MN - Justine Damond, 40, fatally shot by Minneapolis LE, 15 July 2017 #2

[Betty P]

The police department's internal affairs unit can compel Noor to give a statement as part of its own investigation, and fire him if he refuses, but that statement cannot be used against him in any criminal investigation, Friedberg said.

http://abcnews.go.com/International...-fired-fatal-shot-moments-loud-sound-48716962

.........

"It's frustrating to have some of the picture but not all of it," she said. "We cannot compel Officer Noor to make a statement. I wish we could. I wish that he would make a statement."

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/...ding-fatal-minnesota-police-shooting-48694394

Perhaps their police department is seeking an indirect way to have him removed, trying to police their own ranks. Perhaps they don't want to reinforce the idea of having mayors firing officers.

They finally did something similar in Cleveland with the officer who killed Tamir Rice. After the media battles, civil lawsuits, investigations, etc. had died down and public attention was no longer focused on the tragedy, they got rid of the bad cop in a "back door" administrative fashion. It's not right and I disagree with that tactic. If a cop is bad and kills an innocent person, they need to be fired or forced to resign, the same as any other public employee.

 

[Betty P]

well from a quick check on local articles indicate besides have a Police Chief that was controversial...and a mayor not at all popular with many...it seems that Mr. Kroll has a reputation to be a racist based on a number of officer shootings ...now with this one not a clue where he is going to go but his job is to protect his force. So far he has defended the officers and they either have not been charged or as in Philando found not guilty..

Mayors aren't often to blame for these situations. Mayors come and go, but a police department wields it's own power and has its own leaders. They're not elected, they have their own permanent system. In a big city, it's extremely difficult for any mayor to make much of an impact on a police department. They do their own thing, they're protected.

 

[Jax49]

[h=1]Fast-track training put officer Mohamed Noor on Minneapolis police force[/h]
The former police chief stood by the training of officer Mohamed Noor, who shot and killed Justine Damond. But not everyone is sold on the process.

http://www.startribune.com/minneapo...s-about-noor-s-fast-track-training/436057173/

The officer who fatally shot Justine Damond graduated in 2015 from the city’s accelerated police cadet program.

The seven-month training is a quicker, nontraditional route to policing aimed at helping those who already have a college degree enter law enforcement.

 

[DatelineFan]

[h=1]Fast-track training put officer Mohamed Noor on Minneapolis police force[/h]
The former police chief stood by the training of officer Mohamed Noor, who shot and killed Justine Damond. But not everyone is sold on the process.

http://www.startribune.com/minneapo...s-about-noor-s-fast-track-training/436057173/

Wow, 7 months is not long at all. I do think it's great to have a college degree, and I wish police officers were required to have a 4 year degree. There's a lot you can learn in college, aside from the content of your classes. But 7 months of training seems quite short. :/

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[human]

Wow, 7 months is not long at all. I do think it's great to have a college degree, and I wish police officers were required to have a 4 year degree. There's a lot you can learn in college, aside from the content of your classes. But 7 months of training seems quite short. :/

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

They had him working in a very low crime area. I wonder what kinds of issues officers there in Fulton deal with. Is there additional training they have to attend in order to retain their job? Like teachers have to do in Minnesota - Take classes every five years in order to keep their license. The first two years of teaching you have to do a certain amount of classes. Do officers?

 

[blue22]

[h=1]Fast-track training put officer Mohamed Noor on Minneapolis police force[/h]
The former police chief stood by the training of officer Mohamed Noor, who shot and killed Justine Damond. But not everyone is sold on the process.

http://www.startribune.com/minneapo...s-about-noor-s-fast-track-training/436057173/

With the way he was paraded out as a Somali on the force...I suspect he was a diversity hire to make the force look good in that perspective. It seems like they really played him up, and he was likely not a distinctly good candidate to be LE. I think the fast track program pretty much guarantees they will not be adequately trained. JMO

 

[Karinna]

Interesting article addressing these issues
(quote)
The problem, notes Jerome Skolnick and former New York City police officer/Temple University criminal justice professor James Fyfe in their book Above the Law: Police and the Excessive Use of Force, is that

police work is often viewed by those in the force as an us-versus-them war rather than a chance for community-oriented engagement and problem solving. The authors also point to a lack of accountability as one of the reasons why police violence persists. They acknowledge that, yes, police officers are placed in dangerous situations that at times require immediate responses. But they maintain that that doesn’t excuse using more force than is needed to subdue someone, the lack of professional training that leads to such fear-based responses, or treating citizens as enemy combatants.
https://www.rutherford.org/publicat...ing_phenomenon_of_police_shooting_unarmed_cit

 

[turaj]

There seems to be little new coming out now even locally about this shooting...I found this article from the New York Times interesting with some additional details and about their planned wedding and how they met etc. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/22/us/minneapolis-police-shooting.html
One thing I wonder about...when you call 911 with a report as Justine did...is it not protocol for the 911 operator to tell the caller to stay in their home...while I know it seems logical it should always be told to the caller. If it is not protocol it should be. I think Justine saw the car and came out to approach them hoping to find out what they found...a natural reaction but in this case deadly. Were they even going to check in with her? Probably never know.

