Meredith Kercher murdered - Amanda Knox convicted, now appeals #5

[Allusonz]

Respectfullly Snipped

BBM

The latest is that she seduced the priest and he wanted to marry her

Could you please provide a MSM link for this claim

 

[Malkmus]

The letter is to Madison, and she also claims that police hit her ... something that police categorically deny. In terms of whether Amanda makes "slips" ... I think she does. When she accused Patrick and said that she was afraid of him, she apparently lacked the foresight to understand that her accusation also formed her confession of involvement in the murder. When she stated that her blood was not in the sink prior to the murder, she placed herself at the murder ... again. Somewhere between Amanda's imaginings, flashbacks, lies and oops moments, she makes a lot of slips and does not appear to be innocent.

The court didn't have the document, and after it was first aired on the program about Amanda, that particular sentence was blurred and obscured.

Is it your opinion that ILE or the court never saw the letter or is that a fact? I find it hard to believe that when all of Amanda's personal phone calls from prison were being listened in on, and practically every diary entry and letter to friends was being leaked by ILE to the press that this one somehow went unnoticed. Or that it was slipped in during the documentary but the prosecution didn't notice or care that the biggest bombshell piece of evidence - a confession - from Amanda wasn't worth tracking down. I think they just realized she was referring to Patrick as well.

 

[Nova]

I think your perception that people don't regularly write about such themes as pregnancy, rape, drugs, sex and death is way off. One need only to walk into the fiction section of their local book store to see that these topics are in abundance.

I was on a break and unable to respond to otto's original post about AK's writings.

I taught creative writing (playwriting) to kids AK's age for many years. Almost ALL of the works submitted by students dealt with themes similar to AK's. There are several reasons for this:

1. TV (and video games, films, etc.). Young people today spend a phenomenal amount of time in front of screens these days. And what do they see? If it's a comedy, it's about sex (often perverse sex); if it's a drama, it deals with rape and murder. So naturally when they start to write themselves, kids leap to these subjects. We tell kids to write "what they know," and in an odd sense, violence (of the fictional kind) is what they know. This does not make them better acquainted with real violence.

2. Lack of confidence. It takes a great deal of confidence as a writer to trust that one can write about mundane events and still be interesting. Often, the best student work I read was about something relatively everyday that had meant something to them personally; but it was very difficult to convince students of that.

3. Morbidity. There is something about adolescence that seems to prompt a fascination with the morbid. And, yes, that includes a few teens who have gone on murder sprees, but it more often finds expression in poems and diaries. See the Romantic poets for prime examples. See Holden Caulfield (and his hundreds of millions of teen fans) as another.

 

[Nova]

RBBM It depends on the creative writing class. Some profs offer specific topics and/or writing prompts. Others specify a particular theme or style of writing or even genre. Are all university students who take creative writing classes aspiring writers? I could have sworn in my disgustingly long undergrad career that creative writing was included as part of required core classes.

No. Creative writing students are not necessarily aspiring pros. Aspiring professionals do not necessarily take writing classes.

I've never heard of assigning students a topic (though I believe you if you have). That's one brave teacher who's willing to read 30 stories on the same topic!

 

[Allusonz]

Glad to see you back Nova I am currently on a self imposed break of my choosing

 

[Nova]

Which friend did Amanda hurt?

In context, she appears to be referring to Lumumba.

 

[dgfred]

Glad to see you back Nova I am currently on a self imposed break of my choosing

I understand completely! :banghead: :maddening:

 

[Nova]

With the way that Amanda rambles around in her writings, I thought she was talking about Meredith, and it didn't even cross my mind that she was referring to Patrick. Patrick is not her friend, he is the employer she had for a couple of weeks and who demoted her because she didn't follow his instructions. Patrick is the guy that she falsely accused of murder. She ruined his life. If that's how she treats friends, I wouldn't want to know how she treats enemies ... or do we already know that ... per Meredith.

AK rambles, but not that much. As Malkmus points out, there are numerous denials of guilt in the same writing; it makes no sense that AK suddenly took that one sentence to confess to the crime. Particularly since she then continued to complain about being unjustly imprisoned.

 

[otto]

Then the entire human race must be screwed up lying crazies then.
Your first "A" and the next "A" are not the same thing.

It's called going from being sure of something vague and not so sure of something very specific. I'm sure you can find ample evidence in your own life!
I am absolutely SURE that I am over 5'8" (this is "A"). I estimate about 5'8.5"(this "B"). I haven't measured so I'm "NOT SURE" exactly.

Now if it just happened that I'm wrong and in the last 10 years I have shrunk down below 5'8", would this be evidence of lying in a murder case? Let's say the perp was definitely shorter than 5'8" (even though I didnt know that) and they used that as motive for me lying. Would you see that as evidence of my guilt?

Same examples hold true for dinnertime, bedtime, etc...

What time did you eat dinner last Thursday?

Amanda is a liar, but this fact is not based on her poor quality writing. She is known to be a liar because she has told outrageous lies. She is known to be a bad writer because her sentences are are full of contradiction.

The statement about eating dinner late is indeed a lie, but the sentence itself does not prove that she is a liar. In fact, the lie become evidence when compared to the facts, and the two other incorrect times she gave for having had dinner.

The sentence itself appears to be given for the purpose of providing information, but at the same time attempting to confuse the reader.

 

[Nova]

With Amanda, anything is possible. We were recently discussing her sentence where she started by saying the that she was "definitely sure" that she ate late, around 11 pm, and finishes the sentence by saying she isn't sure. Amanda is full of contradictions even in a single sentence. For her to say that she is innocent, and then say she hurt a friend is par for the course.

Come on. Do you really think those two contradictions are equivalent?

