NC - Two Duke Lacrosse Players Indicted

[BillyGoatGruff]

A vaginal swab from the accuser did find genetic material from one "single male source," but that source was not any member of the lacrosse team, Chesire said.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/LegalCente...=1955746&page=1

Someone known to the police apparently.

Found this too.
http://www.gadsdentimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060512/APS/605121024&sectioncat=NEWS

[…]

The "single male source" who matched the genetic material found on the vaginal swab take from the victim is named in the report on the second round of DNA tests, which were done at a private lab. Cheshire said the man "is known to the Durham police department" but he declined to give the man's name or comment on his relationship with the accuser.

"There is no indication that this man should have his name dragged through the mud," he said.

What I find interesting is that this means is the dude's DNA was already in their databank.

 

[SewingDeb]

What I find interesting is that this means is the dude's DNA was already in their databank.

I was thinking the same thing until I read that the police had taken a DNA swab from her boyfriend's cheek.

 

[nanandjim]

I could be wrong; but I bet the DA will play this thing all the way out to save face and to stave any possible lawsuits against him by the boys.

It is a shame that the boys who were charged will have their lives ruined and their parents will be out of a lot of money.

I am willing to bet that this woman will not be prosecuted for false allegations unless there is a strong outcry from the community and Jesse Jackson will still pay her tuition.

I think that this woman cried rape because the boys tried to take back (or took back with force) the $400 they had paid her because she and the other dancer left after a few minutes of performing.

 

[Wudge]

I could be wrong; but I bet the DA will play this thing all the way out to save face and to stave any possible lawsuits against him by the boys.

It is a shame that the boys who were charged will have their lives ruined and their parents will be out of a lot of money.

I am willing to bet that this woman will not be prosecuted for false allegations unless there is a strong outcry from the community and Jesse Jackson will still pay her tuition.

I think that this woman cried rape because the boys tried to take back (or took back with force) the $400 they had paid her because she and the other dancer left after a few minutes of performing.

Nobody is going to sue the D.A., Michael Nifong. Defense laywers know that any such attempt would be absolutely futile.

Moreover, to do so would keep this case and the players names in the spotlight, which is the last thing that the parents want.

Net, short of a confession from the alleged victim saying that she lied, there is nothing that can be done to reclaim the players names.

If you think otherwise, consider these names: Ramseys, Aisenbergs, Condit, Van der Sloot, etc.. They all were falsely vilified by the media and will forever live under a cloud as a result.

Basically, we have expanded on the cauldron recipes that were used to obtain justice in Salem, 1692, to now become an entire nation that operates under a cloak of "presumed guilty".

What a wonderful nation, huh?

 

[BillyGoatGruff]

I was thinking the same thing until I read that the police had taken a DNA swab from her boyfriend's cheek.

STILL doesn't mean his DNA wasn't already in the databank.

 

[Peter Hamilton]

Wudge,I find it amusing that you lump the Salem Witch trials with contemporary events--The Salem killings were a tiny offshoot of the extreme superstiuosness and depravity of what was going on in Europe at the time--you do know that Europe killed TENS of THOUSANDS of innocent women,accusing them of being witches--That's why most immigrants came to the US,to escape the European depravity from that time and future centuries--remember that Europeans,in 2 World Wars killed over 70 million people

 

[BrendaStar]

Wudge,I find it amusing that you lump the Salem Witch trials with contemporary events--

I cannot understand what the Salem Witch trials have to do with this case. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

 

[Wudge]

I cannot understand what the Salem Witch trials have to do with this case. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

The point was and remains that if you were accused of being a witch in Salem, you were "presumed guilty". The trial was for show only. The real witches were those doing the judging, and the verdict was a foregone conclusion: Guilty.

Fundamentally and likewise, our nation has adopted a rush to judgment mentality and a witches presumption of "presumed guilty". As such, innocent people who hope to reclaim their good name, have no chance.

 

[kidzndogznme]

Nor was it meant to.

The context of my saying: "The children, cousins, brothers, sisters, grandchildren etc., of many blacks, who were savagely abused, murdered or falsely convicted and executed, remain alive today.", was made in reference to black people who have seen horrid acts of racism and take a measure of revenge when they are seated in a jury box.

That still makes no sense to me. So if my dad had been executed by hanging in the south by someone of a different race, then I should be entitled to march around for my entire life feeling vengeful? If I got called to jury, I should be feeling empowered if the defendant was of a the same race as the people who convicted my father because now I would get to "take a measure of revenge"? That doesn't compute with me. How is it revenge to harm someone (illegally I might add if I were to convict them for something I know they didn't do) who is of the same race as someone who supposedly wronged my family? It isn't hurting the people who did the crime! It is just someone of their race! So is it about picking off as many of that particular race as possible? Like if their numbers are reduced by 1 or 2 innocent people, then the world is better?

