Madeleine McCann General Discussion Thread No. 24

[colomom]

I already told you I believed they were negligent, and yes I agree that she would not be missing if they had not been negligent! However, I do not believe they killed her.

Would you be so kind as to share your thoughts on Eddie and Keela?

Thanks, in advance.

 

[colomom]

This is beyond cruel IMO.

The more I hear about the PJ the more they sound like the Aruban LE who kept Natalee Holloways parents in the dark like this too.
Mr Rebelo who took over the investigation after disgraced cop Goncalo Amarol was removed never even spoke to the McCanns:waitasec:…….Even after they knew there was no evidence against them.
I think by this time they had gone too far down the line of smears and lies and couldn't, or wouldn't admit they were wrong.

What a way to run an investigation.

By this time the PJ believed that the McCanns were responsible for the death of their daughter and the concealment of her corpse.

What police force in the world would then open up their investigation to their prime suspects?

Can you think of another example where the parents were considered suspects and were still given access to the status of the investigation?

 

[april4sky]

By this time the PJ believed that the McCanns were responsible for the death of their daughter and the concealment of her corpse.

What police force in the world would then open up their investigation to their prime suspects?

Can you think of another example where the parents were considered suspects and were still given access to the status of the investigation?

Believed is the operative word colomom. And it's your right to believe them...I don't.

All lines of enquiry were supposedly still open.
Kate was also well aware she was an arguido and wasn't asking or expecting them to open their investigation...as you put it.
All Kate asked was.....

With regard to this latter point, I would be grateful if you were able to keep us informed to some degree as to how the investigation is going - what work is being done to help find our daughter etc.
I'm sure you will agree that this request is not unreasonable and is in fact humane.
*****
Not at all unreasonable for the parents of a missing child IMO.

And the PJ knew when they received that letter they had nothing to support their wild theory.

An example of a good professional investigation....the Shannon Matthews case a few months ago.

At no point did the UK police treat Shannon's mother the way the McCanns have been treated....She was treated with the respect and care due any parent of a missing child until they had real "evidence."

And the UK police didn't have to use smears and lies either...just damn good professional police work. :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[SleuthMom]

From Mrs. Mc Cann letter:

As her mother, the pain and anxiety I feel for her is indescribable and the feeling of helplessness overwhelming. The 'accusations' and media smearing, although upsetting, are very much secondary.

If they're truly "secondary" why to even bother to mention it. :shakehead:

It should be about a beautiful, innocent little girl who is still missing. She is the victim in all of this.

I agree 100% Kate. I am glad you don't see yourself as a victim as many people said here that you are.

 

[SleuthMom]

This is beyond cruel IMO.

What is beyond cruel?? Is there ANYTHING that needs a reply in that letter?

 

[SleuthMom]

Kate was also well aware she was an arguido and wasn't asking or expecting them to open their investigation...as you put it.
All Kate asked was.....

With regard to this latter point, I would be grateful if you were able to keep us informed to some degree as to how the investigation is going - what work is being done to help find our daughter etc.
I'm sure you will agree that this request is not unreasonable and is in fact humane.

lol I just realize she was ALREADY an arguida when she wrote this letter. April, come on...she is NOT serious! The police could have never shared anything with her when she was already an arguida for OBVIOUS reasons!

 

[april4sky]

lol I just realize she was ALREADY an arguida when she wrote this letter. April, come on...she is NOT serious! The police could have never shared anything with her when she was already an arguida for OBVIOUS reasons!

It's obvious you are finding all this amusing Sleithmom...Well I don't.
Kate McCann was very serious...and rightly so IMO.
She should have been treated with all the care and attention due any parent of a missing child unless there was real "evidence" not too. IMO

 

[SleuthMom]

It's obvious you are finding all this amusing Sleithmom...Well I don't.

I was laughing at the fact I did not see the time when she sent this letter. NOT about the letter itself, NOT about the case. If you thought that, you really need a chill pill.

