MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #7

[TexanMom]

Originally Posted by TexanMom
This is what is really sad, people get fired up about a <mod snip> that was shot by police. But nary a peep about the senseless killings that have occurred in Chicago.
The killing in Ferguson is just as senseless as those in Chicago. No more, no less, imo.



But MB was not an innocent victim. His actions led to DW taking appropriate action. So not really senseless. Huge difference!

 

[popsicle]

Maybe some are. I don't know, but the "hands up--don't shoot" demonstrations resulted from the first, apparently false, narrative based on DJ's initial version of events. That narrative has fallen apart for many because of subsequent revelations, but some have gone no further that the initial assertion of "unarmed black teen , trying to surrender, shot down by white policeman." I don't believe race was a factor in the policeman's actions, but race has definitely been inserted into the issue from day one, and perpetuated by activists, politicians and the media. All MOO

I agree because the unrest started the afternoon of the shooting and steadily grew as evening came and to where we are now. jmo

 

[Elley Mae]

Florida police department to begin using body-mounted cameras

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...using-body-mounted-cameras/?intcmp=latestnews

If only Officer Wilson would have had one on.

 

[Apollo]

Johnson's attorney was just interviewed on CNN. He stated Johnson has not changed his story. The interviewer went though the incident step by step with him and it's the same as his intial version. Wilson grabbed MB by the neck, MB got away and ran, Wilson shot at him, MB turned around and put his hands up, Wilson continued to shoot until MB was dead.

ETA: Nothing about a struggle for the gun. Nothing about Wilson getting punched in the face.

 

[Elley Mae]

Johnson's attorney was just interviewed on CNN. He stated Johnson has not changed his story. The interviewer went though the incident step by step with him and it's the same as his intial version. Wilson grabbed MB by the neck, MB got away and ran, Wilson shot at him, MB turned around and put his hands up, Wilson continued to shoot until MB was dead.

I remind myself that he has to return to the neighborhood after he testifies. jmo I don't know that he will stick to that once seated in the courtroom. jmo

 

[Apollo]

I remind myself that he has to return to the neighborhood after he testifies. jmo I don't know that he will stick to that once seated in the courtroom. jmo

I wonder if he knows about the evidence to the contrary? He surely must. If he sticks to this story, no one will believe anything he says plus I think he's going to find himself in some deep doo doo.

 

[popsicle]

I wonder if he knows about the evidence to the contrary? He surely must. If he sticks to this story, no one will believe anything he says plus I think he's going to find himself in some deep doo doo.

I'll wait to see what he actually tells the GJ.

 

[TheDuchess]

Johnson's attorney was just interviewed on CNN. He stated Johnson has not changed his story. The interviewer went though the incident step by step with him and it's the same as his intial version. Wilson grabbed MB by the neck, MB got away and ran, Wilson shot at him, MB turned around and put his hands up, Wilson continued to shoot until MB was dead.

OK-that is what we call "doubling down." Apparently, he must feel he has enough support from those in power to continue on with the myth. But the truth WILL come out. Either with the GJ refusing to return an indictment - or even better, for the cop to be arrested and tried. Because THEN the truth will come out in court. 3 seconds. Probably less - and it is certain that MB would have taken that gun out of Wilson's hands and used it on him. 3 seconds and Wilson's life would have been over. MB-twice as large as Wilson AND with a buddy. 2 choices - surrender your weapon or use it. MB had about 20 minutes. 20 minutes to think through his plans with a number of choices along the way, and every time he had an opportunity to make a choice, he made the wrong one. The robbery, the assault on a police officer, his lunging at the police officer. It is HIGHLY UNLIKELY an officer would shoot a man with his hands in the air begging him not to shoot. Only a true cold-blooded killer would ever do such a thing. In this country, accused criminals are given every ounce of due process they can possibly get - innocent until proven guilty - unless you are a white cop shooting a black suspect. Apparently, that is a reason to run through the streets, to have government leaders jump into the fray demanding prosecution, threatening no peace until justice - throw everything out the window. This officer deserves our PRESUMPTION OF INNOCENCE, just as MB would have deserved had he still been alive.

Finally, I have one last question I would love to ask Mr. Johnson's attorney - IF Officer Wilson is a cold blooded murderer, as you claim, why is your client still alive? If Officer Wilson truly just executed a man begging for mercy, why not shoot the one witness who would rat him out? The answer is that one of the men was a threat to the officer and the other was not.

 

[Apollo]

Impact of Holder's visit coming up next on CNN if anyone is interested.