 

[Wudge]

That still makes no sense to me. So if my dad had been executed by hanging in the south by someone of a different race, then I should be entitled to march around for my entire life feeling vengeful? If I got called to jury, I should be feeling empowered if the defendant was of a the same race as the people who convicted my father because now I would get to "take a measure of revenge"? That doesn't compute with me. How is it revenge to harm someone (illegally I might add if I were to convict them for something I know they didn't do) who is of the same race as someone who supposedly wronged my family? It isn't hurting the people who did the crime! It is just someone of their race! So is it about picking off as many of that particular race as possible? Like if their numbers are reduced by 1 or 2 innocent people, then the world is better?

As I said in a previous post, if the defendant is white, prosecutors in Durham (and elsewhere in the south) want to seat a jury that is heavily weighted with black jurors and vice-versa. While you might not understand the forces and feelings at play, they do.

This is yet another reason why I would support moving that to a jury system of strictly professional jurors.

 

[MysteryAddict]

Questions....

Where in that house is the bathroom located?

I've never seen that mentioned. It looks like a one
story house. Anyway, I can't help wondering, if the
girl was being attacked, why wouldn't someone have
heard her scream for help?? You can't tell me that
every one of those guys would be so evil as to allow
three of their team mates to rape a girl!

Also, I keep thinking that upon emerging from that
bathroom the first thing you would expect the girl to
do is scream-- They Raped Me!!!!!!!!!!!
Wouldn't those be the first words to her girlfriend?

I don't know what happened, but these questions are
unanswered for me.

 

[Sherlockmom]

"David Evans, a 23-year-old senior and team captain from Bethesda, Md., was indicted on charges of first-degree forcible rape, sexual offense and kidnapping. Two other players were indicted on similar charges last month"

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=triangle&id=4173086

Sherlockmom

 

[Sherlockmom]

Also from same article:

"ABC News' Law & Justice Unit was given exclusive details about the latest DNA report in the Duke lacrosse rape investigation and was shown and reviewed parts of the 10-page document.
According to the DNA report, tests specifically designed to look for semen found none on swabs of the alleged victim's mouth or genital areas. This is noteworthy, defense lawyers said, because in at least one affidavit and in the transcript of the photo identification lineup, the alleged victim said she was raped orally, vaginally and anally by three members of the Duke men's lacrosse team. "

The article further states that no blood was found on the fingernails that were supposedly used to scratch the players as she defended herself from their attacks.

Other new information was that the police took DNA samples from 3 other men who were not from the team, one of them was the alleged boyfriend. The DNA found on those nails was a mixture of DNA from other people including the victim.

"In a transcript of the photo lineup used to identify alleged attackers, the alleged victim says the third player, "looks like one of the guys who assaulted me sort of." She identified him with 90 percent certainty after Police Sgt. Mark Gottlieb asked, "What is the likelihood this is one of the gentlemen who assaulted you?"

Sort of? Well I guess he did since he was white and that seems to be all that is required here.

Sherlockmom

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Defense: 2nd DNA Tests Show No Conclusive Link to Lacrosse Players

A second round of DNA testing in the Duke University lacrosse rape case came back with the same result as the first — no conclusive match to any member of the team, defense attorneys said Friday.

Attorney Joseph Cheshire, who represents a team captain who has not been charged, said the tests showed genetic material from a "single male source" was found on a vaginal swab taken from the accuser, but that material did not match any of the players.

"In other words, it appears this woman had sex with a male," said Cheshire, who spoke at a news conference with other defense attorneys in the case. "It also appears with certainty it wasn't a Duke lacrosse player."

Cheshire said the testing did find some genetic material from several people on a plastic fingernail found in a bathroom trash can of the house where the team held the March 13 party. He said some of that material had the "same characteristics" — a link short of a conclusive match — to some of the players, but not the two who have been charged with rape, kidnapping and sexual assault.

* * *

The dancer, a 27-year-old black student at nearby North Carolina Central University, told police she was raped and beaten for a half-hour by three white men at the party. A grand jury has charged sophomores Reade Seligmann, of Essex Fells, N.J., and Collin Finnerty, of Garden City, N.Y., with rape, kidnapping and sexual assault.

* * *

"There has got to be some really good prosecution explanation as to why the DNA evidence does not exist and why someone else's would be there," Goldman said.

Cheshire said the fact that the players turned over the fingernail shows they had nothing to hide.

