MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #23 Retrial

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  • #901
I'm not sure what you mean about cherry-picking. I think Karen's statements are being discussed alongside the current witness testimony. We don't need to wait until trial is over to discuss it, unlike the jury.
The OP recommended others to watch that particular documentary. My question to the OP asked why they don't recommend to others to simply watch the entire trial, where all information can be gathered as a whole, not cherry-picking individual statements to come to a lopsided conclusion. I think watching the entire trial is the most helpful for others to understand all of the facts. I hope that helps you to understand.
 
  • #902
Who lied about going to which house? And when you say others at the scene, if you’re talking about the Alberts, McCabes, Robert’s and O’Keefes, I don’t trust any of them.
KR lied. She said she left John at the bar and never drove to the house that night. That's a BIG telling lie. There were many people there including first responders that saw and heard her. That's a lot of people to not trust, sooo many, all involved in a huge cover-up and framing of an innocent woman? That's what I don't trust. It sounds like a big fabricated SODDI defense and an illogical one at that. AJMO
 
  • #903
KR lied. She said she left John at the bar and never drove to the house that night. That's a BIG telling lie. There were many people there including first responders that saw and heard her. That's a lot of people to not trust, sooo many, all involved in a huge cover-up and framing of an innocent woman? That's what I don't trust. It sounds like a big fabricated SODDI defense and an illogical one at that. AJMO
Sounds like she was super drunk and couldn’t remember.
 
  • #904
KR lied. She said she left John at the bar and never drove to the house that night. That's a BIG telling lie. There were many people there including first responders that saw and heard her. That's a lot of people to not trust, sooo many, all involved in a huge cover-up and framing of an innocent woman? That's what I don't trust. It sounds like a big fabricated SODDI defense and an illogical one at that. AJMO
So why did Jen lie to the FBI? Why would a so called innocent friend and witness have a reason to lie?
 
  • #905
It gives the accused's version and perspective, to compare and constrast with the trial evidence. That's what's missing from the trial, if Karen chooses, like last time, not to take the stand. IMO

It seems she wanted people to hear what she has to say, but just not in court.
It is a common legal practice not to put defendants on the stand . Nothing shocking there.
 
  • #906
So why did Jen lie to the FBI? Why would a so called innocent friend and witness have a reason to lie?
It wasn’t a lieee, she merely misunderstood/misremembered/was traumatized/thought it was true at the time/was a matter of semantics! Don’t you know whatever Jen says in this moment is what happened, and we are supposed to disregard all her previous contradictions?!
 
  • #907
I'm sure if they can, they will. They should also watch that doc, KR cooks her own goose, MO.
You're making my point with your comment "KR cooks her own goose". You're making a decision from watching one comment from one documentary instead of taking the time and effort to watch all testimony from the trial. I hope people never get themselves into a situation that requires a trial and others make a guilty decision from hearing one comment made in a documentary.
MOO
 
  • #908
Let’s break some of your assertions down.

- “He died from exposure” That’s not a medical consensus. Dr. Mindy Hull testified that the cause of death was blunt force trauma, and exposure was only listed as a contributing factor. The injuries to his arm, head, and body are not consistent with being hit by a car, and there’s a legitimate debate among forensic experts about whether those wounds were perimortem or postmortem.
-“Broken taillight found at the scene” Yes, and there’s security footage showing the taillight intact after the alleged hit. Additionally, Sgt. Proctor is seen manipulating that taillight in the sallyport after the SUV had been seized. That’s documented video evidence. The issue isn’t whether tail light fragments were found; it’s how and when they got there, and why the ones “found” were clean, despite snow and melting conditions.
-“No definitive proof Proctor framed KR” There’s rarely “definitive proof” in conspiracy or corruption cases, but we do have multiple examples of altered police reports, missing logs, contradictory testimony, a destroyed phone, and a lead investigator with personal ties to key witnesses. Its a pattern of misconduct that warrants scrutiny, especially when the investigation skipped key steps like obtaining search warrants for 34 Fairview, even though John was supposed to attend a party there, and was found dead directly outside.
-“Karen said she hit him” Wrong. Just wrong. She never definitively said that. Her comment ‘Did I hit him? Could I have hit him?’ was made in panic, while searching for her boyfriend’s frozen body in the snow. She also said, “What if he got hit by a plow?” and “What if he walked somewhere?” - do you think that means she murdered him with a snowplow? No. We don’t convict people based on emotionally distraught hypotheticals uttered in real time, especially when other statements and physical evidence contradict that narrative.
-“She lied about going to the house” Or she was confused, intoxicated, and traumatized, just like EVERY witness in this case who gave inconsistent statements, including officers. The only difference is that Karen’s inconsistencies have been weaponized, while everyone else’s are brushed aside.
No matter what way you break it down, KR's own actions and words are what will convict her, MO.
It's plain to see, IMO, that the SODDI defense concocted of irrelevant accusations, with no proof, will not pull the wool over the jury's eyes this time because KR just couldn't keep quiet. I believe she's guilty but not of 2nd degree murder. That's an error in judgement by the Prosecution, IMO. But KR did in fact cause John's death, MO.
 
