Madeleine McCann General Discussion Thread No. 25

[seagull65]

I have a question.....I pop on here from time to time, and Im sorry if this was discussed already, but WHAT would their motive be to only kill Madeleine?? Didnt they try and try to have a baby, and finally had maddy and they were REALLY happy? and if they didnt like being parents to her after all that time trying to have a child, why would they go out and try to have another one (and ended up with twins)
I guess my final question is........what motive do they have?? just curious as to what you all think!

There wasn't any motive for them to deliberately kill M, but what if it was accidental, as a result of doping for example, or through the simple negligence of leaving her alone for hours at a time night after night, she could have died in an accident in the room. Or what if she accidentally got hold of recreational drugs of theirs and ingested them. In any of these cases, they would have been culpable for negligence or worse.
For me the weirdest point in the case is the way they reportedly left these toddlers alone every evening when they went out, and somehow (a) didn't expect them to wander (or even wake and be distressed), and (b) were not concerned about them getting hurt on their own in the apartment. It just does not make sense.
And in that one interview, it was totally peculiar the way Kate said, "and I know she would never have left the apartment, she just wouldn't ever do that." (That's not an exact quote, but I'm sure you have all heard that audio online before.) Why? Other 3 year olds would wake up and get up and so on. Not to mention the 18 month olds. Because of this the public immediately began asking about doping.
Gerry outright denied to the press that they had given the kids "sedatives", but never said anything about other drugs. Kate said they went straight to sleep when they put them to bed so early, and just slept soundly all night, because they were so tired. Later, there was some mention by someone who knew them, I think it was a relative, that she or he had heard that M "sleepwalked". But that's strange then, that the parents wouldn't be concerned about her getting up. And on the flip side, if they were using that as an excuse to medicate, that is very questionable because it's actually totally normal for 3 year olds to be very restless and get up a lot, often in a sleepwalking way. Medicating for such a thing in such a young child would be very unusual and there would always be a danger of overdosing or harming the child. Anyway, no accusation here, I don't know what happened. She very well could have been abducted as a result of them leaving her alone all the time. The whole thing simply made so little sense, leaving them alone, knowing they wouldn't wander, etc.

 

[seagull65]

The "good parents" schtick is just clever marketing strategy to shake a few coins from children and pensioners to keep the fund going. No one with any sense thinks they're good parents.

What gets to me is why anyone thinks these two are any better than Casey Anthony? Both neglected or killed their daughter to party. The McCann's are just cleaner cut and better educated...morally, I don't see much difference.

I have much less sympathy for the McCanns. They were 39 year old professionals, people with multiple degrees. How in the world can they explain leaving toddlers alone for hours night after night, in an apartment that wasn't even within the walled resort complex where they were partying.

Casey Anthony is 22 years old, was on her own for the first time, had no job and no prospects, and could have medical or mental health issues, though this is not known yet. The friends she stayed with said she was a good mother and treated her child well and was affectionate with her. It's hard to figure out what happened there but I have a lot more sympathy for her than the McCanns.

At the time of the Madeleine case, I heard so many people say, "How could 39 year old doctors leave small children alone like that? You only expect something like that to happen with 20-year-old crack addict parents..."

all posts under my name are entirely opinion and not an accusation

 

[seagull65]

And when M went missing, the bizarre thing was that storm of PR put out immediately by the McCanns and it was all about themselves, how devoutly religious they were and what wonderful people they supposedly were. It was so weird, it was like, where did all this come from, who cares about any of that? What terrified parents of a missing child would be interested in doing that?

my opinion only

 

[Barnaby]

And when M went missing, the bizarre thing was that storm of PR put out immediately by the McCanns and it was all about themselves, how devoutly religious they were and what wonderful people they supposedly were. It was so weird, it was like, where did all this come from, who cares about any of that? What terrified parents of a missing child would be interested in doing that?

my opinion only

Absolutely right Seagull, it has been so appalling how this has been all about them from Day 1 & very very little about Madeleine.
When asked what she would say to Madeleine on TV all Kate could say was "She knows we love her" Hello!! it sounded as if it would stick in her throat to actually say the words!

