New Details of Josh's Brainwashing Techniques

SBM

Respectfully, Gitana, I didn't interpret the report that way. In the first report, completed before the psychologist had the chance to view the images from Josh Powell's computer, his recommendation lists several conditions before the possibility of reunification:



To me, that is a pretty high bar to clear. "When he is no longer a subject of investigation" obviously means *if* Josh Powell were cleared; the only other way JP could no longer be a subject of investigation would be if he were convicted and clearly reunification would be impossible at that point.

And then he'd have to do significant work on his personality and parenting deficits.

That all sounds pretty legitimate to me because if Josh Powell were cleared (the matters noted were Susan's disappearance and being implicated in computerised child 🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬), then there really wouldn't be a legal reason to prevent it, as I understand it.

To me, this reads as a polite way of saying "reunification may be possible on a very icy day in hell..."

As to the recommendation in the first report to allow continuing visitation:



Again, this sounds pretty legitimate to me. I am not a lawyer or a psychologist or a judge but when I read "this is predicated on..." that suggests to me that only so long as the three conditions listed were fulfilled could visitation continue. The boys would have to want to see their father, their therapist would have to continue to agree that it was in the boys' best interests and JP would have had to curtail the ranting about the Coxes, Mormons and Jews in front of the boys (which is what the "failure to focus on the boys" refers to earlier in the report).

As I understand the current research, it strongly suggests that children benefit from contact with their family of origin when they are in foster care, either with relatives or with a non-family home.

Visitation would be under supervision at all times and JP was aware of the things the supervisor would be looking for which, if he wanted to regain custody, would tend to suppress the worst of his known behaviour with the boys.


At the moment, it feels as if the simplest common sense was abandoned here in favor of "protocol".

It would seem, in the professions of psych/soc/family law - experience would dictate that there are exceptions to the rule, and that ... Josh Powell was the perfect example of that exception to the rule that children should benefit from contact with the family of origin. Especially considering some that family was in jail for pedophilia, and the main part of that family was a suspect in their mother's disappearance.

I'm thinking the Court should have been able to arrive at this obvious conclusion and weighed in with a family court wisdom and child advocacy position that has the obligation to be not-so-damned-blind.
 
At the moment, it feels as if the simplest common sense was abandoned here in favor of "protocol".

It would seem, in the professions of psych/soc/family law - experience would dictate that there are exceptions to the rule, and that ... Josh Powell was the perfect example of that exception to the rule that children should benefit from contact with the family of origin. Especially considering some that family was in jail for pedophilia, and the main part of that family was a suspect in their mother's disappearance.

I'm thinking the Court should have been able to arrive at this obvious conclusion and weighed in with a family court wisdom and child advocacy position that has the obligation to be not-so-damned-blind.

They had plenty of evidence of violence and a suicide attempt from his teen years and was not being honest about it, they had good reason to believe he killed his wife and he was a narcissist and an interest in incest. There was no reason he should have had any visits until he was honest with them and proved it through the LDT.
 
This is my idea of what might have been going on with the pictures on the computer found in the search by WVPD in Utah.

Not long after Susan went missing either the WVPD or Josh Powells lawyer went to court and got any evidence of the case locked up and a gag order put on Powell and the WVPD.

These pictures were not illegal and just them and Susan missing was probably not enough to get the kids taken away from Josh in a Utah court and since Josh moved so fast they really did not have much of a chance.

Now when they did the search of Steve Powells home they found enough evidence to take the kids out and do evaluations.

I think Washinton police got a tip from child services that Josh was going to get the kids back soon and Washington Pd contacted the Utah WVPD and they agreed to send the pics to WA for them to use so Josh would not get the kids back right away.

WVPD in Utah had to go to court and get the court to let them release the pictures to Washington and there were strict rules on who could see them because of this gag order in place in Utah.



I think WVPD wanted to hold on to these pictures and not let Josh and his lawyer know exactly what they were because they were going to use them in a murder with no body trial at some point. They were going to say it was possible Susan had found them on the computer and confronted Josh about them.



It is time now the Utah court unseal this case and release all the evidence but I think the WVPD is going to fight tooth and nail not to release it because I have a feeling these pictures are just the tip of the iceberg.

thanks fessel.

WVPD in Utah had to go to court and get the court to let them release the pictures to Washington and there were strict rules on who could see them because of this gag order in place in Utah.

...

I think WVPD wanted to hold on to these pictures and not let Josh and his lawyer know exactly what they were because they were going to use them in a murder with no body trial at some point. They were going to say it was possible Susan had found them on the computer and confronted Josh about them.

I'd missed that tidbit that WVPD had to go to court in Utah...

So you think that Josh & his attny couldn't see the pix? By Utah-placed restrictions?

Do you think the WA Court was restricted from this info as well?


Make my head stop spinnin', my bench-warmin' Doc-Mcdreamy.
 
thanks fessel.



I'd missed that tidbit that WVPD had to go to court in Utah...

So you think that Josh & his attny couldn't see the pix? By Utah-placed restrictions?

Do you think the WA Court was restricted from this info as well?


Make my head stop spinnin', my bench-warmin' Doc-Mcdreamy.

Sweet! I was afraid you were ignoring me.:seeya:

Josh did not get to see the pictures but his lawyer did. His lawyer said they were in bad taste but not illegal.

There were 8 people that got to see the pictures. I think the Judge was one of them. Let me see if I can find the article.
 
Sweet! I was afraid you were ignoring me.:seeya:

why nevah!

LOL. I must have but been feelin' a bit lightheaded upon first hearing your protestations and evidence. Adrenalin <and being pissed off beyond belief> sometimes can do that to a lady. ;)
 
Ok here is one article that tells part of the story. Let me find another too. I just read in this one they did not notify the Cox's lawyer about the picture so he could see them........

but a lawyer for Powell's in-laws, who had custody of the boys, wasn't invited to see the materials before the custody hearing - even though a Utah judge had specified in a sealed court order that he was one of the few people allowed to see them.






