MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #6

[Evey]

I have been thinking along the same lines - that the SUV connection is more attenuated than "a dark SUV was parked on BSR during the timeframe of the murder." Perhaps Mom recalled an earlier incident involving a dark SUV, or a dark SUV was caught on a couple of video cameras a day or two earlier, or another runner/walker reported a noteworthy incident involving such a vehicle. Whatever it was, LE thought it was sufficient to try to tie the SUV to the scene.

Maybe they caught him drive by the house more than once and e had rental or new car plates or out of state ones(a smart perp would rent a car from out of town for this to throw off people) or maybe he drove a bit too slow but even then or if caught on cameras( shouldn't traffic cams be looked at unless he only took roads without them?$ that means he had on stuff to ask his identity but what besides a hat ans glaases wouks be needed? And how many of us might go with our neighbor or family friend without thought if they stopped us to say something happened to our family? I mean I wouldn't but a lot would. But lack of screams heard and lack of reported smoke on such a bad day for a fire is odd to me. Maybe he's an old teacher she was closer with. Or as I've said before someone she tutors which could mean the cars a parent she car or someone she volunteers with. Could he have hit her with the car knocking her out and then put her in the SUV drove somewhere then drove back to dump the body knowing it wouldn't be found by the dogs since she ran there often and assuming it's not safe to hide it because he lives with someone or has no place to hide it cause he lives in an apartment or condo.

 

[Evey]

I agree.
Someone that lives close, but not real close.
Someone that didn't have his DNA in the system, but, wanted to destroy evidence so if he is ever arrested in the future, his DNA wouldn't be in the codis.

To me that shows intent to commit future crimes if not already having done past ones where he was able to destroy his DNA and maybe he wanted to disfigure her to make it mkt able to ID her because he worried they'd think of him.

 

[Evey]

I understand. I'm just saying I cant think of anything specifically that he would have in his car because he did these kinds of activities that would tie him to the crime. Beyond what might be in anyone's car.

Maybe he planned to take his family's or go or wife camping or hiking later that day I have plausible deniability to say oh it was in my car because we went camping. I believe what was used he's owned many years or months because he planned this and rather buy it ahead of time to seem less suspicious to family and friends, especially if he's someone who'd have no reason to own one and it would stick out to them that he did and especially so close to it. And knew everyone would assume the person must have a job that uses one. This person clearly spends a lot of time on the weekend potentially following her wouldn't someone note their husband or bf being gone regularly during weekends before a certain time? Maybe he has a on his own time type job where he can say he was driving to his whatever. Or is rich and can spend even more time obsessing. Can't they somehow track someone visiting her social media a creepy amount? Even with a burner phone wouksnt it show location? And if they believe the phone was tossed onto his property and wanted to search it but could they deny cops access to it? That and saying no to DNA would be fishy and could her phone have pinged after she left to run somewhere besides her route?if she ran it the day before the dogs would still pick her scent up and I'm sure he knew that and the thing I read saying the father searching in the woods or whatever for her kept confusing the dogs and how long it seems like it took to find her with them makes me think the scent wasn't as strong as it would have been if she ran that day. But what if they looked other places first? Or even somehow they searched and he was able to dump the body and run because if the body wasn't there at first that explains any taking longer and especially if maybe they put something on the body to mask the smell of death.

 

[Evey]

Good thought, but I think the way it was worded was that "A dark SUV was spotted around the time of her murder, parked along BSR near where her body was found."

That could mean more spots down road if he was waiting for her to drive by or the person who owns it lives by and was parked at the end of his driveway waiting, why else not have footage yet have a big house unless you have cameras but disabled them and don't want the cops having the video? Is it possible for anyone to mark how many spots between the start of her route and where she was found that they could have been parked off of? Saying near makes me think not directly next to it cause that would be obvious

 

[Evey]

I believe that is correct as well. To their point, there may have ALSO been other info about it, but I don't know that it would be needed, since I think It is under suspicion purely by being seen at the crime seen around the time of the crime.