  • #909
No matter what way you break it down, KR's own actions and words are what will convict her, MO.
It's plain to see, IMO, that the SODDI defense concocted of irrelevant accusations, with no proof, will not pull the wool over the jury's eyes this time because KR just couldn't keep quiet. I believe she's guilty but not of 2nd degree murder. That's an error in judgement by the Prosecution, IMO. But KR did in fact cause John's death, MO.
IMO KR did not cause JO's death as he was not hit by a car.
 
  • #910
It wasn’t a lieee, she merely misunderstood/misremembered/was traumatized/thought it was true at the time/was a matter of semantics! Don’t you know whatever Jen says in this moment is what happened, and we are supposed to disregard all her previous contradictions?!

It's jen's world and we're just lucky to be in it.
 
  • #911
She texts her brother to pick her up at the albert house but doesn't bother to text him before he gets there that she changed her mind and didn't want to be picked up?
 
  • #912
Sounds like she was super drunk and couldn’t remember.
Sounds like she knew exactly what happened and fled the scene, trying at first to say she'd never been there. When that was shown to be false, that's when the only thing left was SODDI...oh make that a BIG plural DUDES, going after everyone and anyone that was there. Throwing the whole pot of spaghetti at the wall. AJMO
 
  • #913
So why did Jen lie to the FBI? Why would a so called innocent friend and witness have a reason to lie?
And what was this lie?
 
  • #914
  • #915
No matter what way you break it down, KR's own actions and words are what will convict her, MO.
It's plain to see, IMO, that the SODDI defense concocted of irrelevant accusations, with no proof, will not pull the wool over the jury's eyes this time because KR just couldn't keep quiet. I believe she's guilty but not of 2nd degree murder. That's an error in judgement by the Prosecution, IMO. But KR did in fact cause John's death, MO.
You’re certainly entitled to your opinion. But opinions alone don’t meet the legal standard for guilt. Saying “Karen’s own words will convict her” doesn’t hold if those words were panicked speculations, taken out of context, or contradicted by physical evidence (which they are).

I feel that I addressed your earlier claims about the taillight, the medical examiner’s findings, Proctor’s documented behavior, or the inconsistencies in witness statements. If those details are truly “irrelevant,” it should be easy to explain why. But just dismissing them without engaging doesn’t strengthen your argument. It actually makes it look like the defense might be right, precisely because no one wants to touch the uncomfortable facts that don’t line up with preconceived opinions. Let’s not forget: in a court of law, it’s not enough to say “I believe.” You need proof. And if the state had slam-dunk evidence, it wouldn’t need to rely on inconsistent stories, shady police work, or vibes. MOO.
 
  • #916
She texts her brother to pick her up at the albert house but doesn't bother to text him before he gets there that she changed her mind and didn't want to be picked up?
I suspect she was picking something up from her brother to continue her partying.
MOO
 
  • #917
I suspect she was picking something up from her brother to continue her partying.
MOO
I suspect something happened in that house that made it necessary for her to remain there. JMOO
 
  • #918
RN just admitted that he saw Karen alone in the car - no John.
 
  • #919
The witness seems highly studied in her specific protocol but I am very surprised she didn't know what hematocrit was. JMOO
I saw that. IMO, the CW may not be able to find 'expert' witnesses who want to be associated with this case. The CW case, IMO, is going to explode and collapse as time and testimony continues. It may become famous or infamous. Who then wants to have been associated????
 
  • #920
Does anyone know the difference in height between KR & JO?
If he was a few inches taller than KR wouldn't his head have been visible to the witness who just testified?
 
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