Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #14

[ElleElle]

I just tried starting a new thread on the Pilots but don't see it yet. That is what we do - sleuth. I want to know who they are, how long they worked for airline, how many times they flew that route, where they got training, do they have families, what is their religion, and it goes on and on...

I don't think we're allowed:

*be respectful of the passengers' families- no sleuthing of crew or passengers is allowed

 

[JerseyGirl]

Daily Media Briefing

SEPANG: Acting Transport Minister Datuk Seri Hishammuddin Tun Hussein today said there was no giving up on the search.

"I will not give up hope and I will continue as from day one and I am giving more hope to get the closure to this by the support that we are receiving," he told reporters at the daily media briefing on the updates of missing MH370 here, today. Hishammuddin, who is also Defence Minister, said as more assets had been deployed and more countries came on board, it would give more hope to continue. "But personally, I am not looking back," he stressed.

He also described the search and rescue (SAR) operation as the biggest in history as 26 countries were giving their support and assistance without even mentioning the costs involved. "This is the best part. Nobody, not even Malaysia, not even our partners have talked about dollar and cents. It never cross our minds. The priority is to find the aircraft," he said.

Describing the challenges during the SAR in the southern Indian Ocean, he said the vessels that were deployed to the area would face possible strong current and rough seas. He also said that the vessels had been warned of possible cyclone category one, which currently at Christmas Island area, heading towards the search area.


Read more: UPDATE 27 (Day 15) MISSING MH370: 'I will not give up hope', says Hisham - Latest - New Straits Times http://www.nst.com.my/latest/font-c...ve-up-hope-says-hisham-1.526903#ixzz2wkCxvg9J

 

[panthera]

The average depth is 12 762 feet. Its deepest point is 26 401 feet.
In 1987, South African Airways 295 crashed into the Indian Ocean and it took over two years to find the black box at a depth of 16 000 feet.

At least that account of South African Airways 295 gives home hope in this case, as long as it is known where MH370's black box is. Hopefully it won't take two years to determine where it went down!

MOO

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I don't think we're allowed:

*be respectful of the passengers' families- no sleuthing of crew or passengers is allowed

No sleuthing allowed...isn't that something.

 

[Boodles]

My apologies if this has been posted - I've dropped off the thread somewhat due to lack of new info.

I hope this is just DM sensationalism. Are they credible at all?

 

[Linda7NJ]

No sleuthing allowed...isn't that something.

They're all still considered victims.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ElleElle]

It must be 930AM on Sunday in Perth, Australia now.

Is there SAR today? TIA.

 

[JerseyGirl]

No sleuthing allowed...isn't that something.

Victim Friendly forum.

 

[CARIIS]

It was hijacked and crashed into water 100 26.53%
It was hijacked and crashed into land 12 3.18%
It blew up due to mechanical failure 13 3.45%
It has landed safely on land 95 25.20%
<modsnip> 4 1.06%
<modsnip> 5 1.33%
I don't know 43 11.41%
<modsnip> 13 3.45%
<modsnip> 1 0.27%
Hijacked and hopefully if the passengers are already dead, it crashed into water. 10 2.65%
Pilot suicide. Crashed into the ocean. 24 6.37%
It was hijacked; plane landed safely but is hidden. 76 20.16%

 

[magpie]

It must be 930AM on Sunday in Perth, Australia now.

Is there SAR today? TIA.

Yes, unless the weather gets too bad. A cyclone is expected sometime in the afternoon, as per CNN.

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I don't think we're allowed:

*be respectful of the passengers' families- no sleuthing of crew or passengers is allowed

Were we not allowed to discuss pilots of 9/11 ?

 

[ElleElle]

“This would never have happened on an Israeli plane,” says Yeffet. “An El Al aircraft was hijacked for the first and last time in 1968. Since then, there has not been a single flight where security did not check every single name.”

However, it would have taken more than just a pair of Iranians with forged documents, Yeffet said, to pull off such an astonishing crime. “I can’t believe for a second that if these people planned to hijack the aircraft, it was just them,” he said. But based upon the tried-and-true Israeli intelligence strategy of profiling, the pilots, he said, are unlikely suspects.

“We are talking about a captain who is 53 years old, who has worked for Malaysia Airlines for 30 years, and suddenly he became a terrorist? He wanted to commit suicide? If he committed suicide, where is the debris?”

Adding that the captain in question, Zaharie Ahmad Shah, was known to be happily married and comfortably well-off, Yeffet said the profile simply does not fit. “From the United States to China to Japan, everybody is searching for this aircraft or piece of it. And there is no sign. So in my opinion, the aircraft was hijacked. And it was an excellent plan from the terrorists, to land in a place where they can hide the plane and no one can find it.”

Read more: Ex-El Al expert: Iran likely involved in MH 370 | The Times of Israel http://www.timesofisrael.com/ex-el-al-expert-iran-likely-involved-in-mh-

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

They're all still considered victims.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Who is still considered as victims and by whom? I know all the passengers were...Hey Linda7NJ

 

[magpie]

I was very surprised to read about the woman who bought a pay as you go cell phone in an article somewhere up-thread. I would think if it was true CNN would be all over it. I've been watching CNN for days now and no mention of it. Strange, unless this is NEW news.