Also are there any spots farther down the road where she could be ambushed and someone could be parked to toss her in his vehicle? Maybe we are assuming it happened in the spots right there by the body when it's farther away to hide some fact knowing most wouldn't realize it maybe like I said the end of a driveway where the house is so nice it should have a camera yet doesn't and where they didn't give DNA or close to where her cellphone last pinged. If her cell did ping off her normal route during her supposed jog that could show us something.

 

[Evey]

What if the killer is who gave this good tip about the SUV? Since they like putting themselves in the investigations often and if any of these uber type companies have drivers with an SUV they could have paid them to pick them up there but never showed so that people would report the SUV and not realize it's just some driver waiting for the person who called and said to meet them there but with a burner phone from a location not near. Not likely but if done early enough before then maybe the driver would see the news and assume it's unrelated and panic when he sees people think his car is the killers car and now won't come forward out of fear for whatever reason.

 

[Kickoff61]

He may have planned to do this one day, but it doesn't mean he planned it with supplies. Going on facts, the police believe he had wounds on him. I do not think he expected to have those wounds. Therefore, that could be when he realized he left enough DNA behind to 'spontaneously' decide to get rid of it and knew a way to do it. Then, he may have not had something on him to do so, which could explain him getting something at that point. (only one area of speculation).

 

[Kickoff61]

It was reported they are doing advanced testing regarding a 'facial' from the DNA. That may be a turning point in all this, once those results come in.

 

[ThinkHard]

Quick question. Is there a way to see if a convicted felon is out on bail? It would either be in the NY or CT system.

If someone was to serve 12 years for a crime in NY and a concurrent sentence of 15 years in CT....and he was convicted in 05/06....is it possible he's been out on bail? Perhaps even more so if he came from an old money family?

 

[Evey]

What do you consider to be the coverup tools?



VM was a 27yo college graduate employed by Google in NYC. Fairly certain that VM could not be coaxed into a house or a vehicle.



If UnSub is burning VMs feet, what evidence got onto her feet that he was trying to destroy?

I cannot agree that Perp was destroying evidence as a reason for the fire. LEO has his DNA so it was not destroyed. This Killer chose fire. I suspect the killer had a pile of nicely gathered sticks and twigs ready. If not, there was plenty of small timber to scoop, if needed. In the end, she is placed on the pyre. Perp left the crime scene.

There is absolutely no reason to believe that there was another crime scene involved. There is absolutely no reason to believe that VM was ever in anyone's vehicle other than one belonging to her own relatives.

While I was her age when it happened and can say I also wouldn't be coaxed there's always if she thought someone was having a heart attack or something or the person is a family friend and said they need to come with them cause so and so is a true the hospital. Neither of which I would fall for but I'm jaded and read to many awful things to know not to and would just call 911. As for the fire how easy would it be to get the DNA from under her nails if he knew it was there? I was thinking he didn't plan for that part and while he likely had the stuff for the fire prepared I don't think he had stuff to chop off hands or whatever it would take to remove it. Which shows it didn't go as he planned so maybe before he could come back to be extra careful about DNA they had already found her. And side note.., I wonder what if someone told someone that legally wouldn't want to come forward knowing the cops would suspect him if he said for instance so and so wanted to meet to buy drugs but so and so never showed but because he's a drug dealer with a history of criminal stuff maybe he wouldn't come forward despite having a sick feeling over it. This person could be a young dude who borrowed the dude who died in that car accidents torch since someone said he would own one for work and perhaps he couldn't live with knowing his friend used his own thing didn't that?

 

[ThinkHard]

It does appear since someone may have smelled smoke according to a local here, then it was a 'fire'. Not just someone doing spot on injuries. That is indication it was a fire to destroy DNA or trying to rid of everything, starting fire in 3 locations on her.

Someone pointed out the smell of smoke could be from him burning her clothes and not neccasrily burning her....meaning you could have burned specific areas on her with some kind of lighter or torch, and then in a pile set her clothes on fire in the ground with some sticks and leaves to blend the type of ash left.