 

[Barnaby]

Looks like the release of the video of the dogs in action is swaying people who thought that the McCanns were innocent

http://www.the3arguidos.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=22988&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

 

[CaliKid]

Great theories, Seagull.

Hi, Salem. Thanks for the welcome.

 

[Refugee]

I've seen this post so many times! someone has it on their PC and pastes it into Anorak and other places. Could be be robot?

Always uses the 'kill' acussation as an extreme winnable starting point!

No one says they deliberately killed her, it was probably a crime of passion if they did, but its most likely that their neglect led to her having an accident.

 

[Refugee]

There is still incredible bias in the press and media - look at this report about the cadaver dogs (note it only mentions the blood scent).

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Wo...a+Luz+Sniffer+Dog+Search+In+Algarve+Apartment

The final line is the most incredible spin!

And the on the same site.....http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK...StatusLiftedInPortugal&lpos=searchresults

'Asked if the couple feared being arrested by Portuguese police over Madeleine's disappearance, he adds: "If you believe what was written in the papers, then of course we feared it.'

..and ...

She had been left sleeping in a holiday apartment while her parents dined with friends in a nearby tapas bar in the resort of Praia da Luz in southern Portugal.

Shouldnt that say 'The McCanns claim....'?

Why these neglectors (and worse probably) are still at large and allowed to communicate through the press and media, I do not know! Makes my blood boil - where's the justice in this!

 

[Refugee]

Looks like they are after your money again! The UK Daily Mirror ( a tabloid rag) has a headline 'We've spent a million hunting for Maddy' and they 'vow to keep on searching'

Maybe a bit of physical searching the night she 'went missing' might have helped?!

 

[Barnaby]

http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_17886.shtml

http://www.the3arguidos.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=23028

Ex Portuguese police chief claims that Gerry McCann hid the body of Madeleine McCann on the beach

 

[Niner]

Absolutely Niner, uncanny resemblance! However, I am not 100% convinced yet that Murat did not play some part in this mystery. Remember Gerry did not answer when asked if he knew him?

Or perhaps he is innocent & the Tapas crew fingered him for that exact reason, his resemblance to Payne! Very convenient!

but... wasn't this the 1st time they (Tapas9) have been to this resort? So how would they know he lived with his mother? and didn't someone else (besides the T9) say they saw Murat there - maybe mistaking him for Payne? just asking!!

Also - yes, Refugee - IF they had searched that night - it might all have been different!
And Barnaby - didn't a witness come forward and SAY they saw Gerry carrying Maddie to the beach earlier that night?? Thought I read that some where!

also - a little late but!!

:Welcome-12-june: to Refugee - always good to have another opinion here!!

 

[Barnaby]

but... wasn't this the 1st time they (Tapas9) have been to this resort? So how would they know he lived with his mother? and didn't someone else (besides the T9) say they saw Murat there - maybe mistaking him for Payne? just asking!!

Also - yes, Refugee - IF they had searched that night - it might all have been different!
And Barnaby - didn't a witness come forward and SAY they saw Gerry carrying Maddie to the beach earlier that night?? Thought I read that some where!

also - a little late but!!

:Welcome-12-june: to Refugee - always good to have another opinion here!!

I remember hearing some time ago that I think Oldfield had been there before to suss out accomodation. I hate referring to things when I cannot provide links but it is such a long time ago.

I just thought it very strange that when Gerry was asked if he knew Murat he didn't comment, why not say, No I don't know him, never met him.

A reporter was the first to draw attention to Murat I think, she thought that he was acting suspiciously like Ian Huntley who hung around during the investigation into the Soham Murders (two little girls) in UK some years ago.
The weird thing was that really only the Tapas crew identified Murat as having been there on the night of the 3rd, despite his denials, anyone who actually knew him didn't see him. The fact that they did try to finger him makes me think he's not involved but Gerry's no comment, makes me feel the opposite. This case is just so full of contradictions.