Had he seen the images, attorney Steve Downing said, he might have asked the court to change the terms of Powell's supervised visitation with the boys, such as by asking for the visits to be in a public place. Instead, Downing said he didn't learn until Thursday morning - four days after Powell killed himself and the boys in a house fire - that he was allowed to see them.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/1...ges-on-his-computer-police-say/#ixzz1mijZwX8J



http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/10/powell-had-incestuous-images-on-his-computer-police-say/
 
Sweet! I was afraid you were ignoring me.:seeya:

Josh did not get to see the pictures but his lawyer did. His lawyer said they were in bad taste but not illegal.

There were 8 people that got to see the pictures. I think the Judge was one of them. Let me see if I can find the article.

Ah. I see. Only 8 people, not Josh. Yes the judge.

That doesn't make my mood any better.

And if you show Josh's attny the pix ... I submit that you've shown Josh the pix.

Just sayin'
 
Ok here is one article that tells part of the story. Let me find another too. I just read in this one they did not notify the Cox's lawyer about the picture so he could see them........

but a lawyer for Powell's in-laws, who had custody of the boys, wasn't invited to see the materials before the custody hearing - even though a Utah judge had specified in a sealed court order that he was one of the few people allowed to see them.






Had he seen the images, attorney Steve Downing said, he might have asked the court to change the terms of Powell's supervised visitation with the boys, such as by asking for the visits to be in a public place. Instead, Downing said he didn't learn until Thursday morning - four days after Powell killed himself and the boys in a house fire - that he was allowed to see them.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/1...ges-on-his-computer-police-say/#ixzz1mijZwX8J



http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/10/powell-had-incestuous-images-on-his-computer-police-say/

BBM.

Thanks for catching me up.

That is atrocious.

I'm going to vomit now.

After considering Long's arguments and the recommendation for the psychosexual evaluation, Nelson denied Powell's request. She said she wouldn't consider granting Powell custody unless he underwent the exam. She didn't make any changes in the visitation schedule, which allowed Powell to see his boys, 5 and 7, at his house twice a week while supervised by a social worker.
 
Oh, and the court didn't feel like the Cox's lawyer needed to see these pictures but in a previous hearing the court did ask the Cox's if it was alright with them if Josh had visits with his kids in his home and the Cox's said ok thinking it would be best for the kids.
 
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What could she be thinking?


Is she not furious? :furious:
The only red I see is on her fabulous manicure.
 
You know, I am not a sue-happy person. I work in the legal field in insurance defense litigation. I hate to see all the suits out there with people suing for stupid stuff they should just let go of. But I have to say, this is such a major cluster * that I think a huge lawsuit is in order. And I can think of a whole lot of people/agencies/judges who should be listed as defendants. And the money that comes out of the suit ought to be donated to helping abused women and children flee their abuser, and to help pass laws that will force better training of CPS and court employees to recognize monsters like Josh Powell. JMO.
 
Oh, and the court didn't feel like the Cox's lawyer needed to see these pictures but in a previous hearing the court did ask the Cox's if it was alright with them if Josh had visits with his kids in his home and the Cox's said ok thinking it would be best for the kids.

oh crap.

okay, I give up.

I'm gonna go with this being the work of the devil. Mere mortals cannot be held accountable. :crazy:

:grouphug: to all. Another tough revelation on the Powell threads.
 
You know, I am not a sue-happy person. I work in the legal field in insurance defense litigation. I hate to see all the suits out there with people suing for stupid stuff they should just let go of. But I have to say, this is such a major cluster * that I think a huge lawsuit is in order. And I can think of a whole lot of people/agencies/judges who should be listed as defendants. And the money that comes out of the suit ought to be donated to helping abused women and children flee their abuser, and to help pass laws that will force better training of CPS and court employees to recognize monsters like Josh Powell. JMO.

LOL gwenabob.

Wow, really? (thank goodness! thought I was going nutzo.)

That's how I felt until Fessel guilted me out of it. ;)
 
LOL gwenabob.

Wow, really? (thank goodness! thought I was going nutzo.)

That's how I felt until Fessel guilted me out of it. ;)

Nope, no guilt here. There were dozens of people and agencies who dropped the ball on this one. There needs to be a complete airing and rebuilding of the system so this never happens again. And a big lawsuit is the first step to forcing open the windows of justice.
 
oh crap.

okay, I give up.

I'm gonna go with this being the work of the devil. Mere mortals cannot be held accountable. :crazy:

:grouphug: to all. Another tough revelation on the Powell threads.
I am right there with you on that idea. And I think he flitted back and forth from Josh to the 911 operator just to mess with the social worker that took the boys to that house.
 
Nope, no guilt here. There were dozens of people and agencies who dropped the ball on this one. There needs to be a complete airing and rebuilding of the system so this never happens again. And a big lawsuit is the first step to forcing open the windows of justice.

gwenabob, that would feel good. Who's the Plaintiff?

Us?

<modsnip>

Heck, why not! In honor of Susan, her sons, and her parents.
 
gwenabob, that would feel good. Who's the Plaintiff?

Us?

WS?

Heck, why not! In honor of Susan, her sons, and her parents.

I think the Coxes would be the plaintiffs. I think that would be the most reasonable. And I would make it a federal suit for a lot of different things including violation of the boys' civil rights.
 
I am right there with you on that idea. And I think he flitted back and forth from Josh to the 911 operator just to mess with the social worker that took the boys to that house.

Sometimes it sure feels like there is no better explanation.
 

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