Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #1

[gia2]

I think my interpretation of disintegrate is probably different from what they meant. When I think of something disintegrating,I envision it more like totally disappearing like evaporating.no pieces found ever.
whatever happened I sure hope those poor people aboard were not aware.

Ah I see! No I don't think it could happen like that, more that the plane tears to pieces and causes a large area of debris to be found. Perhaps with small planes over water where a search and rescue wouldn't be so extensive.


Yes, those poor people I think that's the most we can hope for now, that the people didn't suffer and that they are found so they can be buried according to their families wishes. Hopefully they'll get answers in time as well.

 

[Plumeria5]

Reading a bit at FlightRadar24 forum:

It says RED means "squawking emergency"....so possibly they do know more than they are saying?

http://forum.flightradar24.com/threads/4760-Red-Aircraft

The fact that another aircraft pilot was asked to make contact with Flight 370 at what time (1:30am?) suggests to me that they had lost contact with 370 fairly quickly after takeoff. Then he heard static and mumbling and thought it was the co pilot. Was it because he heard what sounded like a younger voice? Did he know the Captain personally or at least his voice and knew it wasn't him?

 

[hockeymom]

I was discussing with my husband, if this was a terrorist attack and it involved several people,why would you need more than one guy,if you were blowing up the plane? (unlike 9/11 where your purpose was to hijack the plane and fly into buildings). He suggested maybe each one held a component to an explosive device that together would be noticed,but if seperate would pass through security. Any thoughts?

 

[Plumeria5]

This video shows how unsafe cockpit is.

http://kfwbam.com/2014/02/28/video-purports-airline-cockpits-not-safe/

There are probably a lot of reasons why, but why isn't the cockpit self contained having their own bathroom, separate door from the outside, and access to food with no inside access other than cost and space it would take?

Ok, I have backed up and am ready for the fallout! :truce:

 

[JudyBolton]

Have not read everything - so may have been discussed already - BBC reporting 5 passengers checked in (including luggage) but did not board. Their bags were removed but that sounds suspicious to me.... why check bags and then decide not to board? Were they warned something might happen? Or was it an innocent thing - got distracted in terminal and missed boarding? BUT for 5 people..... ???

 

[zwiebel]

I imagine even with information pinpointing the exact spot the plane when down, flying over and actually spotting a debris field is another matter altogether. The ocean is a huge, moving, ever-changing entity, which I have the greatest respect (and fear) for. I'm not surprised it's taken so long - I'm actually surprised there's been so much progress.

Someone mentioned 'mumbling' being heard upthread, in a communication with the cockpit? It reminded me of a black box recording I heard once, with a pilot mumbling about Allah is great, over and over, and the co-pilot saying something like, 'What are you talking about?" just before the plane crashed. I think it was an Egyptian flight. I can't recall the cause of the crash - I just recall the mumbling was discounted as being of any importance.......

 

[Linda7NJ]

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[zwiebel]

Any aviation experts - could a bomb going off in a luggage hold, hole a plane and cause it to drop like a stone, but leave it intact enough to sink immediately after hitting the water, with all souls trapped within? Is that possible from the last known height - 35,000 feet, I think?

 

[Derryn Hunch]

Ah I see! No I don't think it could happen like that, more that the plane tears to pieces and causes a large area of debris to be found. Perhaps with small planes over water where a search and rescue wouldn't be so extensive.


Yes, those poor people I think that's the most we can hope for now, that the people didn't suffer and that they are found so they can be buried according to their families wishes. Hopefully they'll get answers in time as well.

For what its worth, if the aircraft broke up due to an explosive decompression or otherwise, everyone aboard would likely have been dead in less within mere seconds.

Any decompression that takes place in less than one-half second is considered to be an "explosive decompression". It can be rapidly fatal. Human lungs usually require about 0.2 seconds to release their air. Any decompression happening in less than this short amount of time can result in rapid lung decompression and rupture or severe damage. The only emergency procedure available for dealing with this type decompression is to immediately get on oxygen and get the aircraft to a lower altitude as quickly as possible.

The most serious effect of decompression is the resultant hypoxia and more or less rapid loss of effective consciousness. The most noticeable immediate effect of rapid cabin decompression will be the sudden rush of air from the lungs. As noted above, this can be a fatal experience in explosive decompressions. It will, however, happen. I've had pilots tell me they would be able to hold their breath and prevent this effect. That won't happen. First of all, the surprise of the event will override any defensive measure you may have thought you could put into place. Secondly, the rapid change in pressure differential will make it impossible to hold your breath. (Remember, we can be talking about a pressure differential of 8.8 PSI. Let's put these pressure differentials into perspective. A differential of 8.8 PSI is 1267 pounds per square foot. The pressure differential between the bottom and the top of the wing of a popular corporate jet is less than 1/3 PSI -- and that supports the weight of the aircraft!)

The human body contains a great deal of nitrogen (an inert gas comprising 78% of the atmosphere) dissolved in the blood and other body tissues. This nitrogen has been introduced into solution at sea level, or near to sea level, atmospheric pressure. Any pressure above this will allow the nitrogen to come out of solution. Flight in an unpressurized aircraft or a pressurized aircraft with a cabin altitude above sea level will allow the nitrogen and other inert gases to come out of solution in small bubbles.

Time of Useful Consciosness:

The time of useful consciousness is the time your brain is awake enough to be useful and make decisions. This varies from almost indefinite at 10,000 to 9 to 12 seconds above 40,000 feet. An explosive or rapid decompression will cut this time in half due to the startle factor and the accelerated rate at which an adrenaline soaked body burns oxygen.