Yes there is an Irishman who claims that he saw Gerry carrying a child to the beach.
http://uk.messages.news.yahoo.com/U...ine-McCann&tid=9136&mid=9136&tof=1&so=R&frt=2

 

[Refugee]

I remember hearing some time ago that I think Oldfield had been there before to suss out accomodation. I hate referring to things when I cannot provide links but it is such a long time ago.

I just thought it very strange that when Gerry was asked if he knew Murat he didn't comment, why not say, No I don't know him, never met him.

A reporter was the first to draw attention to Murat I think, she thought that he was acting suspiciously like Ian Huntley who hung around during the investigation into the Soham Murders (two little girls) in UK some years ago.
The weird thing was that really only the Tapas crew identified Murat as having been there on the night of the 3rd, despite his denials, anyone who actually knew him didn't see him. The fact that they did try to finger him makes me think he's not involved but Gerry's no comment, makes me feel the opposite. This case is just so full of contradictions.

Yes there is an Irishman who claims that he saw Gerry carrying a child to the beach.
http://uk.messages.news.yahoo.com/U...ine-McCann&tid=9136&mid=9136&tof=1&so=R&frt=2

I also saw an interview very early on with a woman who claimed she knew Murat and had been at school with him, then she said she had seen him in the supermarket recently and spoken to him....then she said she had not seen him for years....all very odd. I think she was a resident in PDL, another ex-pat. A suspicious fingering of Murat, I think she was a reporter too.

Yes, it was the Irishman who was then approached by the strange benefactor Kennedy. Notice how the fund is never dipping below 500,000? I dont understand why the UK authorities arent investigating the fund, it seems very 'suspect'.

Also, Kennedy....why is this odd man supporting the McCanns? Is he Tapas 10 or does he have other motives...he looks ... well....loook at his picture ...he looks the type you dont want to leave with your children! Just an opinion! http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/

 

[Barnaby]

I also saw an interview very early on with a woman who claimed she knew Murat and had been at school with him, then she said she had seen him in the supermarket recently and spoken to him....then she said she had not seen him for years....all very odd. I think she was a resident in PDL, another ex-pat. A suspicious fingering of Murat, I think she was a reporter too.

Yes, it was the Irishman who was then approached by the strange benefactor Kennedy. Notice how the fund is never dipping below 500,000? I dont understand why the UK authorities arent investigating the fund, it seems very 'suspect'.

Also, Kennedy....why is this odd man supporting the McCanns? Is he Tapas 10 or does he have other motives...he looks ... well....loook at his picture ...he looks the type you dont want to leave with your children! Just an opinion! http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/

I would sure love to know Kennedy's motivation also:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1053038/Ill-fund-McCanns-Maddie-vows-double-glazing-tycoon-Kennedy.html

I'll fund the McCanns until they find Maddie, vows double-glazing tycoon Kennedy



Just why is this guy so involved? If he is such a wealthy man then he is no fool, must have some cop on to have made so much money, so why is he ignoring the obvious & still supporting these morons? (polite termination)


No I wouldn't leave him with my kids, don't like the look of him but more importantly I seriously questions his motives & integrity in this matter & yes why is the fund not being investigated & a proper accounting made public, pound for pound?

I am sick of hearing the amount of money that has been wasted on sham detectives, reeks of money laundering!

Edited to add: Interesting thread here:http://www.the3arguidos.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=23068&st=0&sk=t&sd=a
Claims that kennedy's glazing company went into liquidation leaving many people without their windows etc. so what's the deal? He is still a multi millionaire, living in a large house/mansion, some describe it, I haven't seen it. So how did he get away with liquidation? & obviously he is not a principled man! Methinks there is a lot more to his involvement with the Mccanns!

