MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #7

[wfgodot]

Here is my take on a kidnapper taking the cell phone, for the most part I think the general public is aware that phones can be tracking with cell phone pings, So if someone is going to steal a child, why on gods green earth would you want to have 3 phones on you that could show your point of travel, yes I understand they could be dumped but it is not like you are going to steal them and then just dump them right around the corner from where you took them from, So for that reason I think the phones were not taken or dumped by a kidnapper.

Well-put. Definitely one of the hinkier known aspects of the case to date.

 

[marge_rita]

Depends on the layout - he could have checked the house quickly, snatched the phones in clear view, and taken the baby. Either to sell all items quickly for cash, or to delay a 911 call.

You can put a phone in your pocket; you don't have to hold it.

Yes, of course 1 phone can be grabbed and stuck in a pocket. But 3, when someone is trying not to wake up anyone as they kidnap a baby? IDK.

 

[Katana]

LE takes clothes and stuffed animals but, not the baby bedding. So extremely confusing...does not seem logical at all.

 

[bessie]

This is beginning to remind me of Haleigh Cummings' disappearance. Questions about whether or not the door was locked, where the children were sleeping, what time the father actually left "werk", and a very tight timeline. An intruder did not walk in the Cummings' home and snatch Haleigh, and I have my doubts about whether that's what happened to little Lisa. For that matter, when is the last time we heard of a complete stranger entering a home in the middle of the night and kidnapping a baby?

 

[belimom]

Does luminal pick up anything else besides blood? Like mucous, urine, etc.? You would expect to find something along those lines in an infant's room, especially a sick infant. What if the luminal showed absolutely nothing? A totally wiped-down clean room?

Again, just speculating about why bed linens weren't taken. There must be a reason. Either the room is "clean" or LE does not think anything happened in there.

Thoughts?

 

[norest4thewicked]

LE takes clothes and stuffed animals but, not the baby bedding. So extremely confusing...does not seem logical at all.

Can you post a link of where you are getting this from?

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Tell me if this link doesn't work. It shows that he is the owner & the last sale date was 11/1/2002. I thought the same thing, no way could I have bought a house at that age. I think it's Deborah that hasn't lived there long. I also wonder why the home phone is registered to a male -last name Netz instead of Jeremy. Maybe someone else had been living there ? Got kicked out & still had a key ?

http://gisweb.claycogov.com/realEstate/realEstateDetail.jsp?parcelid=18115001400500

I don't know what to say. When I first checked your link,it didn't work. I check it again and it works but shows Jeremy Irwin as the owner. Not this Netz name I see you all talking about. I'm confused.

 

[Cher352]

It was reported that it was taken today before the interview with the parents for tonight's telecast.

News video at this link shows the crib looking just like it does in the still shot going around. The video shot after LE got through.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-fbi-searches-landfill/story?id=14688581

 

[norest4thewicked]

Does laminal pick up anything else besides blood? Like mucous, urine, etc.? You would expect to find something along those lines in an infant's room, especially a sick infant. What if the laminal showed absolutely nothing? A totally wiped-down clean room?

Again, just speculating about why bed linens weren't taken. There must be a reason. Either the room is "clean" or LE does not think anything happened in there.

Thoughts?

Luminol reacts to iron and therefore reacts to blood. This is a simplistic way of putting it.

 

[EllaMae]

I get what you're saying, Doc. You wouldn't think, gee, I remember that I forgot to lock the door. That's silly. About the only way I can think of that you'd "remember" you "forgot" is if you make a ritual of doing it at the same time each night. In that case, it might dawn on you later that you didn't do it.

Of course you can have a memory of not doing it. You can think to yourself ...How did I not lock that door? You remember that you did the dishes, put on your jammies, and curled up on the couch to watch TV and fell asleep, and later realize that you never got up and checked the doors even though you meant to do it.

Or you can remember that the phone rang as you were coming in the door with your hands full of grocery bags, and you never went back and locked the door because you were trying to get to the phone and put away the frozen stuff.

 

[redfish]

Bags of stuff was removed from the house - the video is not available anymore (at least I can't find it again) but here is a snag of some of the stuff that was removed.