 

[Nova]

In the context of what was posted yes it appear to me that she does believe him to be a friend.....

And in that context, the "friend" might be anything from a casual acquaintance to a bosom buddy. The sentence is intended to express contrition. To define the victim as less than a friend ("I hurt somebody I barely knew") would seem disrespectful in this context and an attempt to mitigate the fault.

 

[Nova]

Amanda is writing a book? Amanda will need to hire a very patient writer to re-write whatever she puts on paper, to clean it up so regular people can read it ... otherwise she should stop wasting her time right now. She obviously has another 25 years to waste, but art, belting out Let It Be, and writing do not seem to be her forte ... so maybe she should aspire to something more concrete and less artistic.

My first thought is ... what does someone in prison have to say? I'm not guilty, I'm innocent, I didn't do it (what else is new) ... and the walls are gray, the walls are still gray, and ... 3 years later ... the walls are still gray? She can write that she's definitely sure that police hit her but she can't be sure, or that she's definitely sure about what happened in the two hours that police questioned her as a witness but she can't be sure. Is she going to write more fiction about rape or getting stoned and watching someone die slowly?

Great books written (in whole or in part) in prison:

Amazon.com: Great Books Written in Prison or Jail



One of them, Cervantes' Don Quixote, is considered the first true novel and one of the best of all time.

 

[Nova]

Sorry ... but anyone that starts a sentence with absolutely sure about A, and ends saying not sure about A, is screwed up in my my books. It's a sentence that is intended to get people to walk away thinking they have an answer when they don't. I'm tempted to say it's a Casey Anthony-ism.

I believe you can find equivalent posts all over WS. As trillian explained, it may reflect a stream of consciousness that begins with certainty but ends allowing for the possibility of doubt. No prize for writing, I agree, but human brains do work that way--and not just when there is an intention to deceive.

 

[Nova]

One keeps waiting for Amanda to do the right; even Donald Trump was waiting, but each time Amanda comes out with another whopper. The latest is that she seduced the priest and he wanted to marry her ... but otherwise she is still trying to sexually seduce those in her environment and prove her innocence.

I don't think Amanda knows what the right thing is ... like a typical sociopath. She might feel like buying lingerie after her friend is murdered, writing songs, dying for a pizza, sticking out her tongue, flipping cartwheels and doing the spits .. and not realize that is inapporpiate to be caught on camera smooching in the underwear store the day after the roommate is murdered. She might just not get it ... and that would be a very dangerous female to have in the genenral population.

She's a convicted murderess who acts like she's been wronged ... but nothing in her writings supports innocence.

Do we have a cite for the priest business? There have been so many wild media claims about AK, I'm not inclined to believe such things without proof. (To be clear and fair, otto, I'm not suggesting YOU invented it. I'm just wondering where it originated.)

 

[flourish]

Forgive my very quirky sense of humour all

flourish I am gathering you will not be buying the book she will be writing about her experience (forgive me i simply could not resist) :innocent:, as I must agree I do not believe creative writing to be one of her strengths

my feeble attempt at humour :floorlaugh:

LOL, yeah, I'll be storming the bookstore doors for that one. Right after I pull my own fingernails out with a pair of needle-nose pliers.

Anyone know about any laws in Italy about convicted murderers writing and publishing/releasing books, about their crimes or not, and profiting from it?

 

[Malkmus]

Anyone know about any laws in Italy about convicted murderers writing and publishing/releasing books, about their crimes or not, and profiting from it?

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I thought Allusonz was just joking about Amanda actually writing a book. If she does I think it would be after her appeals are finished and akin to Joanna Lees' book. Even though Lees was just a witness she went through much of the same demonization in the press and wrote a book about it:

Lees admitted to use of ecstasy and marijuana, and to having sex with another man, Nick Reilly, in Sydney during their trip through Australia. During the trial, Joanne Lees' credibility was attacked by the defence, which claimed to find inconsistencies in her story. These matters did not relate to the offence under investigation, and were perceived as essentially irrelevant, although voyeuristically interesting to the public.

 

[flourish]

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I thought Allusonz was just joking about Amanda actually writing a book. If she does I think it would be after her appeals are finished and akin to Joanna Lees' book. Even though Lees was just a witness she went through much of the same demonization in the press and wrote a book about it:

Uh, yeah, I realized she was joking and her joke brought up an actual question. Amanda may or may not have already sort of published from the cell. Thanks for giving me a reference to look up, though, as I have no idea who Joanna Lees is or was but perhaps it will lead me to my answer.

 

[Malkmus]

Uh, yeah, I realized she was joking and her joke brought up an actual question. Amanda may or may not have already sort of published from the cell. Thanks for giving me a reference to look up, though, as I have no idea who Joanna Lees is or was but perhaps it will lead me to my answer.

Didn't mean to imply you were wrong or anything, just stating that I initially thought she was joking and now got confused that there might actually be a book in the works (but doubted it) which is why I asked. I'm the confused one here, obviously.

 

[Allusonz]

Didn't mean to imply you were wrong or anything, just stating that I initially thought she was joking and now got confused that there might actually be a book in the works (but doubted it) which is why I asked. I'm the confused one here, obviously.

a joke no book

 

[Allusonz]

MOO JMO

The character assassination of AK has skirted around the absurd and bizarre but now has sprinted beyond it, the investigation, the trial, and the appeals.

When the character assassination involves people outside of the investigation, trial, and appeal and implicates priests, prison officials, and basically anyone that comes into contact with her is wrong.

To even suggest that any of these individuals are doing what is being said is wrong.

To think it is wrong.

You cant skirt around this, sneak past it, tippy-toe around it. It is simply WRONG.