She should have been treated with all the care and attention due any parent of a missing child unless there was real "evidence" not too. IMO

With all due respect April, what is the part of Arguida you don't understand? She was NOT a typical mom of a missing child, she was an arguida along with her husband!

 

[april4sky]

I was laughing at the fact I did not see the time when she sent this letter. NOT about the letter itself, NOT about the case. If you thought that, you really need a chill pill.

With all due respect April, what is the part of Arguida you don't understand? She was NOT a typical mom of a missing child, she was an arguida along with her husband!

With all due respect Sleuthmom I fully understand....maybe you don't. or maybe you are choosing not too.
I also understand thay are no longer arguidos....do you?

 

[SleuthMom]

With all due respect Sleuthmom I fully understand....maybe you don't. or maybe you are choosing not too.

I truly don't. Please explain it to me. How can the police share vital information about the case to a "person of interest" (arguido) without jeopardizing the investigation.

I am all ears...

 

[SleuthMom]

I also understand thay are no longer arguidos....do you?

I understand that but at the time of the letter they were.

 

[Salem]

By this time the PJ believed that the McCanns were responsible for the death of their daughter and the concealment of her corpse.

What police force in the world would then open up their investigation to their prime suspects?

Can you think of another example where the parents were considered suspects and were still given access to the status of the investigation?

And, contrary to some opinions (not necessarily on this board) it is not uncommon for someone who is guilty to do things like write letters and make telephone calls.

I will admit this letter sounds heartfelt.

Salem

 

[april4sky]

I truly don't. Please explain it to me. How can the police share vital information about the case to a "person of interest" (arguido) without jeopardizing the investigation.

I am all ears...

I suggest you read her letter more closely SleuthMom...At no time did she ask the PJ to share vital information.

But you won't understand if you don't want to understand.

 

[Salem]

*****[/I]
An example of a good professional investigation....the Shannon Matthews case a few months ago.

At no point did the UK police treat Shannon's mother the way the McCanns have been treated....She was treated with the respect and care due any parent of a missing child until they had real "evidence."

And the UK police didn't have to use smears and lies either...just damn good professional police work. :clap: :clap: :clap:

How do you know this? Do you believe the UK LE shared their investigation into Shannon's mom's activities with her? Was she not implicated in what happened to her daughter? Under no circumstances will I believe that UK LE police kept Ms. Matthews informed of their investigation into her activities. I am quite sure that they only let her know what they needed her to know so that she would "hang herself" so to speak.

Salem

 

[SleuthMom]

I suggest you read her letter more closely SleuthMom...At no time did she ask the PJ to share vital information.

But you won't understand if you don't want to understand.

This is what she said:

With regard to this latter point, I would be grateful if you were able to keep us informed to some degree as to how the investigation is going - what work is being done to help find our daughter etc.

She is asking to be informed!That's VITAL information in a missing child case when you're the arguida!

But you are right, you won't understand unless you truly want to and since you have an excuse/explanation for every single thing the parents do, reasoning won't work.
So we have to agree to disagree on this one. (and manyyyy others).

 

[daffodil]

By this time the PJ believed that the McCanns were responsible for the death of their daughter and the concealment of her corpse.

What police force in the world would then open up their investigation to their prime suspects?

Can you think of another example where the parents were considered suspects and were still given access to the status of the investigation?

John and Patsy Ramsey.

 

[Claycat]

Would you be so kind as to share your thoughts on Eddie and Keela?

Thanks, in advance.

I know that evidence from cadaver dogs is not always admissible in a court of law. The use of cadaver dogs is a search tool. Anything they find has to be backed up with DNA evidence.

I really don't know much about them, so I looked at an article about their training. I will post a link. The trainer was explaining different ways the dogs could get a false alert and why and how the problem could be fixed.

http://www.jonnijoyce.com/articles/archive/cadaver_dog.htm

Sometimes dogs give a false alert, because they are cuing from the signals of the handlers rather than the actual scents. Sometimes they are so anxious to please and receive their treats that they will give a false alert.