 

[turaj]

Wow, 7 months is not long at all. I do think it's great to have a college degree, and I wish police officers were required to have a 4 year degree. There's a lot you can learn in college, aside from the content of your classes. But 7 months of training seems quite short. :/

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

I believe that this accelerated training was a result of a situation that occurred in 2014. As often happens there was a pension rule change and a very high number of experienced officers chose to retire. Story was covered in this article www.startribune.com/with-pension-rule-change...of...officers...retire/261396001 . Many officers were put on extreme overtime and then they recruited and did the "express training"...not sure they are fully staffed even today. It took a big toll on the force. Since 2014 it has been one disaster after another in the news here regarding policing...and I think this same situation has happened in other police forces in our country too.

 

[turaj]

well from a quick check on local articles indicate besides have a Police Chief that was controversial...and a mayor not at all popular with many...it seems that Mr. Kroll has a reputation to be a racist based on a number of officer shootings ...now with this one not a clue where he is going to go but his job is to protect his force. So far he has defended the officers and they either have not been charged or as in Philando found not guilty..[/QUOTE

What area does his position cover? Even suburban and St. Paul?

As I understand it from friends with more knowledge than I have on police Kroll is only the rep for the MPD Union.

 

[Karinna]

There seems to be little new coming out now even locally about this shooting...I found this article from the New York Times interesting with some additional details and about their planned wedding and how they met etc. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/22/us/minneapolis-police-shooting.html
One thing I wonder about...when you call 911 with a report as Justine did...is it not protocol for the 911 operator to tell the caller to stay in their home...while I know it seems logical it should always be told to the caller. If it is not protocol it should be. I think Justine saw the car and came out to approach them hoping to find out what they found...a natural reaction but in this case deadly. Were they even going to check in with her? Probably never know.

I would think that yes, in the face of imminent danger call 911 and do not try and approach a potential crime scene, but wait for LE to deal with it, because that is their job, and call back if so inclined to check that it was investigated if you feel the need to do so. I don't really know and none of us do just what compelled Justine to go outside and do what she did? It still doesn't excuse the fact she should not have been fatally shot for what she did though. It's just all terribly sad.
Not really sure what the protocol is either, but agree a caller should be told to stay indoors and let LE handle the situation.

 

[Jax49]

If I hear someone being attacked near my home, I'll call 911 but no way could I listen for 8 minutes while the attack continued without trying to help. Even screaming at the perp might be enough to save someone's life.

moo

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

If I hear someone being attacked near my home, I'll call 911 but no way could I listen for 8 minutes while the attack continued without trying to help. Even screaming at the perp might be enough to save someone's life.

moo

Oh my, Jax........and it is commendable to help but it could also put your life in jeopardy too. Perps with a gun don't like to leave witnesses, iykwim?

 

[turaj]

If I hear someone being attacked near my home, I'll call 911 but no way could I listen for 8 minutes while the attack continued without trying to help. Even screaming at the perp might be enough to save someone's life.

moo

To be honest at this point I think I will just keep calling and wait. About a year ago I came home pulled into my drive and saw a police officer get out of his car parked in front of my home..walking across my lawn and I merely asked him what was going on and is everything okay. He did not respond. Upon his return I did step out again and ask as at that point I wanted to know if it was safe to be outside or what. He then severely admonished me that I should NEVER TALK TO AN OFFICER OR APPROACH THEM...as they are in the process of a call and I could have impeded their apprehension. It was a false alarm...but I got the message loud and clear to stay away and clearly citizen engagement should not be expected at all. Maybe it was this particular officer's demeanor but it stuck with me.

 

[jjenny]

These two cops were send out to investigate potential rape. What if the victim approached the car looking for help?

 

[grammieto5]

[h=1]Fast-track training put officer Mohamed Noor on Minneapolis police force[/h]
The former police chief stood by the training of officer Mohamed Noor, who shot and killed Justine Damond. But not everyone is sold on the process.

http://www.startribune.com/minneapo...s-about-noor-s-fast-track-training/436057173/

I wonder what their degree would be in?

 

[Jax49]

Oh my, Jax........and it is commendable to help but it could also put your life in jeopardy too. Perps with a gun don't like to leave witnesses, iykwim?

True but I'd have to try.

ETA: I'm not suggesting others should take action other than calling 911. Still can't believe the kids in Florida watched a man drown and didn't call.

 

[Jax49]

I wonder what their degree would be in?

I believe any degree counts. His was business.

Before heading into law enforcement, Noor worked in commercial and residential property management and managed a hotel. He has a degree in business administration, management and economics from Augsburg College.

 

[grammieto5]

These two cops were send out to investigate potential rape. What if the victim approached the car looking for help?

That's what I was thinking. What if Justine were the victim (well she is the victim now) but what if she were the one the 911 call was for.

 

[turaj]

I wonder what their degree would be in?

This is a quick summary of his background..."He graduated from Augsburg College in Minneapolis with a degree in economics and business administration. Before joining the department, he worked in property management of commercial and residential buildings, according to the department"

At some point reports are he wanted to "give back to the community" and decided to join the police force..apparently his wife at the time did not want him to do that especially with a pay cut ...so he got a divorce. I have zero knowledge if he has a promising career or were things going back and he changed course?