I don't know this is what happened...but someone else mentioned it and I think it's a valid possibility.

 

[ThinkHard]

Wouldn't there be a no burn thing up if the area could easily go up in flames? I forget the term but Oregon has it something like burn ban for no outside open fires if the weather has the area that dry and if so I bet we can find out that and then the person or persons who smelled smoke would have been concerned and especially if it smelled odd and they i feel would have been outside to smell it or near a window and then likely also saw smoke. For instance if some place near my house is burning stuff we can smell it and see smoke usually. So I now find it more suspiciois and think the kill site was somewhere else even in the back of the SUV there'd be room and he dropped her off there with enough stuff that he assumed would start the woods on fire but either it went out or she was found too quickly afte. Or he was trying to burn off DNA before at the kill site and lives near and they smelled the smoke but couldn't see any because it's hard to believe someone wouldn't be alarmed by smoke and the smell of body burning. And wouldn't they see birds circling over dead meat and wouldn't any dogs nearby bark and smell it? Maybe familial DNA could catch him so he wasn't hoping he burned all his DNA away from spots he know touched him

People are still allowed to have closed fire pits, at least they were here....so it's possible he thought others one of those....so im guessing it wasn't intense enough to cause concern....meaning it didn't not smell like a neighbor was having a bonnfirevto burn things....and you need a permit for those anyway regardless of draughts (again at least here)....my point is I think the fact he didn't call it in gives us some indication of the size.

Additionally there is no way she was found "too quickly" after....they knownthe murder window is btw 1-3pm. They found her body via scent dogs at 8:20....the fire department was called around 11. She definelty was not found still on fire.

Birds do not circle bodies within hours of death either...that is not until decay kicks in after a few days.

 

[Evey]

VM rode a bus from NYC to Worcester. Good to know, thanks. I've never read anywhere anything about taking her to the bus station or picking her up from a bus station as it was always to the train station which lead me to erroneously believe she traveled by train. Obviously, I am obsessed with finding this young lady's killer. What happened to her and her family is unfair. Her killer needs to be sent to a special place.

Oh, my apologies are extended for I may have been misunderstood. Indeed, Evey and everyone's opinion is valid and of value. We discuss the ideas and opinions to decide the most probable answer is usually the most basic one. Occam made sure of that.

I wish one of her friends would join us. Let us know more about her routine. What time did she typically depart and arrive back in NYC? What hours did she work? Who was her last boyfriend? Did she live alone? I would have hired a PI to use a finetooth comb thru my daughter's NYC belongings searching for clues. How did she travel when in NYC to work and home? Did she leave work early on Fridays?

At least three of my buddies work for huge corps and take a half day off because the bosses believe in the team being able to accomplish the work expeditiously. PeopleSoft does it. CocaCola does it by employees earning days off during every four week period. Time Warner in FL does it for their employees. It's an earned perk when one reaches a certain level or status. A buddy in Cali works in the Valley with a group of IT program writers who uses hover boards to go from cubicle to cubicle. The same bunch used electric scooters to putt around from cubicle to cubicle before that. Their building has an entire floor dedicated to workout and exercise. All to say, this may have been similar to the type environment VM worked in and we need to know that. Did she exercise in the same building where she worked?

Because the problem here is that this young, single lady was definitely targeted while doing something she only did twice each month on a particular day of the week, Sunday, and at a certain time on that day, she leaves home to run around one o'clock. The odds of this horrific occasion being partially or completely happenstance are nil or almost nonexistent.

Do we know if anyone from town with mutual friends could somehow let them know of the forum In case they want to help? Do we know I feel she or her family went to church each Sunday?also one idea since she hasn't crohns could she have a doctor she comes to town on weekends to treat her? A family doctor who could work weekends. Or some other health issue she has to come home for doctor wise that's been kept quiet? I agree definitely not happenstance also my cab driver theory isn't what I think is most likely but just what crossed my mind when I hadn't my creepy driver. Also since she's a google exec how hard would it be for most to reach that in the time frame pf her new job?maybe it just sounds higher up but it seems that would take years

 

[Evey]

As usual, we have very little information and this is all speculation without facts. LE has the information re: their crime scene investigation, autopsy, etc, to know how this was done. The cause of death with medical examiner report has not even been released to my knowledge.

