MN - George Floyd, 46, died in police custody, Minneapolis, 25 May 2020 #12 - Chauvin Trial Day 9

[missy1974]

it actually sounds like Nelson is coming down with a cold...

What would happen if he got sick??? or worse, covid?

 

[MsBetsy]

My attention span is shortening with this questioning. Is the intent to prove GF’s meth/fentanyl levels were not lethal?

Well, the meth in his system was apparently a very small amount, but I think they are focusing on the fentanyl and whether the amount he had in his system points to his having ingested any during the arrest. The metabolite (norfentanyl) found in his system suggests he had already metabolized some of the drug, which could have been taken the day or 'days' before his death. I think the defense will have a very hard time convincing the jury that Floyd ingested a "lethal" amount of fentanyl, especially since he likely had a tolerance to opioids for years. Imo

 

[btfly547]

Nelson: Are you aware of the term "hooping?"
Objection (couldn't hear grounds)
Judge: You can answer if you know
Witness: I do not know

Questioning moved on...

If “hooping” can also mean what has been mentioned on WS a few times then I’m surprised it has just now come up. I would think that term would be one that’s somewhat regional and not one that most who are not familiar with drugs would know the other meaning. That would have been a perfect question to ask one of the many cops that came up to testify. Most of them had been/still are patrol cops and would know that definition if in fact that is what it means in Minneapolis. Somehow I don’t think a scientist from Pennsylvania would know that meaning.

Perhaps Nelson had never heard of it either and maybe he’s been reading WS after court each day?

 

[ElizaKate]

it actually sounds like Nelson is coming down with a cold...

What would happen if he got sick??? or worse, covid?

Reckon he's just exhausted. But... sick and well enough to question witness via video link? Is it allowed?

If it's not allowed/covid isolation...forced to use one of the attorney's that are speculated to be working behind the scenes. If it's a defense strategy to only use Nelson publicly (as some have theorised) that shouldn't be permitted to halt the trial IMO.

 

[Chelly]

Next witness has a flight out tonight, so judge appreciates jury staying until 5:15 p.m. court time. He is a forensic medicine specialist.

 

[missy1974]

Well, the meth in his system was apparently a very small amount, but I think they are focusing on the fentanyl and whether the amount he had in his system points to his having ingested any during the arrest. The metabolite (norfentanyl) found in his system suggests he had already metabolized some of the drug, which could have been taken the day or 'days' before his death. I think the defense will have a very hard time convincing the jury that Floyd ingested a "lethal" amount of fentanyl, especially since he likely had a tolerance to opioids for years. Imo

I am definitely not very informed about fentanyl at all, or even any street drugs. But the OD's from fentanyl recently has made it very clear that taking any pill from the street is like playing russian roulette... you NEVER have any way of knowing how much is in each pill. This witness agreed with Nelson that non manufactured fentanyl pills can have different amounts in them. IMO basically meaning, whatever they found in one pill in the vehicle, it doesn't mean the pill before or after didn't have a lethal dose.

as for the norfentanyl... that could be from earlier fentanyl, it doesn't mean that some was not just ingested. IMO

 

[Blondiexoxo]

Oh dear I only went for a bath came back and Nelson sounds like he’s been chain smoking cigars in his lunch break! Imagine a covid outbreak in court

 

[ElizaKate]

If “hooping” can also mean what has been mentioned on WS a few times then I’m surprised it has just now come up. I would think that term would be one that’s somewhat regional and not one that most who are not familiar with drugs would know the other meaning. That would have been a perfect question to ask one of the many cops that came up to testify. Most of them had been/still are patrol cops and would know that definition if in fact that is what it means in Minneapolis. Somehow I don’t think a scientist from Pennsylvania would know that meaning.

Perhaps Nelson had never heard of it either and maybe he’s been reading WS after court each day?

Yeh I don't have a clue tbh. Just personally found it interesting that Nelson posed this question to this witness, and since it's been questioned on here, decided to transcribe it for commentary. It's still unknown what the meaning is in this case I believe.

 

[missy1974]

Reckon he's just exhausted. But... sick and well enough to question witness via video link? Is it allowed?

If it's not allowed/covid isolation...forced to use one of the attorney's that are speculated to be working behind the scenes. If it's a defense strategy to only use Nelson publicly (as some have theorised) that shouldn't be permitted to halt the trial IMO.

they may be rumoured to be working behind the scenes, but no one is actually listed as on the case as far as I know. JMO based on what the Judge said a few weeks back... something like Nelson is just 1 man, the State has 10 or 12 listed.

