Michelle Young, pregnant mom, murdered Part 18

[raisincharlie]

"I believe this is someone new assigned to this case. Can't recall seeing her name before."

Thank you board members! This speculation by me ("I believe" and "can't recall") generated a total of 11 posts.

Thank you Athy, Raisincharlie, Nomimi, Scandi, Jilly. I hope you will continue to make sure my speculations are accurate.

This is 12, my opinion only.

--Jake

No problem, the truth when it is a known, trumps speculation in all cases. This case will be no different. That is after all, the purpose behind the forum, a search for the truth.

 

[raisincharlie]

It's this or that. A rapist will use condoms so maybe someone in the house found condoms and then later found out that Jason did not use them. Fingerprints could have been on the unused package. An attempted rape could've taken place or a staged one, if you get my drift.

I cannot see LE overlooking a used one found somewhere in the bedroom simply because they'd want to make sure it was Jason's dna. A rapist would not leave a used one there. As for the matter with her clothes she wouldn't need to be nude or redressed if someone tried but didn't succeed. Whatever object she was beat with could have been something she picked up and hit them with.

Just maybe, this is another of those speculations produced by Jake to purposely distract and deflect and point the blame elsewhere. You will note he never comes and out and says it - just implies it. Until it becomes known through appropriate channels, the insinuation is just that.

I agree LE would not have overlooked such a finding, especially if they actually found a collection of unused ones, nor would the ME overlook doing a rape kit if any evidence existed that warranted the completion of one. Perhaps it should have been done regardless. However, we do not know all that is in the ME's notes from either the autopsy or the examination done at the scene. We also do not know what the ME or other LE personel will be testifying to. I suggest when it goes to trial the explanation for the actions taken and not not taken will be defined.

 

[less0305]

Scandi,

It seems to me that condoms were not an essential item nor a used item if one thinks about it. Michelle was pregnant back in May before she was involved in the "accident". Then she got pregnant very quickly afterwards which indicates to me that condoms weren't a common use item. Once she got pregnant of course there is no reason for them.

The only reason I can see is if Michelle was indeed aware that JY played around and absolutely insisted...could be a very interesting concept.

Condoms could have been "found" or "discovered" by police in a JY specific place, i.e., golf bag, gym bag, his vehicle glove compartment. Police discovering condoms hidden away in something personal of JY's would pique the interest of law enforcement...."Why would the married man of a pregnant wife have condoms secreted away?? Hmmm, maybe he's having an affair - we might need to look into that." I think Jake is once again trying to throw out a red herring and hope someone bites. I don't bite.

 

[raisincharlie]

Most definately Charlie, She was pregnant almost that whole year, if you round it out.

<snip>

We don't know this yet, as it is just a surmisal. Bet your bottom dollar Charlie when it comes out we won't be a bit surprised. I think LE already has their finger on everything concerned with this murder, and for the life of me can not understand why this has to be drawn out now like it is. :banghead:

Scandi

Scandi,

I wonder why 3.5 months after the autopsy came out WRAL is just now getting around to investigating and reporting on the issue of a rape kit. We know Ms. Lamb went and looked at the photos, we know she read the AR. We know from the AR that all clothing was retained as evidence, what we do not know is what tests were performed on that clothing or what trace evidence may have be recovered from the clothing. There is a reason IMO.

 

[athy]

i found it strange also rc that she reports it now.

 

[raisincharlie]

i found it strange also rc that she reports it now.

Reminds me of the tooth story, a preliminary strike. The comments by the ME indicate that there was no evidence found to indicate a rape or sexual assault had occured prior to the murder. Get it done and over with.

 

[athy]

sorta like taking away the power it might have at trial if LE is already given the chance to explain why one wasn't done.

 

[raisincharlie]

sorta like taking away the power it might have at trial if LE is already given the chance to explain why one wasn't done.

Actually, I am not convinced either story, tooth or rape kit absence really has any power either way. The tooth could be checked against X-rays and other methods to verify whose tooth it is - if it is Michelle's how does that raise reasonable doubt ? The only claim is the evidence might have been overlooked - but if that piece of tooth proves nothing either way, is it really evidence ? I don't think so.

The same with the rape kit - if there were no signs or indications of sexual assault, is it necessary? They have her clothing which included under garments, trace evidence may well verify if there was or was not any kind of sexual activity involved before the murder. The only usefulness to the defense is the fact it was not done, but that is a small walkway if the clothing and the physical exam yields evidence supporting the reasoning for not doing it.

