NOT GUILTY MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #37 Retrial
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IF I WAS PART OF THIS JURY ....
1 The question of "did KR vehicle hit JOK" is answered easily.
He was found dead, and it was from a head wound, but ALL the evidence told us his injuries were not consistent with being hit by a vehicle. Also, it told us the wound to the head would have done him in right away with no mobility, but where he was found could not have caused that wound with a fall, so he must have suffered it elsewhere (meaning he was moved). It also told us he was bitten by a dog BEFORE his head wound/death but that did not kill him. The evidence also said he exited KR vehicle and traveled 36 steps (which, not coincidentally, is the distance from the road to the residence), at which point his phone signal stopped communicating, which is commonly caused by going in a building. What happened after that is not known, but there were people, a party, and a dog, and in the morning he's found dead in the yard. No one hit him with a vehicle, and the cops did a shoddy investigation (with evidence backed by actual pics showing there had to be planted evidence). KR did not kill him. Not sure who did, nor how, but it wasn't even by a vehicle.
2 For me, the issue of deciding how I feel about the OUI charge is harder. BUT after weighing it, I know exactly what I would now be saying in deliberations. [To follow]
My thinking on the matter....
I think there is some maybe-evidence to support an OUI happened. Not sure it rises to BARD level, but maybe it does for some? At first, I felt maybe I could be flexible there to agree with whatever is needed.
I understand the idea of splitting the verdict and giving a smaller conviction to cw and O'Keefe family, as a compromise. In the big picture, is it necessary to aim to win it all?
But as I reflected further, I moved to a staunch NG on the OUI too. In essence, "giving" the cw and the OK's a small win is wrong. It's rewarding the cw PR points and conviction for doing a crappy investigation, filing a crappy case with a devious prosecutor, and trying to bankrupt an innocent woman WHO WOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN THROUGH ANY OF THIS IF THEIR INVESTIGATORS HAD DONE THEIR JOB. Nor should it offer REAL value to the OK family to gratuitously punish a woman who factually did NOT harm their son (even if they have wrongly believed she did).
In addition, even if she MAY HAVE been OUI at a later point, it was NOT during the time in question of JOK death, but rather at a random later time. IOW, it is NOT really a lesser included of the crime being charged, per se, but rather a "by the way, maybe she was OUI at a different time, so let's throw that in as a side issue." Considering that, it's a clear NG as a lesser included to JOK death itself (which she and her actions had NOTHING to do with).
Nor do I think it would be justice of any sort, even if she actually did happen to OUI later, (a) to have her subject to the whims of being sentenced by JudgeB with that bias already shown, and (b) to in any way compound the massive cost KR has already paid in years of her life, and costs to do so, to defend against charges from a shoddy LE and cw who abandoned any true pursuit of justice in favor of lies and deceit to try to get her convicted in any way possible. On top of all that, let's recognize that an OUI conviction obtained in THIS way, with this evidence, the cw would never take this to trial against anyone else. Never. There's no justice in singling out KR on a jinky OUI because you tried to unjustly convict her of something else and she didn't do it. That's persecution.
At this point, even though I am still soft on my thought of whether OUI occurred, I would have to be STAUNCHLY against her being found G of anything. In the bigger picture, it would not be right. imo
Would I give in if needed to keep from a hung jury? Perhaps, but before that I'm arguing STRONGLY and EXTENSIVELY for others to change, and explaining why, and not easily changing from how I see justice as outlined above.
Just my 2c.
1 The question of "did KR vehicle hit JOK" is answered easily.
He was found dead, and it was from a head wound, but ALL the evidence told us his injuries were not consistent with being hit by a vehicle. Also, it told us the wound to the head would have done him in right away with no mobility, but where he was found could not have caused that wound with a fall, so he must have suffered it elsewhere (meaning he was moved). It also told us he was bitten by a dog BEFORE his head wound/death but that did not kill him. The evidence also said he exited KR vehicle and traveled 36 steps (which, not coincidentally, is the distance from the road to the residence), at which point his phone signal stopped communicating, which is commonly caused by going in a building. What happened after that is not known, but there were people, a party, and a dog, and in the morning he's found dead in the yard. No one hit him with a vehicle, and the cops did a shoddy investigation (with evidence backed by actual pics showing there had to be planted evidence). KR did not kill him. Not sure who did, nor how, but it wasn't even by a vehicle.
