certainly isn’t Karen Read.

Right on the money in your assessment.
JMO

 

[lohrtabitha]

It's my understanding, since no link has been forthcoming from OP, that the glass which had John's DNA on it was the glass he left with from the Waterfall. The bartender Rebecca Trayers from Waterfall (link below) was asked and affirmed they stocked similar glasses. Also Dr Wolfe (second link below) was asked why he didn't go to the Waterfall and obtain one of their glasses to conduct his experiment, which was not objected to by the defense.

Rebecca Trayers:

from 2.52.00 Dr Wolfe ARCCA:

Also from trial 1:

"Andre Porto, a forensic scientist at the Massachusetts State Police Crime Lab, testified that a DNA profile found on a drinking glass at the scene matched O’Keefe’s.

“The DNA profile from this item is at least 510 nonillion times more likely if it originated from John O’Keefe,” Porto said."
Forensic scientists in Karen Read murder trial say O’Keefe’s DNA was on taillight, cocktail glass

The glass on the bumper which was not a match for John's glass, was a match for at least one of the pieces of glass collected from Fairview Road. Now that we have new information that John got out of the car with his glass and Karen's glass, I suspect the defense will have to acknowledge that he was carrying an additional glass this time.

 

[jepop]

Jen was adamant that she saw Karen’s SUV was outside the Albert’s’ home. Karen connected to John’s wifi at 12:36. How can she be at the Albert home and at John’s at the same time? As far as thinking she last saw him at the waterfall, who knows? Karen was obviously drunk and then woke up in a panic.

RBBM
And that memory lapse along with;
*being drunk the night before;
*not having a pristine memory when in a panic;
*Notably imo, not conniving or trying to hide her mental state and confusion from others when she found John hadn't come home;
and finally ( drum roll)
* not taking her shoes off inside John's place when she was in a panic (this is one seriously ridiculous string for Brennan to redraw at trial X 2, just dumb moo,).

None of the above is evidence that she either manslaughtered or murdered JOK with her Lexus. Jmo

 

[GmeCS]

I must be watching a different trial. Karen Read seems incredibly guilty. The things that are treated like some sort of conspiracies seem very typical to me. If you ask me what time I ate breakfast this morning, I can't tell you. Especially if you ask me was it 7:37 or 7:52? And did you talk to your husband about it? I mean, yeah. It's normal life. I don't think she thought she killed him, necessarily, but she knew she hit him. It's why she called 53 times. I'm so confused by all the people who want her to be not guilty and have others blamed. Of course, we just finished Delphi. So nothing shocks me anymore.

Exactly. I’ve followed this case from day one and there’s such an odd allegiance to Karen, as if they know her personally and they know for a fact there’s no way she could have done this. Nothing Jen McC said seems unusual to me at all. No one is perfect on the stand when asking to recall that much detail after so long.
The social media blitz has been very effective for Karen, to the point that her ride-or-die fans refuse to even consider that she might have hit him accidentally in anger while intoxicated, which is still a crime. There is not a lack of evidence in this case, but even if there was video of the incident, they would find some way to ignore or justify it. All of this is MOO of course, but there is zero evidence he set foot in that house.

 

[tara83]

Exactly. I’ve followed this case from day one and there’s such an odd allegiance to Karen, as if they know her personally and they know for a fact there’s no way she could have done this. Nothing Jen McC said seems unusual to me at all. No one is perfect on the stand when asking to recall that much detail after so long.
The social media blitz has been very effective for Karen, to the point that her ride-or-die fans refuse to even consider that she might have hit him accidentally in anger while intoxicated, which is still a crime. There is not a lack of evidence in this case, but even if there was video of the incident, they would find some way to ignore or justify it. All of this is MOO of course, but there is zero evidence he set foot in that house.

Just as there is zero evidence she hit him with her car.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Exactly. I’ve followed this case from day one and there’s such an odd allegiance to Karen, as if they know her personally and they know for a fact there’s no way she could have done this. Nothing Jen McC said seems unusual to me at all. No one is perfect on the stand when asking to recall that much detail after so long.
The social media blitz has been very effective for Karen, to the point that her ride-or-die fans refuse to even consider that she might have hit him accidentally in anger while intoxicated, which is still a crime. There is not a lack of evidence in this case, but even if there was video of the incident, they would find some way to ignore or justify it. All of this is MOO of course, but there is zero evidence he set foot in that house.

I totally agree! Karen has so many followers with rose coloured glasses on. It totally amazes me. Personally, I think Karen was a very insecure, jealous and abusive girlfriend. I have even thought that she might have hit John with a glass and broke it even before got out of the car. Could the cuts on his arms or his head be the result of a jealous insecure Karen? Just saying my thoughts…
<modsnip - unnecessary>

 

[Spectrix]

I'd appreciate it if you could provide a link to him being knocked immediately unconscious, I couldn't find it in Dr Scordi-Bello's testimony, which I've linked here. I see many people referencing it here as if it's fact, but could find nothing in the media either.

It's covered in detail in Doctor Sheridan's Testimony.
Doctor Sheridan's exact words: "...once this impact occurred Mr O'Keef would have been unconscious..."
"...he would immediately, from the point of impact, he would have been unconscious."

Video cued to 26:13

 

[HarmonyE.]

Exactly. I’ve followed this case from day one and there’s such an odd allegiance to Karen, as if they know her personally and they know for a fact there’s no way she could have done this. Nothing Jen McC said seems unusual to me at all. No one is perfect on the stand when asking to recall that much detail after so long.

I have no "allegiance" to Karen Read. None whatsoever. Don't know her, don't want to know her.

My allegiance is to the rule of law. And especially as a Norfolk County resident, I am absolutely horrified that an innocent citizen can be set up by PROVEN bad cops (see lead investigator Michael Proctor and his superiors) and the district attorney who has some personal investment here. (see Michael Morissey).

If it could happen to her, it could happen to any one of us in this county.

As for Jen, why do you think she lied to the FBI? Do you really think that's normal behavior by someone with nothing to hide? None of her lies are memory problems, and despite her claim to the contrary, memories don't get better over time.

 

[Tortoise]

It's covered in detail in Doctor Sheridan's Testimony.
Doctor Sheridan's exact words: "...once this impact occurred Mr O'Keef would have been unconscious."

Video cued to 26:13

Thank you!

 

[kuromiiiilove]

I totally agree! Karen has so many followers with rose coloured glasses on. It totally amazes me. Personally, I think Karen was a very insecure, jealous and abusive girlfriend. I have even thought that she might have hit John with a glass and broke it even before he even got out of the car. Could the cuts on his arms or his head be the result of a jealous insecure Karen? Just saying my thoughts…

<modsnip - unnecessary>

Here’s the thing - there’s many of us who say they would NOT get along with Karen in real life, but still see the obvious forensic issues with the case. I don’t have an allegiance to Karen. I have an allegiance to scientific and investigative standards which were not met in this case.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Here’s the thing - there’s many of us who say they would NOT get along with Karen in real life, but still see the obvious forensic issues with the case. I don’t have an allegiance to Karen. I have an allegiance to scientific and investigative standards which were not met in this case.

Here’s my thing . I don’t have any allegiance one way or the other. But, I am not totally convinced yet that she was not culpable in some way to John’s death. To me, the forensic evidence is skewed both by the defence and prosecution. Paid experts will try to prove whatever they are paid to prove.

I would just like to see more than anything is justice for John O’keefe.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

The only part of that fairlytale that can actually be proven is that there was a snowstorm.

Kind of leaves a giant hole in your plot, doesn't it?

No.
There is no plot in what I said.