Since this information is not known to us and maybe is also not known to reporters, I will wait for the trial to weigh the significance it may or may not have with respect to my views.

 

[Taximom]

After receiving two email alerts about Michelle Young from WRAL, I got excited and came here to see what was happening. Sorry to see it's the same old, same old.

Six lousy months. How much longer will it take for justice to be served?

 

[jilly]

Reminds me of the tooth story, a preliminary strike.

Yes it does, doesn't it. Put out by the jy team.

So what's going on with Amanda Lamb, I wonder. Off hand, do you remember who put out the tooth story? ETA Which newspaper?

 

[Nomimi]

Scandi, you are just much too nice to be on this board. You should be protected and preserved as a national treasure!

I believe a pack of unused condoms were removed via one of the search warrants, but I can't figure why.

I believe Ms. Lamb's source has told her something about sexual activity and that's why she speculated for three paragraphs. I expect she will tell us soon what she has learned. Today's story was just a tease.

Even if no sexual assault, don't you think LE would like to know if Michelle had engaged in sex that night, and with whom? What if she did, and it wasn't Jason. Surely the ME checked!

--Jake

More than likely the unused pack of condoms belonged to Jason, since he was the one having the affair. Maybe Michelle found them and that's what started the fight that night? Hmmmmmm.

 

[Nomimi]

I've heard of several cases where a rapist/murderer reclothed their victim....all in North Carolina! They really should have done the rape kit regardless of whether she was dressed or not.

Hi Deb,
Would you be so kind to give us a link? I would be interested in reading that. Maybe there is some nut rapist on the loose. Thank you.

 

[Nomimi]

Condoms could have been "found" or "discovered" by police in a JY specific place, i.e., golf bag, gym bag, his vehicle glove compartment. Police discovering condoms hidden away in something personal of JY's would pique the interest of law enforcement...."Why would the married man of a pregnant wife have condoms secreted away?? Hmmm, maybe he's having an affair - we might need to look into that." I think Jake is once again trying to throw out a red herring and hope someone bites. I don't bite.

Amen to that! I believe Jake would actually "leak" some "information" to the media himself in order to stir the pot, and take the focus off of Jason.
:liar:

 

[scandi]

More than likely the unused pack of condoms belonged to Jason, since he was the one having the affair. Maybe Michelle found them and that's what started the fight that night? Hmmmmmm.

Hi Nomimi, This is in answer to the post you responded to, but I wanted to say Hi and I agree with you and everyone elses posts in response to Jake.

The reason I think a package found of unused condums was taken by police through the SW is to check fingerprints on who brought that box or package into the Young home. We don't know what that showed, but since there are no other persons that have come to light other than Jason in regards to being the perp, I would assume they are his fingerprints on the package.

Sami will know this, but during autopsy, even if there was not a rape exam given, if the ME had noticed what looked like evidence of sex inside of her, he would on his own volition done tests. I don't remember reading anything unusual mentioned about her body down there in the AR - everything was normal. If she had a condum inside of her there would be tell tale signs of the lubricant on the condum and more than the average amt of fluid present which probably would have ended up on her panties.

Evidently there was nothing present to indicate recent sex within the previous 12 or so hours.

I'm thinking one of the family members found something like a condum wrapper and wasn't turned in to LE. Then it could be Amanda was notified of this find which resulted in the article. I think this was what prompted Jakes question about possible charges against the finder of whatever it was or the possibility this person could be held as a material witness.

Amanda is tight with LE. So if LE is concerned about this, I am sure they will be in contact with those who went into the home right after it was released. I do think withholding possible evidence from a known crime scene is chargable. It will depend on what the prosecutor thinks and how doing that would affect the case.

Scandi

 

[raisincharlie]

Yes it does, doesn't it. Put out by the jy team.

So what's going on with Amanda Lamb, I wonder. Off hand, do you remember who put out the tooth story? ETA Which newspaper?

Jilly,

As I recall, each media outlet had something on it. I cannot tell you who put it out first however. I do know WRAL went and interviewed Sam Pennica with CCBI (or SBI) about it.

Scandi - for you : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yj6cbM-h8xg

 

[less0305]

More than likely the unused pack of condoms belonged to Jason, since he was the one having the affair. Maybe Michelle found them and that's what started the fight that night? Hmmmmmm.

That reminds me of a story of a friend of mine. His wife found condoms in his glove compartment.....he told her he sometimes got himself off while on long road trips and that he used the condoms to keep from having a "mess" on his hands while traveling. She totally bought it.....sounds plausible, right? But my friend really was having relations outside the marriage on his traveling jaunts.