 

[Refugee]

I would sure love to know Kennedy's motivation also:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1053038/Ill-fund-McCanns-Maddie-vows-double-glazing-tycoon-Kennedy.html

I'll fund the McCanns until they find Maddie, vows double-glazing tycoon Kennedy



Just why is this guy so involved? If he is such a wealthy man then he is no fool, must have some cop on to have made so much money, so why is he ignoring the obvious & still supporting these morons? (polite termination)


No I wouldn't leave him with my kids, don't like the look of him but more importantly I seriously questions his motives & integrity in this matter & yes why is the fund not being investigated & a proper accounting made public, pound for pound?

I am sick of hearing the amount of money that has been wasted on sham detectives, reeks of money laundering!

Edited to add: Interesting thread here:http://www.the3arguidos.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=23068&st=0&sk=t&sd=a
Claims that kennedy's glazing company went into liquidation leaving many people without their windows etc. so what's the deal? He is still a multi millionaire, living in a large house/mansion, some describe it, I haven't seen it. So how did he get away with liquidation? & obviously he is not a principled man! Methinks there is a lot more to his involvement with the Mccanns!

Exactly! Not principled....business after business he buys them out and squeezes the cash out - to hell with the customer. Yet he is suddenly supporting people he never met with thousands? He places his lawyer on the fund board and gets personally involved...it stinks.

 

[Barnaby]

Exactly! Not principled....business after business he buys them out and squeezes the cash out - to hell with the customer. Yet he is suddenly supporting people he never met with thousands? He places his lawyer on the fund board and gets personally involved...it stinks.

Yes it stinks, so maybe we should discuss a few scenarios as to why he is being so generous, everyone throw in their theories. I will start with a few:
1. He is Madeleine's biological father?
2. He is fronting for someone else who has a "vested interest" in the case?
3. He had an affair with Kate?
4. McCanns have something on him?

I have more possibilities but better to open it up to other posters if they wish to contribute

 

[Tony Bennett]

However, I am not 100% convinced yet that Murat did not play some part in this mystery. Remember Gerry did not answer when asked if he knew him?

+++++++++++++++++=

REPLY: Barnaby, the correct inference from Gerry ducking the question about knowing Robert Murat, and looking distincly ill-at-ease at the question, is: Dr Gerry McCann already knew Robert Murat.

In addition, I think it is admitted that Robert Murat was one member of a distinctly odd 'love triangle'.

Then I look at Robert Murat's conduct re Max Clifford. He accepted a lot of free and no doubt useful advice from publicist Clifford, claiming he had no money. Clifford offered to find him a libel lawyer. Next thing Clifford knows, Murat has found his own libel lawyer and successfully sued for £500,000 (say $875,000). Not that I am a massive fan of Clifford, but he clearly felt 'used' by Murat.

Three of the 'Tapas 9' knew Murat and identified him as being around the Ocean Club after 10.00pm. Were all three inventing this?

There is more than a faint whiff of a 'circle' or 'ring' of people up to no good here. 'Recreational drugs', sex, swinging or worse.

Apart from the slight inelegance of your double negative, Barnaby, I am in full agreement with your reservations about the role of Murat on this murky affair.

Did he know someone with a boat?

Or have a mate with a handy freezer, somewhere out in the country?

Finally, how sure can we be that Gerry McCann had never been to Praia da Luz before? He had his connections out there already, Brian Geraghty for one, who is believed to have been involved in the failed PFI bid for a new Leicestershire hospital, which the 'Tapas 9' Doctors appeared to be deeply involved in

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[iNTERESTEDWOMAN]

Yes it stinks, so maybe we should discuss a few scenarios as to why he is being so generous, everyone throw in their theories. I will start with a few:
1. He is Madeleine's biological father?
2. He is fronting for someone else who has a "vested interest" in the case?
3. He had an affair with Kate?
4. McCanns have something on him?