 

[popsicle]

If their determination is that no indictment be filed, then that information &#8230; all that information &#8230; will be released to the public immediately,&#8221; said McCulloch.

http://www.kmov.com/news/local/McCu...ding-Ferguson-police-shooting--272013011.html

 

[oh_gal]

But they can't buy a beer or rent a car........probably a good reason for both.

And current brain research shows that the frontal cortex of the brain is not completely mylenized until about age 24. That part of the brain governs critical thinking, executive functioning and decision making.

In fact, the brain of the 6-12 year old is in a much more 'stable' state than that of an adolescent. Once adolescent chemical changes meet the underdeveloped frontal cortex.....well, yeah, teenagers.

Not that all teens are incapable of rational thought, but generally speaking, well, if you have a teenager, it will remind you of the toddler years.

"Um did you REALLY think shaving your head was a good idea?"
"Well, I know you were angry, but could you have thought of a better way to express that than calling him a ?@$&&?# ?"

Not excusing criminal behavior. But am explaining that an 18 year old is not an adult, developmentally speaking. And also that on these very boards I have read posts positing that minor perps must have "had to have been victims, themselves".

Hannah Anderson comes to mind. Super sketchy stuff there (IMO and not just MO) and yet she was a pretty, popular cheerleader and as such, given a huge pass. And called a victim in MSM and everywhere other than comments from real people who smelled a rat.

Even young killers who without a doubt are guilty of the crimes they stand accused of.....I read post after post speculating about abuse or sexual abuse or brain injury or medication use or wrestling injury.

I read no such posts in defense of this young man. None. He committed a crime, yes. Not murder. Not rape. Not baby rape. Not killing his mother and little brother. I understand what Officer Wilson did. What I do not understand is why, with all the looking for "answers" we do on here regarding other young offenders, we are content to just assume MB needs none of this consideration.

Where is the discussion as to "why?" for Michael Brown? Why is this 18-year-old just a ?

Guilty is guilty. But to search for explanations for some, while just treating others as "here comes another one"?

That, I do not understand.

For me, what it comes down to is perception (and my perceptions could be incorrect). But when I see someone with that look on their face -- you know....the sneer, or flashing the gang signs (or what look like gang signs to me) in a picture, or the insolent look on the face or in the eyes.....and then things start to come out -- like the video, and this massive, hulking "kid", tossing this skinny little clerk around like a rag doll, and hearing that these two are sauntering down the middle of the street, blocking traffic, and when asked by a police officer to move, disregard him, or even, as it has been stated, back-talk him, yeah....my perception is: "here comes another one." And I think my perceptions are spot on.

 

[popsicle]

So one of fams lawyers Parks... loving on the Gov even though he hasn't been in Ferguson. Guess his letter worked even though Parks didn't mention that part. On CNN.

 

[popsicle]

Parks- even the worst injury possible to DW doesn't make the shooting/death of MB justifiable.

 

[Yoda]

They get by with what they do and the same could be said for whites so spare me

I think the thing that baffles me so much... is the selective memory of bad deeds when it comes to perpetrators Jackson & Sharpton (not to mention Obama & Holder). I really don't get it.. my hubby and I have had this conversation... they complain about not being treated fairly (bulldink). Yet, they get by with what they do because they are black and they are TOTALLY ok with that. *THAT* is what sets civil rights back- not white people.

It is our duty, and the media's duty, to expose the hypocrites and self servers, of any color.

Johnson's attorney was just interviewed on CNN. He stated Johnson has not changed his story. The interviewer went though the incident step by step with him and it's the same as his intial version. Wilson grabbed MB by the neck, MB got away and ran, Wilson shot at him, MB turned around and put his hands up, Wilson continued to shoot until MB was dead.

ETA: Nothing about a struggle for the gun. Nothing about Wilson getting punched in the face.

Everything now is carefully orchestrated. What is released, who speaks to the media, etc.
We know Johnson has more then one attorney. What if one, attorney is told the initial story, then not made privy to any changes, added detail, etc. He can continue to say to the press that this is the story Johnson told him, it has not changed. They could be doing this in order to protect Johnson from any hostility. Just a theory.

 

[vulture]

Not directed to you popsicle, just jumping off of yours. He was 18 and I think nearly everyone would agree that the maturity and understanding level of an 18 year old is not the same as a 40 year old but yet high enough that they can be held accountable for their own actions. To me the two sides debating if he's a kid or not a kid is just an example of the polarizing effect of cases like this. Both sides have an idea of what 18 year olds are and are not.

