Madeleine McCann General Discussion Thread #27

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INITIAL CONCLUSIONS

English and Portuguese police get together to analyse the results of Eddie and Keela’s searches.

- What we can deduce at this stage is that only the McCanns are implicated. The dogs did not detect blood or cadaver odour other than with them.

- From now on we have the certainty that there was a body behind the sofa before being taken into the parents’ bedroom.

- If the blood found behind the sofa is that of the little girl, we can assume that she died there.

- That could explain why the sofa was pushed up against the curtains.

- In Madeleine’s bedroom and on her bed, there was no cadaver odour.

- On the other hand, the odour on the soft toy indicates that she was holding it when she died….

These conclusions do not, for the moment, constitute proof. If the laboratory results are positive, and only in that case, we will have our proof.

http://truthofthelie.com/the-book/chapter-16/
 
WHY DID THE McCANNS GET ALL THIS SUPPORT FROM THE BRITISH EMBASSY IN PORTUGAL FROM THE NIGHT OF MADDIE'S DISAPPEARANCE? IT IS UNPREDENTED

Thursday May 3, 2007 :

John Buck, the British ambassador in Portugal, called Alípio Ribeiro, the Polícia Judiciária’s national director, on the night that Madeleine disappeared from the Ocean Club.
At around 11 p.m., approximately one hour after the child’s disappearance was reported, Alípio Ribeiro had to interrupt a private dinner in order to listen to the diplomat.

Friday May 4/ Saturday May 5, 2007 (conflicting reports):
Ambassador Buck drove from Lisbon to Praia da Luz. (Distance is approximately 3 hours by car.)

Saturday May 5, 2007
Drove in from Lisbon "to be with the family after they begged him for help."
Embassy spokesman said Buck was driving down to do everything for the McCanns that he could.
Ambassador Buck and 3 "family liaison officers from Leicestershire police held a private meeting with the McCanns "at the resort" on the afternoon of May 5th.
Announced to reporters that 3 British police agents had arrived from Leicestershire to help with the investigation. He stated that the officers would act as a "liaison" between the McCanns and Portuguese police and between the Portuguese and British police. "..Mr. Buck was there to introduce the family liaison officers to the McCanns..."
The 3 "family liaison officers were flown out "at the request of the Foreign Commonwealth Office.

Leicestershire spokeswoman said the 3 officers were there "simply to assist the family" and were not going to have anything to do with the investigation at this point.
Told reporters that the investigation had been "intensive and extensive".
Reportedly Ambassador Buck "accompanied the couple...during the search on May 5"
Reported to have been "...with the family throughout their ordeal..."
Ambassador Buck's intervention was credited by the McCann's family and friends as being the only reason that the search for Madeleine was upgraded to a major investigation.
"Despite being convinced - for reasons they have refused to make public - that Madeleine is still in the Algarve, Interpol have been alerted about her disappearance and checks were being made at every Portuguese port and airport."

Sunday May 6, 2007
Ambassador Buck attended church service officiated by Father Jose Manuel Pacheco.

Monday May 7, 2007
Ambassador Buck apparently returned to Lisbon (or elsewhere, as later articles stated that he RETURNED to the Algarve on Tuesday May 8th.)

Tuesday May 8, 2007
Ambassador Buck traveled to the Algarve and met the McCanns. Reports were that the meeting lasted an hour.
He gave a television interview in which he said he had been in touch with Portuguese ministers and the prime minister Jose Socrates, and senior police chiefs who assured him everything possible was being done to ensure the safe return of Madeleine. Buck said that he was making sure the links between the British and Portuguese officers were working, after concerns had begun to be expressed regarding the experience and expertise of the Portuguese investigators.
He made a statement to the media announcing the arrival of additional British experts
Said that investigators were in close touch with Interpol and Europol
Said the McCanns were "very grateful for their efforts"
Ambassador Buck was interviewed by the Leicester Mercury. Quote: "As you know, I spent quite a lot of time with the McCann family on Friday and over the weekend. "I wanted to come down today to see Kate and Gerry again and to continue to support our consular staff, who have been working on this for a number of days."

http://newsoutlines.blogspot.com.au/p/british-foreign-office-timeline.html
 
Wednesday May 9, 2007

An email between Portimao and Lisbon of 9 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "Personal Information" exemption: Section 40 (2) and (3) of the Freedom of Information Act 2000.
Further information emerged regarding the 2 additional experts Buck had announced on Tuesday May 8th.
Ambassador Buck said they were "kidnapping experts" and had joined the 3 other British investigators who had been in Portugal since Saturday
"... two 'Cracker-style' criminal behaviour experts from Britain flew into the Algarve yesterday to join investigators..."
They were from CEOP and their dispatch had been organised by the British Foreign Office.
"A spokeswoman for the CEOP said the move was unprecedented and had been organised by the Foreign Office."