At 25,000 feet the oxygen saturation is only 55% and consciousness is lost. (Note that the partial pressure of oxygen in alveolar air at 25,000 feet is 14% of 281.8 mm Hg or 39.5 mm Hg.

The aircraft was cruising about 10,000ft above this again!

Then take into consideration that if the aircraft litterally "broke up" at anything near its usual cruise speed or indeed unconrtolled descent speeds - the air temperature at that altitude is about -50c and the wind blast would hit people at almost the speed of sound. Its not survivable and it would be over before they even knew what was happening.

 

[gia2]

Thanks Derryn Hunch for that, very interesting! It's good to have your knowledge to help us understand this situation.
I hope it does come as some sort of comfort in time for the families of the victims.

 

[panthera]

Missing Malaysia plane possibly 'disintegrated' mid-air

Tribune staff and wire reports
9:37 a.m. CDT, March 9, 2014


KUALA LUMPUR, March 9 (Reuters) - Officials investigating the disappearance of a Malaysian airliner with 239 people on board are narrowing the focus of their inquiries on the possibility that it disintegrated in mid-flight, a senior source said on Sunday.

Malaysia Airlines flight 370 vanished after climbing to a cruising altitude of 35,000 feet between Kuala Lumpur and Beijing in the early hours of Saturday, but search teams have still not been able to make any confirmed discovery of wreckage in seas beneath the plane's flight path almost 48 hours after it took off.

"The fact that we are unable to find any debris so far appears to indicate that the aircraft is likely to have disintegrated at around 35,000 feet," said the source, who is involved in the investigations in Malaysia.

If the plane had plunged intact from such a height, breaking up only on impact with the water, search teams would have expected to find a fairly concentrated pattern of debris, said the source, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorised to speak publicly on the investigation.

The source was speaking shortly before Vietnamese authorities said a military plane had spotted at sea an object suspected to be part of the missing airliner Sunday afternoon.

Asked about the possibility of an explosion, such as a bomb, the source said there was no evidence yet of foul play and that the aircraft could have broken up due to mechanical issues.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-malaysia-plane-missing-20140309,0,1515462.story

Of course there is no evidence of foul play as no (verified) part of the aircraft has been located. Agree that if it had broken apart upon impact with the ocean there is a likelihood of a concentrated debris field and larger pieces of the aircraft. However it was also hours after it disappeared before anyone began searching and the ocean does have strong currents. I am still seriously doubtful the crash was due to mechanical issues. I heard it had just been inspected and was a fairly new aircraft (as compared with the age of some other airliners such as TWA 800's Boeing 747).

MOO

 

[nursebeeme]

Folks: tweets need to be msm and include a link

 

[DuchessJules22]

Do you think it was a success for them?

It depends. If it is terrorism they wanted to see where the weak spots are in security then, yes, they probably got what they wanted.

If their intent was something else like hijacking then, no, it wasn't a success.

 

[nursebeeme]

I was discussing with my husband, if this was a terrorist attack and it involved several people,why would you need more than one guy,if you were blowing up the plane? (unlike 9/11 where your purpose was to hijack the plane and fly into buildings). He suggested maybe each one held a component to an explosive device that together would be noticed,but if seperate would pass through security. Any thoughts?

That is my thought too re each one holding different parts

 

[margarita25]

These types of investigations take years and years. They / we are going to be trying to "put together the pieces" for a very, very long time. jmo

 

[Little Jedi]

Folks: tweets need to be msm and include a link

Is that why you deleted my post ?!!


Gregor Peter ‏@L0gg0l 4m "CHINA MARTYRS BRIGADES LEADER" CLAIMS RESPONSIBILITY FOR MISSING MALAYSIAN AIRLINES ...

https://twitter.com/L0gg0l

If that's not good enough it's also reported here :

http://www.channel4.com/news/malaysia-airlines-lost-plane-turned-back-passports-mystery

 

[Plumeria5]

Someone made a poster collage of the pictures of the crew of flight 370.:heartbeat:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/missing-malaysia-airlines-flight-mh370-3223263

 

[Isabelle]

Have not read everything - so may have been discussed already - BBC reporting 5 passengers checked in (including luggage) but did not board. Their bags were removed but that sounds suspicious to me.... why check bags and then decide not to board? Were they warned something might happen? Or was it an innocent thing - got distracted in terminal and missed boarding? BUT for 5 people..... ???

I am doubtful that those bags were actually removed. I see this as covering butt. More than once while traveling, my bags wound up in a different state than the state I was going to. I

 

[nursebeeme]

Is that why you deleted my post ?!!


Gregor Peter ‏@L0gg0l 4m "CHINA MARTYRS BRIGADES LEADER" CLAIMS RESPONSIBILITY FOR MISSING MALAYSIAN AIRLINES ...

https://twitter.com/L0gg0l

If that's not good enough it's also reported here :

http://www.channel4.com/news/malaysia-airlines-lost-plane-turned-back-passports-mystery

Yes. The tweet was not
linked and does not appear to be msm. The article you linked said the Chinese dismissed the claims? Hth

 

[ilovepierre]

This mystery has been on my mind since I first heard about it yesterday.
Praying for answers still! And praying for the families and friends of those who had loved ones on the plane.

I don't know what to make of this "disintegration" angle. I mean, it makes sense and all, but what would cause that to happen?