When I was 13, I was in a Walgreens with a friend. When we got out, she pulled out a candy bar, a pair of sunglasses and some lip gloss out of her jeans. I had no idea before I went in the store with her that she was prone to doing this or was planning it. I didn't see her do it. I told her when I saw the stuff that it was wrong and I wasn't going into a store with her again, and I never did. I knew enough at that age to know that if I was with someone in a store that got caught, it would look like I condoned the behavior and I would be blamed even if I didn't participate.

When I was a freshman in high school, we were in math class and a friend passed her glasses case to me under the table and whispered, "there is something stuck in there, can you get it out?" I reached in there and pulled out a joint. I put it back in and handed it back to her with no comment. I don't know what the purpose was of what she was doing but that was the last time anyone ever showed me any drugs in high school. I guess word got around that I wasn't down with that.

I found out later in college that when I left the art studio at night (art studios and labs like the computer lab were open all night if you wanted to work) the drugs would come out later. Everyone knew not to get them out around me, apparently. I don't remember that even being a big issue, but people did know somehow. I would have objected if they had gotten joints out around me because I didn't want to smell like that - I didn't want anyone to think I did that.

When people say that resisting peer pressure is impossible and that teens are doomed to follow a bad path because they are not old enough to know better, I know that is not true. I also know that it was easier for me to resist than some. I was not in an environment where I feared being beaten or terrorized if I didn't go along with it. I get that I was raised in a two-parent family by parents who actually cared what I did and made it clear what they expected of me. I'm not saying I never did dumb stuff, but I had some idea of what was really serious and what was just silly and I stayed away from the really serious stuff. I considered crime and drugs to be serious with repercussions that could affect my whole life. I get that I'm female and have less testosterone and have less risk-taking tendency (though I did have some). I tended to channel my risk taking to things like going caving and jumping off cliffs into swimming holes - but even then it was somewhat tempered - I went caving with certified guides and only jumped off cliffs while sober and if other people did it first without getting hurt!

When addressing questions about the root causes of this sad situation, I mentioned that I think the tolerance of crime in a community may be a factor. Tolerance also shows what your expectations are. If you set low expectations, you get what you expect. If you set high expectations, yes sometimes people will fall short but not as often as if you've given up. I think hope in the future plays a role also. I was told when I was growing up that if I study hard and stay clean I will get into college and I will get a good job. I believed that because I had reason to believe it. My parents were both the first people in their immediate families to get college degrees and they had good jobs. Their fathers before them had jobs that did not require degrees but paid well enough to raise a small family in a lower middle class lifestyle. They could afford the basics of what they would consider a "decent" life - a small house, one car, Catholic school tuition, meat at most meals but not necessarily an expensive cut, a modest wardrobe of clean clothes, the proper ceremonial clothing when needed (prom gear, first communion dress or suit, wedding dress), money for scouting and sports teams, a vacation to the Ozarks every now and then. I get that this life was not easily attainable at that time if you were a person of color. I believe that my Dad's generation and his parents before him were the beneficiaries of the most favorable set of circumstances in the history of this country and I don't think those conditions are coming back. My grandmother told me that when she was in high school during the depression of the 1930s, that she was fortunate to graduate from high school because only 25% of kids did at that time. Many had to work to make ends meet. I'm a generation X'r and we were told by the media while growing up that we weren't going to have it as good but my personal circumstances dictated otherwise until recently. I'm undergoing downward mobility because of the current economy although I can still live a "decent" life and I'm not in debt or in danger of losing what I already have.

I don't know what I'd think about the future if I was a teenager now. I feel for that generation. I fear they are not likely to get as many chances as I did. I would say that if any young people are reading this not to ruin what chances you do have by getting involved in drugs or crime. If your elders won't insist on a better environment for you, maybe you should insist on a better environment for yourself. I know it's hard. I never had to conform at the point of a gun to a crime ridden culture.

 

[dandy]

Another random thought I can't but wonder out loud. I don't know how to put it very well, but here goes...

How many dishes of eggs in their face do Sharpton and his ilk need before they decide it would behoove them to avoid jumping to conclusions?