Thursday May 10, 2007
A Foreign Commonwealth Office internal email of 10 May 2007 (12a) was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a (1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State
A Foreign Commonwealth Office internal email of 10 May 2007 (13aa) was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a.(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State

Friday May 11, 2007
An email between the Foreign Commonwealth Office and John Buck of 11 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a. (1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State
An email between John Buck and the Foreign Commonwealth Office of 11 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a. (1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State
An internal Foreign Commonwealth Office email of 11 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a.(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State

http://newsoutlines.blogspot.com.au/p/british-foreign-office-timeline.html
 
Monday May 14, 2007

Ambassador Buck present in Praia da Luz
Spoke to national chief of police in Lisbon and chief investigating officer in the Algarve.
Thanked journalists for respecting the McCann's privacy and said there were impressive resources allocated to the investigation. Said the resources are primarily Portuguese but that there were a number of British police officers working closely with their Portuguese colleagues in the Algarve.
Arrived late for a scheduled news conference and found journalists fleeing toward Casa Lilliana where a search was underway.

Tuesday May 15, 2007
An email between Lisbon and Foreign Commonwealth Office of 15 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a.(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State

Wednesday May 16, 2007
A letter from John Buck to Foreign Commonwealth Office of 16 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a.(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State

Thursday May 17, 2007
An internal document was sent by the Foreign Office ordering British diplomats 'to avoid offering support' to Robert Murat unless charges were presented against him." (Note: Murat was made an arguido on May 15 and the Foreign Office internal memo was allegedly dated May 17.)

Tuesday May 22, 2007
An email between Portimao and Foreign Commonwealth Office of 22 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a. (1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State

http://newsoutlines.blogspot.com.au/p/british-foreign-office-timeline.html
 
Thursday May 24, 2007

An email between Portimao and Foreign Commonwealth Office of 24 May 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a.(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State
Ambassador Buck, consular officials and British police had an "informal" meeting with the McCanns "over tea." Reports stated that the McCann's travel plans were up for discussion. The following day Portuguese police issued a detailed description of the "possible suspect".
Reports were that ""...The British embassy duly applied pressure on the Portuguese authorities to find more flexibility in their secrecy laws..."

Friday May 25, 2007
Ambassador Buck met again with the McCanns and British police.
Portuguese police issued detailed description of possible abductor.

Sunday May 27, 2007
News emerged that the McCanns had held discussions with Gordon Brown
Personal intervention of Gordon Brown was reported. Gordon Brown was reported to have urged police to give more public details after the McCanns voiced their concern about the lack of disclosure by Portuguese detectives.

June 18, 2007
A Foreign Commonwealth Office internal email of 18 June 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a.(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State

June 19, 2007
An email between John Buck and Foreign Commonwealth Office (FCO)/ Portimao of 19 June 2007 was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "International relations" exemption: Section 27.1.a.(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice—( a) relations between the United Kingdom and any other State

June 21, 2007
An email between Foreign Commonwealth Office (FCO) and Foreign Commonwealth Office (FCO)/ Lisbon of of 21 June 2007 (19b) was the subject of a Freedom of Information (FOI) request asking for Ambassador Buck's communications related to the McCanns. This email (or a portion of it) was withheld based on "Personal Information" exemption: Section 40 (2) and (3) of the Freedom of Information Act 2000.

http://newsoutlines.blogspot.com.au/p/british-foreign-office-timeline.html
 
September 10, 2007

Ambassador John Buck was replaced as the British Ambassador to Portugal by Alexander Ellis. It was announced that Buck had "left the diplomatic service".

The press release stated that Mr. Ellis would take up this appointment with "immediate effect."

Background Info re: Alexander Ellis (Source: Guardian/Wikileaks)

"Ellis, a former school teacher, joined Britain's Foreign and Commonwealth Office in 1990 and moved progressively up the chain to Ambassador. Lisbon was his first foreign tour as a diplomat, followed by postings in Brussels, Madrid and London." He has also served as Director of the EU Enlargement Team in London (2001-2003) and as adviser on energy policies and trade issues (2005-2007) under EC President Jose Barroso.