 

[MsBetsy]

If “hooping” can also mean what has been mentioned on WS a few times then I’m surprised it has just now come up. I would think that term would be one that’s somewhat regional and not one that most who are not familiar with drugs would know the other meaning. That would have been a perfect question to ask one of the many cops that came up to testify. Most of them had been/still are patrol cops and would know that definition if in fact that is what it means in Minneapolis. Somehow I don’t think a scientist from Pennsylvania would know that meaning.

Perhaps Nelson had never heard of it either and maybe he’s been reading WS after court each day?

I don't think it's the first time it's come up during the trial. I'm sure police would have been familiar with the term and Nelson is too. It's a "street" term used in any city. The prosecution would like to avoid any mention of it at all. In any case, I don't see how it helps the defence because obviously Floyd wasn't hooping at any time during the arrest. I think Nelson wants to somehow prove that the accumulative amount of drugs in his system contributed to an overdose. Imo

 

[missy1974]

Oh dear I only went for a bath came back and Nelson sounds like he’s been chain smoking cigars in his lunch break! Imagine a covid outbreak in court

I know it shouldn't have... but this made me laugh LOL thank you

his voice.. he's sniffing... a bit of coughing... it's not looking good!

 

[ElizaKate]

they may be rumoured to be working behind the scenes, but no one is actually listed as on the case as far as I know. JMO based on what the Judge said a few weeks back... something like Nelson is just 1 man, the State has 10 or 12 listed.

I've heard his "assistant" [quoted by Nelson]Alice Voss behind him is a licensed attorney though right? Any legal reason she couldn't take over if Nelson was too unwell to continue? Just an interesting issue for the case.

 

[missy1974]

I like this prosecutor... I like his voice, I like how he doesn't uhmm ahhh his way through questions...at least.....not yet haha

 

[JerseyGirl]

Now Dr. Bill Smock is on the stand. He's an emergency medicine physician w/specialized training in forensic medicine.

https://twitter.com/anavilastra/status/1380263909555310602?s=21

 

[GarAndTeed]

I've heard his "assistant" [quoted by Nelson]Alice Voss behind him is a licensed attorney though right? Any legal reason she couldn't take over if Nelson was too unwell to continue? Just an interesting issue for the case.

You'd think they'd have back-up. I can't imagine the trial having to stop if one atty. got sick, but I don't know...

 

[Tippy Lynn]

it actually sounds like Nelson is coming down with a cold...

What would happen if he got sick??? or worse, covid?

Oh dear I only went for a bath came back and Nelson sounds like he’s been chain smoking cigars in his lunch break! Imagine a covid outbreak in court

I know it shouldn't have... but this made me laugh LOL thank you

his voice.. he's sniffing... a bit of coughing... it's not looking good!

Judge Peter Cahill has the ultimate say on how to proceed if someone is exposed to the virus in the middle of the Chauvin trial, according to a court spokesperson.

Courts prepared to address potential COVID-19 outbreaks as Chauvin trial starts

 

[Chelly]

This forensic medicine specialist is second prosecution expert witness to testify GF died from lack of oxygen.

 

[missy1974]

Judge Peter Cahill has the ultimate say on how to proceed if someone is exposed to the virus in the middle of the Chauvin trial, according to a court spokesperson.

Courts prepared to address potential COVID-19 outbreaks as Chauvin trial starts

thank you so much, I was following from afar before trial... resisted the urge to come to websleuths... cuz I ALWAYS get sucked in!

 

[JerseyGirl]

Dr. Smock says George Floyd died of positional asphyxia.

https://twitter.com/anavilastra/status/1380267146165547010?s=21

 

[MsBetsy]

I am definitely not very informed about fentanyl at all, or even any street drugs. But the OD's from fentanyl recently has made it very clear that taking any pill from the street is like playing russian roulette... you NEVER have any way of knowing how much is in each pill. This witness agreed with Nelson that non manufactured fentanyl pills can have different amounts in them. IMO basically meaning, whatever they found in one pill in the vehicle, it doesn't mean the pill before or after didn't have a lethal dose.

as for the norfentanyl... that could be from earlier fentanyl, it doesn't mean that some was not just ingested. IMO

Yes, of course it's very dangerous to take any illicit substances. And yes, there is no way to know how much fentanyl is in one particular pill. I'm just pointing out that there is no way to prove, based on the amount found in urine or blood, how much he ingested during the arrest. The amount of fentanyl found in his system is comparable to a therapeutic dose, which would be very dangerous for someone who has no tolerance for opioids. And yes, the norfentanyl would definitely reflect earlier use, since it takes some time to break down. Imo