2 For me, the issue of deciding how I feel about the OUI charge is harder. BUT after weighing it, I know exactly what I would now be saying in deliberations. [To follow]
My thinking on the matter....
I think there is some maybe-evidence to support an OUI happened. Not sure it rises to BARD level, but maybe it does for some? At first, I felt maybe I could be flexible there to agree with whatever is needed.
I understand the idea of splitting the verdict and giving a smaller conviction to cw and O'Keefe family, as a compromise. In the big picture, is it necessary to aim to win it all?
But as I reflected further, I moved to a staunch NG on the OUI too. In essence, "giving" the cw and the OK's a small win is wrong. It's rewarding the cw PR points and conviction for doing a crappy investigation, filing a crappy case with a devious prosecutor, and trying to bankrupt an innocent woman WHO WOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN THROUGH ANY OF THIS IF THEIR INVESTIGATORS HAD DONE THEIR JOB. Nor should it offer REAL value to the OK family to gratuitously punish a woman who factually did NOT harm their son (even if they have wrongly believed she did).
In addition, even if she MAY HAVE been OUI at a later point, it was NOT during the time in question of JOK death, but rather at a random later time. IOW, it is NOT really a lesser included of the crime being charged, per se, but rather a "by the way, maybe she was OUI at a different time, so let's throw that in as a side issue." Considering that, it's a clear NG as a lesser included to JOK death itself (which she and her actions had NOTHING to do with).
Nor do I think it would be justice of any sort, even if she actually did happen to OUI later, (a) to have her subject to the whims of being sentenced by JudgeB with that bias already shown, and (b) to in any way compound the massive cost KR has already paid in years of her life, and costs to do so, to defend against charges from a shoddy LE and cw who abandoned any true pursuit of justice in favor of lies and deceit to try to get her convicted in any way possible. On top of all that, let's recognize that an OUI conviction obtained in THIS way, with this evidence, the cw would never take this to trial against anyone else. Never. There's no justice in singling out KR on a jinky OUI because you tried to unjustly convict her of something else and she didn't do it. That's persecution.
At this point, even though I am still soft on my thought of whether OUI occurred, I would have to be STAUNCHLY against her being found G of anything. In the bigger picture, it would not be right. imo
Would I give in if needed to keep from a hung jury? Perhaps, but before that I'm arguing STRONGLY and EXTENSIVELY for others to change, and explaining why, and not easily changing from how I see justice as outlined above.
Just my 2c.
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Panic attack? Worried that if they convict on OUI she gets charged with Manslaughter? I can see someone being nervous about the lack of clarity
@KristinaRex
Plan for 10-20 minutes before a verdict is read in open court. Watch LIVE ON #WBZ on TV and all streaming platforms. I'll be in the courtroom. #WBZ
2:40 PM · Jun 18, 2025
Plan for 10-20 minutes before a verdict is read in open court. Watch LIVE ON #WBZ on TV and all streaming platforms. I'll be in the courtroom. #WBZ
2:40 PM · Jun 18, 2025
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CourtTV are saying there are rumours there is a verdict now....
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How do the jury forms get signed and it doesn't count a few minutes later? Any jury I ever sat on once the everyone agreed and forms signed IT WAS DONE no changing minds after the fact. I'm really confused.
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Bedrow was saying might have been confusion on how they filled out the form and that's why they wanted to take it back - who knows but we supposedly have a verdict jmo
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I've got whiplash here
There was a trial several years back (no cameras, only tweets and live blogging) that upon polling of the jury, one juror said "NO, that is not my verdict", the judge sent them back to deliberate (after everyone picked their jaws up off the floor, I'd imagine) and an hour or so later they came back with that same verdict, and said juror agreed it was their verdict. Pretty wild stuff.
I hope we don't encounter anything of the sort in this trial, should we be lucky enough to even get a verdict.
Yeah...this ain't justice.
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I'm late to the party, is there a live link to the trail?
Really???
Yes, because the person would of AT LEAST decided on what THEY did want. Thankfully they did. HOPING so much it is the right way.
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