September 21 2007 (Source: Guardian/Wikileaks)
On September 21, newly-arrived British Ambassador Alexander Wykeham Ellis informed US Ambassador Hoffman that "it was the British police that developed the current evidence against Madeleine McCann's parents."

Ellis informed the Ambassador that former British Ambassador John Buck had accepted a private-sector position at a UK gas company and that his departure had nothing to do with bilateral issues.

"Without delving into the details of the case, Ellis admitted that the British police had developed the current evidence against the McCann parents, and he stressed that authorities from both countries were working cooperatively".

He commented that the media frenzy was to be expected and was acceptable as long as government officials keep their comments behind closed doors.

October 2007
In October 2007 an individual made an FOI request (under the Freedom of Information Act 2000) to the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) for information concerning communications between the then Ambassador to Portugal John Buck and the Portuguese police on the subject of the disappearance of the child Madeleine McCann. Reference: FS50188322.
Some information was released straight away and some information was withheld.
Since that time the Foreign Office released "most" but not all of the requested information. (Withheld information noted above.)
The Information Commissioner's Office reviewed the matter and in March 2009 decided that the Foreign Office had complied with section 1(1)(a) of the Freedom of Information Act but had breeched section 1(1)(b) of the Act by failing to provide the information within the specified time limit.
The commissioner upheld the Foreign Office decision to withhold some information, stating that the public interested in withholding the information outweighed the public interest in disclosing the information. The ICO also decided that personal information withheld was done so correctly.

http://newsoutlines.blogspot.com.au/p/british-foreign-office-timeline.html
 
I am still not convinced the McCanns killed their daughter though.

I jump up and down off the fence.

Not being funny but a maintenance man for example could easily have access to any flat ......something always a bit off about it. I do think though she sadly died in the apartment that night.

We shall see.
 
December 3, 2007

A memo was leaked to the Belgian newspaper La Dernière Heure regarding a diplomat's concerns about the case.

Questions have been raised as to whether the memo may have been written by Ambassador Buck or someone in his office, although diplomat's name was not published in the newspaper articles.

The leaked memo was routed through the British diplomatic mission in Brussels
The leaked memo was sent "just days" after Madeleine disappeared.

The leaked memo warned the Foreign Office of concerns regarding the McCanns and warned of the risks of siding with the McCanns in public.

The diplomat immediately had doubts after being sent to Praia da Luz due to what he considered to be inconsistencies in their testimonies and "confused declarations" as to the whereabouts of the McCanns and their friends on May 3.

The memo mentions instructions "from London" that consular staff "overstretch their authority and put pressure on Portuguese authorities."

The memo refers to orders sent the previous day from the Foreign Office in London commanding embassy staff to provide all possible assistance to the McCanns and that the McCanns "had to be "accompanied at all times during any contact with the Portuguese police" by a member of consular staff or by British police officers sent out from the UK.

He also mentioned their lack of cooperation with the Portuguese police

The memo was sent *from the Algarve* to the Foreign office days after Madeleine "went missing"

Quote: "With the greatest respect, I would like to make you aware of the risks and implications to our relationship with the Portuguese authorities, if you consider the possible involvement of the couple. "Please confirm to me, in the light of these concerns, that we want to continue to be closely involved in the case as was requested in your previous message."

The Belgian report also stated that Portuguese detectives believe it is possible Madeleine died as the result of an accident on May 3 in the family's holiday apartment and that her parents hid and later disposed of her body with the help of their friends.
They said it is highly significant that almost all of the diplomats involved at the outset have now been taken off the case.

December 12, 2007

Reports emerged that British diplomats had been ordered by the Foreign Office to "avoid offering support" to Robert Murat.

The claim was made that an internal Foreign Office memo had sent the instructions three days after Murat was made an arguido (Note: May 15 is the date Murat was made an arguido.)

According to Spain's El Mundo newspaper, the order was justified due to the "specific nature of the case".

The internal memo allegedly stated that British diplomats were to "avoid offering support" to Murat unless charges were pressed against him.

http://newsoutlines.blogspot.com.au/p/british-foreign-office-timeline.html
 
Actually the more i read about it, and some stuff lately coming forward as old news I think it was the maintenance man.