 

[strach304]

I read a post on the ctv board saying that LE could've done a rape kit on Michelle at the scene. If AL was just going by the autopsy then she wouldn't know that right?

I do know they clipped her nails and bagged her hands before removal. I know they got samples of Jason's pubic hairs which I think is standard anyway. An oral swab and checking for hair on and around a rape victim are also procedures done on suspected rape victims. From what I read an actual rape kit would involve a lot more than taking oral swabs. Therefore, it is my opinion that the ME did do this. The NTO also stated they wanted that evidence from Jason for comparison from the crime scene and autopsy.

ETA: If there's ever a trial if no foreign dna was found or other signs of sexual assault then I don't think it will amount to a hill of beans.

 

[raisincharlie]

I read a post on the ctv board saying that LE could've done a rape kit on Michelle at the scene. If AL was just going by the autopsy then she wouldn't know that right?

I do know they clipped her nails and bagged her hands before removal. I know they got samples of Jason's pubic hairs which I think is standard anyway. An oral swab and checking for hair on and around a rape victim are also procedures done on suspected rape victims. From what I read an actual rape kit would involve a lot more than taking oral swabs. Therefore, it is my opinion that the ME did do this. The NTO also stated they wanted that evidence from Jason for comparison from the crime scene and autopsy.

ETA: If there's ever a trial if no foreign dna was found or other signs of sexual assault then I don't think it will amount to a hill of beans.

Strach,

I think if we read John Butt's quote from this article posted by Stoli :http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/1377240/

North Carolina medical examiner John Butts said such tests are only performed when there is obvious evidence at the scene or on the victim's body of sexual assault or when law enforcement officers request it.

"Collection of such (rape) kits is not routine for female homicide victims, unless they fall into these categories," Butts said.


I think we have a bit more understanding about the scene. It seems obvious to me that no one from LE all the way through the ME saw anything that made them even suspect a sexual assault had occurred or was even attempted. There was no other reason for what happened other than complete and utter oblitteration of Michelle - that was the objective plain and simple. JMO.

 

[harleysnana]

I'm thinking one of the family members found something like a condum wrapper and wasn't turned in to LE. Then it could be Amanda was notified of this find which resulted in the article. I think this was what prompted Jakes question about possible charges against the finder of whatever it was or the possibility this person could be held as a material witness.

Scandi

:blowkiss:
Scandi... you and I think alike!
Almost every post of yours I read.. I think.. hey.. that's what I was thinking!

Anyway... about the family member finding a condom..
I would bet that is what Jake was talking about!

He said last night he knows something.

My though...
A family member found a condom wrapper and had it tested...and
Jason&#8217;s prints are not on it.

It's possible that they don't know who&#8217;s finger prints are on it
and they are ASSUMING it was someone that Michelle had come
to the house....
BUT...
What if... it was from someone Jason had come to the house?

Maybe Michelle&#8217;s prints are also on the wrapper...

If Michelle found this wrapper and thought...
what the heck... we don't need condoms... I'm pregnant!

And after finding a condom....she decided to have a talk with Jason about it?

That could explain a fight that night?

And.. it could also explain...why if someone from Jason&#8217;s family found a condom they
would feel comfortable about having it tested for dna because they knew
that it would have Michelle&#8217;s prints and an "unidentified" persons....

I would bet that is what Jake is getting at by his comments.

 

[scandi]

Hi Harleysnana, Back at 'cha! ;} That was funny, and we really do think so much alike going back to the SP days of yore. LOL

There would be nothing so suspicious about an unused package of condums, plural as he said. I would think they would have had to find something with an indication of use, which they might not feel free to say here.

The killer could have planted it to raise suspicion about a sexual motivation. That would be a stretch tho. Your idea sounds very plausible, but if it really was in the bedroom or even the bathroom area, I can not see LE not taking it, can you? The tooth was inbetween the edge of the carpeting and the wall, so it is more understandable why it wasn't found. Plus it was very small, or a piece of a tooth. A wrapper, now that would be hard to miss! Almost laughable.

If it has been given to LE now, an odd fingerprint could be a reason for delay, trying to match it up to a person. But from the way I have interpreted Jakes posts, this old discovery has just recently been revealed, so it would be a new part of the investigation having just started.

If the family didn't think Jason had anything to do with her murder then you would think they would have turned it over right away to assist in finding the real killer. That is why I think this is all about nothing. It would be interesting to have Harrison's take on this! Scandi