They said strangulation at firstbut it hasn't been in articles lately. Also if I was the house across from the path and a car was parked there I would call the cops or investigate(likely call the cops just in case) and do we even know if this was a big fire that fitetrucks had to put out? And what if she owned the SUV and the killer drove it away and Le just isn't saying? I know they said thekiller may have owned it and I doubt t was hers but this crossed my mind when reading now long of a bus ride that would be and now I wonder if she ended up at the same station Kv took and hoe often and if they were friends more than we know,

 

[Evey]

He may have planned to do this one day, but it doesn't mean he planned it with supplies. Going on facts, the police believe he had wounds on him. I do not think he expected to have those wounds. Therefore, that could be when he realized he left enough DNA behind to 'spontaneously' decide to get rid of it and knew a way to do it. Then, he may have not had something on him to do so, which could explain him getting something at that point. (only one area of speculation).

I agree

 

[Evey]

Someone pointed out the smell of smoke could be from him burning her clothes and not neccasrily burning her....meaning you could have burned specific areas on her with some kind of lighter or torch, and then in a pile set her clothes on fire in the ground with some sticks and leaves to blend the type of ash left.

I don't know this is what happened...but someone else mentioned it and I think it's a valid possibility.

What about the person smelling its neighbor was burning her clothes in a fire pit? That's one thought since flesh has a different smell but then why not burn it in someone's furnace or fireplace? Unless they did it farther away from the body to confuse LE

 

[Evey]

People are still allowed to have closed fire pits, at least they were here....so it's possible he thought others one of those....so im guessing it wasn't intense enough to cause concern....meaning it didn't not smell like a neighbor was having a bonnfirevto burn things....and you need a permit for those anyway regardless of draughts (again at least here)....my point is I think the fact he didn't call it in gives us some indication of the size.

Additionally there is no way she was found "too quickly" after....they knownthe murder window is btw 1-3pm. They found her body via scent dogs at 8:20....the fire department was called around 11. She definelty was not found still on fire.

Birds do not circle bodies within hours of death either...that is not until decay kicks in after a few days.

True. Do you know who smelled the smoke and how many houses close to it there are or areas to burn something without someone seeing. Even a campground if there are any.

 

[Evey]

If the guy was on foot and needed to pass by a lot of homes without being seen to get home would he either have to be sneaky and maybe been seen or to have known the owners and had some valid excuse to be on their property? Like would any of the big close homes maybe hire gardeners or anything and anyone that's woukd be burning stuff like burning fallen stuff like a gardener type thing or landscaper? Knowing that the owner would be suspected more than them unless they have a background. As far as the question about bonds I feel there would be some jail records showing who's in jail and who's out on bond? Not sure though but this person could like you said have family money and maybe that has helped them stay free, maybe the family owns many cars. How many homes near own more than two cars would you say? Obviously I would assume this car is being parked inside or out of sight and maybe has some excuse keeping it from not being used so that the family doesn't suspect and maybe they're not even around much cause they're in vacation and don't know he's home from school or something

 

[Evey]

I also wonder if any stolen suvs has been reported in a however many miles away radius cause may have belonged to him could mean borrowed or stolen also some rich person who has a caretaker when not home or employee that could easily take it or someone who knows where a neighbor keeps a spare key and knows they won't be home or are on vacation is always an idea as well. I don't believe this car belongs to the guy, he wouldn't be dumb and leave a car so obviously there if he worried about them looking the license plates up unless he is so ballsy and also owns some app showing near cops or some police scanner

 

[Evey]

And does anyone know how many homes between the area she was found and her home and maybe in a certain radius are vacation rentals? If the person was by chance an ex local who lives somewhere else and came back to do this that is. Or someone who saw her the night before or week before when scouting for a victim and planned it some. Maybe even a month if they stayed longer.