When someone tries to point towards someone else it is usually a lie...he tried to point to gypsies.....

I have always thought the child knew the person, died in the apartment, and that is why the dogs scented there...He would easily be able to get out the front door and I have always thought who ever killed her used the empty apartment above to hide her body. The dogs indicated outside that apartment.

He would also know where to hide her body.

I hope finally we get resolution for the child. It just all makes sense to me now.

What was bugging me was how could someone get in the front door or out, but if they had a copy of that key, and had been in the apartment recently they would see things perhaps.

Yes it makes sense.

Probably way off base lol...but its the pointing elsewhere that gets me everytime....
 
I know this is in one of the worse papers in Portugal but they are saying its an ex employee of OC now deceased.

http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/detalhe/n...-judiciaria-investiga-pista-de-suspeito-morto

It is the suspect number one, an ex-employee of the Ocean Club who was conflictingly dismissed (before the disappearance of Madeleine). Triangulation showed he was in PDL with no motive to be there, though he lived in Lagos. He died in 2009 in a tractor accident that hasn't been yet clarified. He was 40. His widow has been interviewed by the PJ in order to determine where he concealed the body.
This is what I heard on CdM TV.


Any thoughts anyone?
 
I know this is in one of the worse papers in Portugal but they are saying its an ex employee of OC now deceased.

http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/detalhe/n...-judiciaria-investiga-pista-de-suspeito-morto

It is the suspect number one, an ex-employee of the Ocean Club who was conflictingly dismissed (before the disappearance of Madeleine). Triangulation showed he was in PDL with no motive to be there, though he lived in Lagos. He died in 2009 in a tractor accident that hasn't been yet clarified. He was 40. His widow has been interviewed by the PJ in order to determine where he concealed the body.
This is what I heard on CdM TV.


Any thoughts anyone?

I wouldn't trust this paper until I hear it from the mouth of PJ..

Hope Madeleine did not find this fate and she is still alive!

There was an email to Prince Charles at the time about a woman who was also sacked from her job in PDL and as a revenge she took Madeleine.. I thought this was also fully investigated.

There are no real news and CdM is making it up, as usual!
 
I am still not convinced the McCanns killed their daughter though.

I jump up and down off the fence.

Not being funny but a maintenance man for example could easily have access to any flat ......something always a bit off about it. I do think though she sadly died in the apartment that night.

We shall see.

Hi GoldenGirl,

I did not realise that you are on the fence. You came across to me as if you predicted that Maddie was dead. I am actually surprised that not many on this site think that Maddie is dead.

I an Australian but well-travelled and I was in Granada, Spain, in May 2007 and saw Maddie's photo at the airport, thought what a lovely little girl and felt sorry for the parents. That night in my hotel room, I watched the news and an interview of the parents. Because of their body language (which I used to teach in a Business Diploma course), I immediately suspected the parents.

When I returned to Australia, I started wondering if others felt the same way as I did so I did a search on google and found the Mirror Forum so I joined it. I have been posting my theories and observations of the McCanns and their friends ever since on various forums or just lurking.

Therefore, I am surprised that the crime sleuthers here cannot see through the McCann propaganda and read their body language. They seem to have been brainwashed by the spin of Clarence Mitchell and the McCanns in the British media and will get a big shock when the truth comes out. This is the crime of the century imo due to their deception.

I am therefore passionate enough about getting justice for Maddie to post information here which new posters may not have read before or for people like you who are on the fence.

Believe me, I have looked at every angle. My background is in psychology, lecturing, counselling and life coaching. I recognise narcissists when I see and hear them on TV. I feel so sorry for the twins who will one day wake up to the fact that their parents not only neglected them but probably abused Maddie to her death and then made money out of her demise using contributions from the public to donate to the fund for their legal defence, fraudulent libel cases, lies, blackmail, bribery, intimidation of witnesses and deceived many by acting like the poor victims.

I can only ask what do they know about Gordon Brown, Blair and his ex-Ministers, to have been afforded this amount of protection for six years already. I do not understand Cameron's part in this but he could be protecting some of his Ministers too. The only thing which makes sense to me is that many of the main players in this case were part of an elite pedophile gang organised by Brian Kennedy and the Tapas9 were part of it too. I have written many posts on this topic in the past which was considered tabou. But I did not make copies of them.