ETA: The link: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...win-and-carry-out-two-bags-full-of-baby-items

thanks to norest4thewicked

It looks like they collected dirty laundry there!

I have to agree that up to this point I have been impressed by the job LE has done. I believe they have been up-front with the public and therefore I believe with the parents. They seem to have evidence that points to a different story than has been presented to us and them publicly. In my opinion the family does not want to "go there". Why?

 

[marge_rita]

I don't know. It would seem logical that you would go to the closest bedroom and work your way around. Unless there was a bathroom nearer the boys in which case I could see him hitting the bathroom, checking on the boys and working back to the baby's room.

The 2:30am call from the house makes me start sliding off this fence though because that was never in the timeline and, the way LE is throwing that out there is to me anyway a hint that they want someone to know they know some things that someone hasn't been honest about.

I didn't think about that. Maybe the boys rooms were closest to the front door.

That 2:30 am call is definitely something LE wants the parents or someone to know about.

 

[bessie]

Here is my take on a kidnapper taking the cell phone, for the most part I think the general public is aware that phones can be tracking with cell phone pings, So if someone is going to steal a child, why on gods green earth would you want to have 3 phones on you that could show your point of travel, yes I understand they could be dumped but it is not like you are going to steal them and then just dump them right around the corner from where you took them from, So for that reason I think the phones were not taken or dumped by a kidnapper.

Well, you could remove the batteries or drop them in a bucket of water. I agree with you, however, that it seems unlikely anyone would take the phones.

 

[gwenabob]

This is beginning to remind me of Haligh Cummings' disappearance. Questions about whether or not the door was locked, where the children were sleeping, what time the father actually left "werk", and a very tight timeline. An intruder did not walk in the Cummings' home and snatch Haleigh, and I have my doubts about whether that's what happened to little Lisa. For that matter, when is the last time we heard of a complete stranger entering a home in the middle of the night and kidnapping a baby?

The only case I can think of is from the movie Raising Arizona!

I can't think of a single real life case. Extremely risky. You can't control a baby. You try and pick it up and you have no idea if it will start wailing, alerting everyone in the house. Especially if all the lights are on. And you are juggling 3 cell phones. Who would do that?

Sorry, no. Not buying it. Something bad happened to that baby, and mom, (and maybe dad) are covering it up. The phones were tossed out to try to hide evidence.

 

[MyBelle]

Dr. Ablow said he thought that pointed to innocence.

I think it points to a serious underestimation of LE.

JMO

 

[norest4thewicked]

News video at this link shows the crib looking just like it does in the still shot going around. The video shot after LE got through.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-fbi-searches-landfill/story?id=14688581

Yes...that was what I said.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Interesting question Dr. Fessel. I have no problem admitting that I have NO MEMORY of things I forget. :waitasec: lol

If I forget to hang my phone on the charger before going to bed, I still lay in bed thinking I hung the phone on the charger. When I get up the next day, I'll swear I hung it up.
imo

Now I have to test this theory out. I have to forget to do something.:floorlaugh:

 

[JEN12376]

I still have to wonder who goes to bed and leaves cell phones on a kitchen counter. Even if they are new and you have been putting new numbers in. Especially if you are home alone with 3 children. What if there was an emergency with your spouse at work or your parents or a sibling and someone tried to call you and your phone was just sitting rooms away on a kitchen counter. You wouldn't even hear it. I don't know of anyone without a land line that doesn't keep their phone right near them. I never go to bed without my phone on my night stand and neither does my dh. We don't even have alarm clocks. We use our phones to wake us up as well. Or God Forbid someone does enter your home and you are in bed and you hear something. Wouldn't you want the phone right next to you to make a call out? Doesn't make sense to me.

 

[MyBelle]

Well, you could remove the batteries or drop them in a bucket of water. I agree with you, however, that it seems unlikely anyone would take the phones.

or you could throw them into a dumpster, set it on fire and the water from the fire hoses would take care of it.

 

[Cher352]

Maybe they straightened the room up after LE left. The room looks clean to me.
The height of the bed bothers me too. baby Lisa is a tall 30 inches.

imo

Since that room was shown in the ABC video maybe ABC straightened it up for the segment because usually we hear that once investigators get though it looks like a tornado has hit.