I have more possibilities but better to open it up to other posters if they wish to contribute

I highly suspect that it is not KATE he had (has) the affair going on with. I think Brian and Gerry have the common bond. If you KWIM.

 

[Barnaby]

+++++++++++++++++=

REPLY: Barnaby, the correct inference from Gerry ducking the question about knowing Robert Murat, and looking distincly ill-at-ease at the question, is: Dr Gerry McCann already knew Robert Murat.

In addition, I think it is admitted that Robert Murat was one member of a distinctly odd 'love triangle'.

Then I look at Robert Murat's conduct re Max Clifford. He accepted a lot of free and no doubt useful advice from publicist Clifford, claiming he had no money. Clifford offered to find him a libel lawyer. Next thing Clifford knows, Murat has found his own libel lawyer and successfully sued for £500,000 (say $875,000). Not that I am a massive fan of Clifford, but he clearly felt 'used' by Murat.

Three of the 'Tapas 9' knew Murat and identified him as being around the Ocean Club after 10.00pm. Were all three inventing this?

There is more than a faint whiff of a 'circle' or 'ring' of people up to no good here. 'Recreational drugs', sex, swinging or worse.

Apart from the slight inelegance of your double negative, Barnaby, I am in full agreement with your reservations about the role of Murat on this murky affair.

Did he know someone with a boat?

Or have a mate with a handy freezer, somewhere out in the country?

Finally, how sure can we be that Gerry McCann had never been to Praia da Luz before? He had his connections out there already, Brian Geraghty for one, who is believed to have been involved in the failed PFI bid for a new Leicestershire hospital, which the 'Tapas 9' Doctors appeared to be deeply involved in

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Yes Tony, I do feel that Gerry knew Murat prior to that stay in PDL as I think, did other members of the Tapas group. I must try to dig up the article regarding Murat's connections in UK.

The "odd love triangle" intrigues me, I hadn't heard this. Would you care to elaborate please?

Gerry could well have been to PDL before.

I agree that Murat used Clifford, I think he is a very astute man!

My views on three of the group identifying Murat at the scene are mixed:
Noone who knew him locally saw him there, strange!
IF he was involved in Madeleines' disappearance in any way, then perhaps the three did not know of that. If he was involved & they did know, why would they try to implicate him? Surely if he was fingered, then they ran the risk of him talking & implicating G&K or all of them?
I tend to think that all of the Tapas group know exactly what happened that night so I am a bit lost as to their motives. We also have the strong resemblance to Payne to consider but noone would find it strange Payne being there that night so why the need for cover?

I apologise for my grammar mistake if indeed it is a mistake, I am usually a stickler for correct grammar being a school teacher by trade, lol! I always scrutinise my posts for typos but I am more than open to correction when wrong, only the McCanns are infallible, particularly in their good care of their children.
Just as a matter of interest, I said that I was not convinced that Murat did not play a part, meaning that I felt he may have done, two negatives do produce a positive & as far as I know, are not wrong when you wish to convey that very idea. I would appreciate your comments.

Back to topic:

I think the mate with the freezer is a good theory but the more people involved in a crime the more chance that someone will talk, I wonder what keeps everyone so very silent on this matter? I reckon that storing a body in a freezer would not come cheap, where did the ready cash come from? Indeed how much would it take to keep the culprit silent when he/she could have shopped them all & claimed a huge reward? A big risk to take!

Regarding the boat, for one I think we can disregard Pennington's tale about the boatman as we are pretty sure that Madeleine's body was in the hire car weeks later but then again did some of the group not have that same car during the holiday?
I do think the body has either been dumped at sea or incinerated in that Pet crematorium.

I have many questions regarding Murat & that is what we are here for to try to find answers.

 

[Barnaby]

I highly suspect that it is not KATE he had (has) the affair going on with. I think Brian and Gerry have the common bond. If you KWIM.

Wondering IW, LOL! The mind boggles.
I will not delve deeper than asking do you mean the Freemasons?