IMO it is glaringly obvious why many have lied on their behalf and/or protected them. In our society, some would rather be charged with murder than pedophilia! But pedophilia is big business especially if you have a pretty blonde 3yo to whom you can apply professional makeup, photograph and let out to others in return for cash and then blackmail them in return for covering up for you when you decide that her time on this earth has ended because she is going to start school soon and might tell her teachers about it all perhaps in an innocent way.

I read a recent case where the young girl who had been sharing a bed with her father for years and had been sexually abused told her neighbour that she was jealous that her father had suddenly taken an interest in her younger sister so he was not sharing her bed any more! The neighbour reported it to the police.

IMO Maddie was an unwanted child for some reason - did not sleep hence the charts of their fridge, was demanding of Kate, could have had health problems, etc. Parents who had not been able to conceive naturally often have problems with IVF. The Catholic Church does not agree with it either.

But because of the DNA, I have often wondered whether Maddie was adopted, whether Gerry was the father, whether Kate actually conceived her or used a surrogate, whether Maddie had CHARGE Syndrome (which affects the DNA apparently) or some other health problem due to her baggy eyes in some photos as well as the coloboma and their refusal to give the PJ her health records. It appears that the McCanns told the PJ that the children shared the same toothbrush so did the McCanns give the PJ something which belonged to Maddie only or was it Amelie's DNA they were trying to make a match with?

IMO this case is all smoke and mirrors. But I still have faith that with the forensic and circumstantial evidence plus the analysis of mobile and creche records, that even without finding the body (which the PJ are again searching for), they will have to face justice in a court of law in 2014/15. But what they will be charged for, I have no idea.

But IMO it will be interesting as to who will be charged and with what as one of them was possibly the perpetrator and the other one is covering up for the other just like the Ramseys.

There seems to be more evidence against Kate due to the cadaver scent on her clothes, CuddleCat, bloody footprints found in 5A and on the car, and her book to justify their innocence but when I saw the bruises on her arms and face in photos, I cannot help but think that Gerry abused her into submission.

IMO Gerry is the Mastermind of the whole scheme to make Maddie into a cash cow for them by copying parts of other successful abduction/murder cases and putting the best parts into this case. IMO this was a well-planned premeditated murder possibly for over a year since the twins were born.

But if Kate is the one who is charged eventually as there is more forensic evidence against her, and if she is innocent of Maddie's demise, will she put Gerry in?

Or was it one of the other Tapas men?

There is absolutely IMO no evidence of an abductor and, if so, it was Gerry faking one.
 
I know this is in one of the worse papers in Portugal but they are saying its an ex employee of OC now deceased.

http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/detalhe/n...-judiciaria-investiga-pista-de-suspeito-morto

It is the suspect number one, an ex-employee of the Ocean Club who was conflictingly dismissed (before the disappearance of Madeleine). Triangulation showed he was in PDL with no motive to be there, though he lived in Lagos. He died in 2009 in a tractor accident that hasn't been yet clarified. He was 40. His widow has been interviewed by the PJ in order to determine where he concealed the body.
This is what I heard on CdM TV.


Any thoughts anyone?

Whitewash?
 
Hi GoldenGirl,

I did not realise that you are on the fence. You came across to me as if you predicted that Maddie was dead. I am actually surprised that not many on this site think that Maddie is dead.

I an Australian but well-travelled and I was in Granada, Spain, in May 2007 and saw Maddie's photo at the airport, thought what a lovely little girl and felt sorry for the parents. That night in my hotel room, I watched the news and an interview of the parents. Because of their body language (which I used to teach in a Business Diploma course), I immediately suspected the parents.

When I returned to Australia, I started wondering if others felt the same way as I did so I did a search on google and found the Mirror Forum so I joined it. I have been posting my theories and observations of the McCanns and their friends ever since on various forums or just lurking.

Therefore, I am surprised that the crime sleuthers here cannot see through the McCann propaganda and read their body language. They seem to have been brainwashed by the spin of Clarence Mitchell and the McCanns in the British media and will get a big shock when the truth comes out. This is the crime of the century imo due to their deception.

I am therefore passionate enough about getting justice for Maddie to post information here which new posters may not have read before or for people like you who are on the fence.

Believe me, I have looked at every angle. My background is in psychology, lecturing, counselling and life coaching. I recognise narcissists when I see and hear them on TV. I feel so sorry for the twins who will one day wake up to the fact that their parents not only neglected them but probably abused Maddie to her death and then made money out of her demise using contributions from the public to donate to the fund for their legal defence, fraudulent libel cases, lies, blackmail, bribery, intimidation of witnesses and deceived many by acting like the poor victims.