I'm sure some of them have a good percentage rate, but I don't believe there are any that are ever 100%. They are a good tool for law enforcement, but that's all. A conviction would never be arrived at based on cadaver dogs alone.

 

[april4sky]

How do you know this? Do you believe the UK LE shared their investigation into Shannon's mom's activities with her? Was she not implicated in what happened to her daughter? Under no circumstances will I believe that UK LE police kept Ms. Matthews informed of their investigation into her activities. I am quite sure that they only let her know what they needed her to know so that she would "hang herself" so to speak.

Salem

Salem I didn't say they should have shared their investigation with her.
Kate was already an arguido so she didn't expect them to share anything that they couldn't.
Her letter was a plea for them to tell her what they could about their search for Madeleine. Any parent in those circumstances would be desperate for news, as her letter clearly shows.

What I did say was...
At no point did the UK police treat Shannon's mother the way the McCanns have been treated....She was treated with the respect and care due any parent of a missing child until they had real "evidence."

I don't doubt they didn't share vital information with her but they would have talked to her to try to give her confidence about the search for her child. The liason officer assigned to her by the police would have done that.

Thats all Kate McCann wanted, someone to tell her how the search for her child was going.

It's normal in the UK under such circumstances to have liason officers assigned to a family in such a crisis so they don't feel lost.
Thats the least that should happen IMO.

I know liason officers were assigned to the families of Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman. Two young girls who disappeared a few years ago.
It's normal practice in the UK in such cases.
As well as humane IMO

 

[Salem]

Salem I didn't say they should have shared their investigation with her.
Kate was already an arguido so she didn't expect them to share anything that they couldn't.
Her letter was a plea for them to tell her what they could about their search for Madeleine. Any parent in those circumstances would be desperate for news, as her letter clearly shows.

What I did say was...
At no point did the UK police treat Shannon's mother the way the McCanns have been treated....She was treated with the respect and care due any parent of a missing child until they had real "evidence."

I don't doubt they didn't share vital information with her but they would have talked to her to try to give her confidence about the search for her child. The liason officer assigned to her by the police would have done that.

Thats all Kate McCann wanted, someone to tell her how the search for her child was going.

It's normal in the UK under such circumstances to have liason officers assigned to a family in such a crisis so they don't feel lost.
Thats the least that should happen IMO.

I know liason officers were assigned to the families of Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman. Two young girls who disappeared a few years ago.
It's normal practice in the UK in such cases.
As well as humane IMO

Okay - I understand better now. However, keeping in mind that Kate was considered an arguido at the time she wrote the letter - how do you think her treatment was different from Matthews after she was named a suspect and arrested?

I do believe the McCann were treated respectfully prior to their suspected involvement in the case. Gerry said on a number of occasions that they had daily/weekly meetings with the PJ for status updates. If this case would have happened in the US, all of the Tapas 9 would have been subjected to lie detector tests, etc. There would have been no allowance for the fact that they were tourists, etc.

The laws in Portugal are somewhat different than the laws in the UK, AU or US. Kate was given arguido status so that she could refuse to answer questions. In my opinion, this was an easy out for her. When a person in named a suspect in the US - it is not so they can refuse to answer questions, but because it is highly likely they committed the crime accused of. The PJ believed they had evidence and that more evidence would be forthcoming after the highly specialized testing was completed at FSS. In essence, I think the PJ did the McCanns a favor by Portugal's standards. Unlike how it would be interpreted in our countries.

Salem

 

[colomom]

And, contrary to some opinions (not necessarily on this board) it is not uncommon for someone who is guilty to do things like write letters and make telephone calls.

I will admit this letter sounds heartfelt.

Salem

Such is the technique of a master manipulator.