I followed the LaCrosse story and enough others to be amazed that they aren't hiding in a hole somewhere. They have made enough money off of stoking outrage, I bet they could even afford a nice hole.

i knew he was organizing a march in NYC this weekend - but this surprised me:

Family members of Michael Brown, the unarmed teenager killed by police in Ferguson, Mo., will be present, too, dramatizing a longstanding concern of Sharpton and others that too many black and Latino kids are being profiled, harassed and sometimes killed by law enforcement nationwide.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/sharpton-march-de-blasio-article-1.1910962#ixzz3B1r3gR27

 

[tlcya]

Sorry.. I thought you meant an actual expert, a doctor- the doctor said "graze wounds". I discount everything Parcells says. Zero cred. Sorry.

I too have concerns about this gentleman's qualifications. Which is why I do not believe the "spin" Parcell seems happy to put on the autopsy results of Dr. Baden. But it is hard to lie about whether something is a bullet entry wound or a superficial graze. I believe he was honest in his description of the wounds. Where he lost me was when he began trying to spin them in such a way as to make them continue to fit a false construction that is being shoved down the public's throat. I think the results of the autopsy are not flawed per se, just the gymnastics to make those results fit a submissive unarmed teen who had his hands up falsity that continues to be espoused by the family and is still being regurgitated by the uninformed and the press today.

Facts are facts and I believe the facts of the wounds. Where I part from this unusual gentleman is where he attempts to explain how those wounds came to be. Because his explanations make zero sense and do not align with the wounds in my mind which is why I arrived at my own theory on how they were received.

 

[oh_gal]

I suppose I'm an old fart and ole school but I remember the westerns where the Marshall could shoot the gun out of their hand. If a perpetrator has a knife in their hand, and there is time to focus why not shoot the perpetrator in the arm and hand to disarm them? LE has to go to gun ranges on a regular basis I believe. Maybe instead of focusing on head shot and chest shot being the accuracy score, possibly accuracy on other parts of the anatomy. To me looking at yesterday's event seems more wrong than the MB event.

JMO

My dad (LEO) once shot a robbery suspect in the elbow, causing him to drop whatever it was he'd just stolen. But that was 50 years ago. I guess times have changed.

 

[oh_gal]

Not directed to you popsicle, just jumping off of yours. He was 18 and I think nearly everyone would agree that the maturity and understanding level of an 18 year old is not the same as a 40 year old but yet high enough that they can be held accountable for their own actions. To me the two sides debating if he's a kid or not a kid is just an example of the polarizing effect of cases like this. Both sides have an idea of what 18 year olds are and are not.

The age issue aside, had he been able to get that gun away from the officer, he would have killed him. Even though he was "only 18".

 

[DeDee]

Listening to Fox about new info from the source that is "very close to Ferguson Police" and tells Fox:

Confrontation began when DW ordered MB and his friend Dorian J to stop walking in the middle of the street, were blocking traffic. When they ignored the officer, he started to get out of his patrol car but when he tried to get out, "they shoved him right back in, that's when MB leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and face... He was beaten very severely." MB fractured DW's eye socket, leaving DW dazed, then struggle for gun, that it went off, and authorities have "solid proof that Brown actually touched the officer's gun". Source won't say on the record what that proof is. Source also said then MB started to walk away, prompting Wilson to pull his gun and ordered Brown to freeze. Brown then raised his hands, turned around and said to Wilson "what, you're going to shoot me?" (consistent with what Josie said) Source said then MB went at officer who fired 6 shots including a final shot to the head.

My opinion in purple:

Rev. Jesse Jackson is worth $10 million by being a [social agitator] political activist.

http://www.celebritynetworth.com/richest-politicians/democrats/jesse-jackson-net-worth/

Rev. Al Sharpton is worth $5 million by being a [social agitator] political activist.

http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/televangelists/al-sharpton-net-worth/

These two men became millionaires at the expense of their own people. They are parasites who keep things stirred up so that there will be no peace because folks being peaceful does not earn them any/enough money. JMO

Regarding the initial encounter [CNN claims the entire encounter took place within 3 minutes] that Officer Wilson had with MB & DJ, the two guys who were obstructing traffic by walking in the middle of the street, their actions tell me that MB, in particular, was known in that neighborhood as someone to fear. MB wanted to control the residents who lived on that street by showing his overbearing presence as a to be fearful of. Don't mess with the King of the Road. MB was an intimidator and not only to store clerks/owners. MB walked in the middle of the street because, IMHO, he thought he owned that street and the people around him were his pawns. MB wanted to intimidate the cops, too. Beat them up so they won't come around messing with him. JMO

"Mike Mike" Really? I call BS. Monster Mike is more like it. OMO

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown

My opinion is based on the facts as I know them to be ATT.