I can only ask what do they know about Gordon Brown, Blair and his ex-Ministers, to have been afforded this amount of protection for six years already. I do not understand Cameron's part in this but he could be protecting some of his Ministers too. The only thing which makes sense to me is that many of the main players in this case were part of an elite pedophile gang organised by Brian Kennedy and the Tapas9 were part of it too. I have written many posts on this topic in the past which was considered tabou. But I did not make copies of them.

IMO it is glaringly obvious why many have lied on their behalf and/or protected them. In our society, some would rather be charged with murder than pedophilia! But pedophilia is big business especially if you have a pretty blonde 3yo to whom you can apply professional makeup, photograph and let out to others in return for cash and then blackmail them in return for covering up for you when you decide that her time on this earth has ended because she is going to start school soon and might tell her teachers about it all perhaps in an innocent way.

I read a recent case where the young girl who had been sharing a bed with her father for years and had been sexually abused told her neighbour that she was jealous that her father had suddenly taken an interest in her younger sister so he was not sharing her bed any more! The neighbour reported it to the police.

IMO Maddie was an unwanted child for some reason - did not sleep hence the charts of their fridge, was demanding of Kate, could have had health problems, etc. Parents who had not been able to conceive naturally often have problems with IVF. The Catholic Church does not agree with it either.

But because of the DNA, I have often wondered whether Maddie was adopted, whether Gerry was the father, whether Kate actually conceived her or used a surrogate, whether Maddie had CHARGE Syndrome (which affects the DNA apparently) or some other health problem due to her baggy eyes in some photos as well as the coloboma and their refusal to give the PJ her health records. It appears that the McCanns told the PJ that the children shared the same toothbrush so did the McCanns give the PJ something which belonged to Maddie only or was it Amelie's DNA they were trying to make a match with?

IMO this case is all smoke and mirrors. But I still have faith that with the forensic and circumstantial evidence plus the analysis of mobile and creche records, that even without finding the body (which the PJ are again searching for), they will have to face justice in a court of law in 2014/15. But what they will be charged for, I have no idea.

But IMO it will be interesting as to who will be charged and with what as one of them was possibly the perpetrator and the other one is covering up for the other just like the Ramseys.

There seems to be more evidence against Kate due to the cadaver scent on her clothes, CuddleCat, bloody footprints found in 5A and on the car, and her book to justify their innocence but when I saw the bruises on her arms and face in photos, I cannot help but think that Gerry abused her into submission.

IMO Gerry is the Mastermind of the whole scheme to make Maddie into a cash cow for them by copying parts of other successful abduction/murder cases and putting the best parts into this case. IMO this was a well-planned premeditated murder possibly for over a year since the twins were born.

But if Kate is the one who is charged eventually as there is more forensic evidence against her, and if she is innocent of Maddie's demise, will she put Gerry in?

Or was it one of the other Tapas men?

There is absolutely IMO no evidence of an abductor and, if so, it was Gerry faking one.

My nephew is just turned 4, has problems sleeping and eating, and he is a very much a wanted child.

I have two families for friends who both have IVF children, these children are not different to other children..

Sorry but I see all of your theories as very conspirational with no touch of reality.

There is no proof Madeleine is dead. And in reality there is 50/50 possibility that she is either still alive or dead.
 
Actually the more i read about it, and some stuff lately coming forward as old news I think it was the maintenance man.

When someone tries to point towards someone else it is usually a lie...he tried to point to gypsies.....

I have always thought the child knew the person, died in the apartment, and that is why the dogs scented there...He would easily be able to get out the front door and I have always thought who ever killed her used the empty apartment above to hide her body. The dogs indicated outside that apartment.

He would also know where to hide her body.

I hope finally we get resolution for the child. It just all makes sense to me now.

What was bugging me was how could someone get in the front door or out, but if they had a copy of that key, and had been in the apartment recently they would see things perhaps.

Yes it makes sense.

Probably way off base lol...but its the pointing elsewhere that gets me everytime....


For that, that she died in apartment and dogs scented there, there should be a time for developing a cadaver scent, 4 hours at least and in young children maybe even never because they have a lack of muscle mass.

So she should have been lying dead in that apartment for more than 4++ hours or even longer for the dogs to find the cadaver.