"Is that consistent with someone that knowledgeably and knowingly committed a rape?" Cheshire said. "That they would leave fingernails that were ripped off a person in a violent struggle in their trash can after they're told there's an investigation and that police were going to come to their house, and when the police do, they give them the fingernails?"

* * *

The "single male source" who matched the genetic material found on the vaginal swab take from the victim is named in the report on the second round of DNA tests, which were done at a private lab. Cheshire said the man "is known to the Durham police department" but he declined to give the man's name or comment on his relationship with the accuser.

"There is no indication that this man should have his name dragged through the mud," he said.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,195355,00.html



(THIS ARTICLE WAS WRITTEN BEFORE THE THIRD PLAYER WAS INDICTED.)

 

[Jeana (DP)]

How is it possible for three big strapping athletes to "beat" a woman for 30 minutes and she just gets up and walks away? She did appear to have some scratches on her, but not until she fell on the stairs leaving. Wearing those 6' inch high "stripper shoes" may have caused her to lose her balance.

Although I'm STILL trying to keep an open mind about this case, things just ain't adding up for me.

The third guy was indicated by a grand jury, so they must know a hell of a lot that we don't yet.

 

[Paladin]

I still fail to see how a fingernail with DNA on it links them to rape. She could have been grabbing at a guy for the money they took back from her or she could have been doing a dance and touching a guy.

I really don't think they did anything to this girl other than boot her to the curb after they were displeased with her.

The other thing that really gets me is, why wasn't there a bouncer accompanying these women? I've seen two strippers in action at private parties and both times there was at LEAST one huge hulking bodyguard looking after these women.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I still fail to see how a fingernail with DNA on it links them to rape. She could have been grabbing at a guy for the money they took back from her or she could have been doing a dance and touching a guy.

I really don't think they did anything to this girl other than boot her to the curb after they were displeased with her.

The other thing that really gets me is, why wasn't there a bouncer accompanying these women? I've seen two strippers in action at private parties and both times there was at LEAST one huge hulking bodyguard looking after these women.

I've never been to a party where there was a need for a "bouncer" because the strippers were men, but . . . I agree with you. They were being paid a total of $800 for two hours. Surely they could have paid someone part of that to come and watch their backs. I also don't believe the fingernail story. The players LEFT them there even once they KNEW the police were coming to collect "evidence." Doesn't sound to me like something a guilty person(s) would do. These are intelligent young men.

 

[Wudge]

SNIP

so they must know a hell of a lot that we don't yet.

That is fallacious logic.

All across this nation, prosecutors try tons of cases with but the weakest kind of evidence, such as, going to trial based on the say so of a totally unreliable eyewitness. When prosecutors have weak evidence, they select weak-minded jurors, and, I can assure you, finding the same in Durham will not be a problem.

Moreover, not only do prosecutors across this nation knowingly try the innocent, in North Carolina, it is considered to be fine art.

There is now another point for reflection too. Not only is there a "prosecutor problem" in this case -- willfully making yourself blind, deaf and dumb to exonerating evidence in beyind all professional pale -- but we now also have a similar problem with this Grand Jury. For in the last month, this Grand Jury assuredly became knowledgeable of all the exonerating facts that the nation became privy to after the inital indictments were handed down. By this Grand Jury indicting a third young man today, they knowingly set out to have his life destroyed too.

May they all rot in hell.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

That is fallacious logic.

All across this nation, prosecutors try tons of cases with but the weakest kind of evidence, such as, going to trial based on the say so of a totally unreliable eyewitness. When prosecutors have weak evidence, they select weak-minded jurors, and, I can assure you, finding the same in Durham will not be a problem.

Moreover, not only do prosecutors across this nation knowingly try the innocent, in North Carolina, it is considered to be fine art.

There is now another point for reflection too. Not only is there a "prosecutor problem in this case -- willfully making yourself blind, deaf and dumb to exonerating evidence in beyind all professional pale -- but we now also have a similar problem with this Grand Jury. For in the last month, this Grand Jury assuredly became knowledgeable of all the exonerating facts that the nation became privy to after the inital indictments were handed down. By this Grand Jury indicting a third young man today, they knowingly set out to have his life destroyed too.

May they all rot in hell.

Wudge, you're going to have to give me a big break here. :doh:

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Information about the third player indicted:



Evans, who lived in the off-campus house where the party was held, said his own attorneys had given him a polygraph test. He said his two teammates charged in the case were innocent as well.

* * *

Cheshire said the accuser identified Evans with "90 percent certainty" during a photo identification lineup that defense attorneys have criticized as improper. He said the accuser told police she would be 100 percent sure of the identification if Evans had a mustache -- something he said Evans has never had.

more at:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/more/05/15/duke.lacrosse.ap/index.html?cnn=yes

A MUSTACHE????????????