 

[ElleElle]

Were we not allowed to discuss pilots of 9/11 ?

Yes, but it was confirmed the pilots of 9/11 were the hijackers/terrorists.

As far as MH370 goes, we have no indication the pilots are hijackers/terrorists, at this point they are victims as linda said.

 

[ElleElle]

Were we not allowed to discuss pilots of 9/11 ?

Or do you mean just discuss pilots in general?

 

[CARIIS]

I kinda afraid that the only markings would be dangerous

terror groups whose members routinely use untraceable SIM cards

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...one-bypass-security-checks.html#ixzz2wkIDl8Vj
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
​

I wonder which ones do??​

 

[mck16]

Yes, unless the weather gets too bad. A cyclone is expected sometime in the afternoon, as per CNN.

On a positive note, if there is cyclone maybe it wiil churn up the wreckage or at least some pieces. jmo

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

Were we not allowed to discuss pilots of 9/11 ?

Waiting...tap.tap.tap

 

[Steely Dan]

One of the worst parts of airline safety changes is they go by a value per life calculation that in the U.S. is
An excellent article here: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-...ths-too-few-to-make-new-safety-rules-pay.html

Essentially they are not required to make changes to aircraft or crew rules if it will cost over that per death. In the states (no link here, just from a documentary i watched and news during one of the major crash aftermaths) it seems the NTSB has a difficult relationship with the FAA because they make a number of safety recommendations that are not implement as they are not considered cost savings enough per body. The airline industry has a strong lobby with the FAA and will fight tooth and nail if it might increase their costs.

Now think of countries which are less regulated. However most come from boeing or airbus which are manufactured according to rules, no matter where they are sold. That said, all the ideas in the post you responded to are excellent but sadly i doubt any will be considered cost effective enough. Many ideas have been ignored only to be pulled out again after a major crash that makes the media for days or weeks where all are lost.

jmo

maybe a better sleuther could find more about how the airlines fight new safety regs based on value per life.

That's a good article SilkySfaka. What I'm about to say isn't directed at you. It's directed to the guy in the article who said this;

“I can’t remember another time when cost trumped a policy decision,” said Goelz, a former managing director of the National Transportation Safety Board....

I'm going to give him credit for possibly talking about a government policy based on cost. However, if he's including the private sector he's not all that bright. The private sector makes life and death decisions based on cost all the time.

Ford knew that the Pinto had a problem with exploding gas tanks http://users.wfu.edu/palmitar/Law&Valuation/Papers/1999/Leggett-pinto.html They had an accountant sit down and calculate how much it would cost to fix it, then calculate the cost of lawsuits. Turned out that it would be cheaper to let people die and just pay off the families than it would be to fix the problem. Fortunately, this was discovered during one of the cases brought against Ford, and the judge was so pizzed off that he trebled the damages. Thus making it a loss for Ford in the long run.

Some people get pizzed off at liability lawyers for bringing outrageous suits and I am one of them too, but they've done a lot of good too on valid lawsuits. I believe the Pinto case finally outed a basic corporate tactic that had been (and still is) going on since the first business was formed. The judges precedent of trebling the damages helped make it unprofitable. Other business' took notice and raised the price of people's lives, but we all have a price on our heads.

Is it cheaper at work to remodel an area to make it safer or if they put up a sign saying "CAREFUL" are they then absolved any liability? Most of the time the sign is good enough and if you hurt yourself you weren't being "CAREFUL".

So people need to think about what price they have on their heads? GM seems to have known about the airbag problem for years and did nothing about it. It appears they thought they could cover it up. Well they couldn't and now they're gonna be in deep doo doo if they knew back in 2004. I'm pretty sure that no matter how much they are fined or hand out in lawsuits, family members would rather have the loved one back.

Most companies treat their employees with the least they can get away with. That's why unions formed. If you think your company is being gracious because they give you an extra week of vacation, they're not. They must feel that giving out another week of vacation keeps them competitive in the market. The government has to force business' to increase their minimum pay to someone and there is a lot of political wrangling over a dime increase.

Companies want you to buy something so they can make the most profit and if it kills you, but is cheaper to ignore, then bye bye. :seeya: If there are a hundred guys looking for one job, a business can pay as little as they are legally allowed and the guy who gets the job will thank God. If he doesn't like the job he's told he can find another one that another 100 people have applied for.

Airlines are no different. If the plane crashes the insurance company will pay for it. Their insurance rates will increase, but it won't bankrupt the airline.

Sorry for the :rant: but it really struck me as a dumb thing for that guy to say. JMO

Neither is the Airbus A320-214 however Captain Sullenberger did it on the Hudson River! Seriously, landing "safely" on the Indian Ocean, not so sure after seeing that strong current. It truly would be a miracle, in my opinion.

MOO

A pilot on CNN said pretty much the same thing. He said the Hudson river is smooth not choppy like ocean water. He also said that there's a reason it's referred to as the "Miracle" on the Hudson.