These dogs also both react to dry blood from live humans. ( this is from the mouth of their trainer!)
 
My nephew is just turned 4, has problems sleeping and eating, and he is a very much a wanted child.

I have two families for friends who both have IVF children, these children are not different to other children..

Sorry but I see all of your theories as very conspirational with no touch of reality.

There is no proof Madeleine is dead. And in reality there is 50/50 possibility that she is either still alive or dead.

So we choose to differ.

I am not being judgmental myself about Kate complaining in MSM reports about Maddie not sleeping since she was born and having sleeping charts on her fridge.

My daughter was born with a hole in her heart and I rarely slept myself for ages but that is what mothers do if they really love their children.

I am also not judgmental about women having IVF as I was an older mother and would have probably had IVF if I had not been able to conceive.

I will have to find you the old reports about Kate complaining about Maddie and how she was on duty up to 18 hours a day since she was born. Kate had to get help from her relations to care for Maddie. It appears that Maddie exhausted Kate. So was there anything wrong with Maddie's health?

I am also suggesting that with IVF, the DNA could have yielded a different result if one or other of the parents were not the real parents or if things belonging to Amelie were given to the PJ as it they were Maddie's.
 
I am also suggesting that with IVF, the DNA could have yielded a different result if one or other of the parents were not the real parents or if things belonging to Amelie were given to the PJ as it they were Maddie's.

But Amelie is also an IVF child :)
 
I know this is in one of the worse papers in Portugal but they are saying its an ex employee of OC now deceased.

http://www.cmjornal.xl.pt/detalhe/n...-judiciaria-investiga-pista-de-suspeito-morto

It is the suspect number one, an ex-employee of the Ocean Club who was conflictingly dismissed (before the disappearance of Madeleine). Triangulation showed he was in PDL with no motive to be there, though he lived in Lagos. He died in 2009 in a tractor accident that hasn't been yet clarified. He was 40. His widow has been interviewed by the PJ in order to determine where he concealed the body.
This is what I heard on CdM TV.


Any thoughts anyone?

IMO this is ludicrous. What is the date of this?
 
Actually the more i read about it, and some stuff lately coming forward as old news I think it was the maintenance man.

When someone tries to point towards someone else it is usually a lie...he tried to point to gypsies.....

I have always thought the child knew the person, died in the apartment, and that is why the dogs scented there...He would easily be able to get out the front door and I have always thought who ever killed her used the empty apartment above to hide her body. The dogs indicated outside that apartment.

He would also know where to hide her body.

I hope finally we get resolution for the child. It just all makes sense to me now.

What was bugging me was how could someone get in the front door or out, but if they had a copy of that key, and had been in the apartment recently they would see things perhaps.

Yes it makes sense.

Probably way off base lol...but its the pointing elsewhere that gets me everytime....

GoldenGirl, could you elaborate a bit more please or provide me with some links about the maintenance man theory?

I have that same itchy feeling that this was the job of somebody with inside knowledge. A crazy thought that I can't let go of, is that Maddie's body is still under Apartment 5A (or under block 5). Just look at how the building is constructed (up against a hill), which leaves a triangular shaped space beneath it. Or, put in another way, if you climb up the staircase to the patio of 5A, what sits behind the wall directly to your right, i.e. under the patio? This area is very well sealed, so smells don't get out, but the space could be accessible by a maintenance man, e.g. to repair the heating/radiator pipes going below the floors. If her body was dumped in that space, then it could explain why the cadaver dogs reacted in the area behind the sofa, since that's where there could be heating pipes going down (although I don't see any heating radiators on the pictures, did they use floor heating? Is there no central heating at all?) and some 'smell of death' could have slipped through. It could also explain the strange route the sniffer dogs took on May 4th/8th of 2007, i.e. outside the front door, to the left and then again go around the block. What if there is some maintenance entry into that area to which only that guy has a key?

Has this area/space under the block ever been checked?
 
For that, that she died in apartment and dogs scented there, there should be a time for developing a cadaver scent, 4 hours at least and in young children maybe even never because they have a lack of muscle mass.

So she should have been lying dead in that apartment for more than 4++ hours or even longer for the dogs to find the cadaver.

These dogs also both react to dry blood from live humans. ( this is from the mouth of their trainer!)[/QUOTE]

BBM1 Please give me a link to that as it is less in in young children.

BBM2: Please give me a link to that too as there are many types of dogs - sniffer dogs and cadaver dogs.
 
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