NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #8

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  • #201
On the character of Paddock, just reflecting about something that stands out....

Amid the various stories by people who knew Paddock personally, not one that I noticed about how he helped or was remembered for acts of kindness toward others in any way, aside from something that directly connected in one way or another with his financial status.

What a sharp contrast ---
Many of the victims have shared remarkable of heroic and selfless acts - some who threw their bodies over total strangers to protect them from bullets, others who were total strangers risking their own lives by helping injured victims to flee or rushing the injured to hospitals in their vehicles.
 
  • #202
  • #203
Aurora results of Google search for 30 day timeframe after

The search was Aurora investigation

Search Results



www.cnn.com/2012/07/20/us/colorado-theater-shooting/index.html


Jul 20, 2012 - The suspect in the mass shooting at an Aurora, Colorado, movie theater screening of the new Batman film early Friday had colored his hair red and told police ...




movie theater shooting in Colorado - The New York Times

www.nytimes.com/2012/.../shooting-at-colorado-theater-showing-batman-movie.html


Jul 20, 2012 - Police investigated the suspect's car outside a movie theater after a shooting in ... at the Century 16 multiplex in Aurora, about 10 miles from downtown Denver.




Aurora 'Dark Knight' Suspect James Holmes Says He 'Was the Joker ...

abcnews.go.com/Blotter/aurora-dark-knight-suspect-joker-cops/story?id...


Jul 20, 2012 - Aurora 'Dark Knight' Suspect James Holmes Said He 'Was the Joker': Cops ... Witnesses to the shooting said that a man appeared at the front of the theater about 20 ... 100 of its agents are on the scene assisting with the ongoinginvestigation.




Aurora theater shooting: Alex Sullivan's life is framed in touching ...

www.denverpost.com/.../aurora-theater-shooting-alex-sullivans-life-is-framed-in-touc...


Jul 25, 2012 - Aurora theater shooting: Alex Sullivan's life is framed in touching memories ... of 12 people killed in Friday morning's shooting at an Aurora movie theater, turned 27 .... Boulder youth soccer coach under investigation seen watching games with ...




Aurora Colorado theater shooting - Photos - The Big Picture - Boston ...

www.boston.com/bigpicture/2012/07/aurora_colorado_theater_shooti.html


Jul 23, 2012 - An Aurora Police Department detective takes a witness statement following the shooting ... Police investigatethe suspect's car outside the movie theater after the ...




[video=youtube;3rwiBKhAI_o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rwiBKhAI_o"]Aurora, Colorado Mass Shooting at Movie Theater (RAW VIDEO ...[/URL]

Aurora Investigation Page - Freedomslips.com[/h]www.freedomslips.com/aurora/


Jul 28, 2012 - OAK CREEK INVESTIGATION STARTS HERE ..... Nearly 100 Batman fans packed the Aurora, Colorado theaterat midnight to watch their superhero defeat ...




Aurora theater shooting: Five twisted theories about the attack ...

www.westword.com/.../aurora-theater-shooting-five-twisted-theories-about-the-attack-...


Jul 25, 2012 - In the days since the Aurora theater shootings, the blogosphere has erupted with ... fingered by author Mike Adams was the Federal Bureau of Investigation.




Colo. shooter purchased guns legally from 3 different stores - CBS News

https://www.cbsnews.com/.../colo-shooter-purchased-guns-legally-from-3-different-st...


Jul 20, 2012 - A law enforcement source close to theinvestigation told CBS News that all the guns were purchased within ... Deadly movie theater rampage in Aurora, Colo.




Aurora PD Issues Press Release on Colorado Theater Shooting ...

www.policemag.com/.../aurora-pd-issues-press-release-on-colorado-theater-shooting.a...


Jul 20, 2012 - Aurora Police are investigating a shooting at the Century 16 movie theater, located at 14300 E. Alameda Ave., involving approximately 50 victims with at least 12 ...

Aurora theater shooting: Five twisted theories about the attack ...

www.westword.com/.../aurora-theater-shooting-five-twisted-theories-about-the-attack-...


Jul 25, 2012 - In the days since the Aurora theater shootings, the blogosphere has erupted with ... fingered by author Mike Adams was the Federal Bureau of Investigation.




Aurora Investigation Page - Freedomslips.com

www.freedomslips.com/aurora/


Jul 28, 2012 - OAK CREEK INVESTIGATION STARTS HERE ..... Nearly 100 Batman fans packed the Aurora, Colorado theaterat midnight to watch their superhero defeat ...




Aurora, Colo., 'Dark Knight' shootings - The Washington Post

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/aurora-colo.../gJQA9wI2xW_topic.html


Jul 20, 2012 - At least 12 people died and dozens were injured on Friday, July 20, 2012, after a mass shooting in a darkened movie theater in Aurora, Colo. that was crowded ...




University Of Colorado Begins Investigation Into James Holmes After ...

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/.../university-of-colorado-james-holmes_n_1764483...


Aug 10, 2012 - University Of Colorado Begins Investigation Into James Holmes After Aurora Shooting ... in the months leading up to a mass shooting at an Aurora movie theater.




Aurora PD Issues Press Release on Colorado Theater Shooting ...

www.policemag.com/.../aurora-pd-issues-press-release-on-colorado-theater-shooting.a...


Jul 20, 2012 - Aurora Police are investigating a shooting at the Century 16 movie theater, located at 14300 E. Alameda Ave., involving approximately 50 victims with at least 12 ...




At least 12 dead, 59 injured in Colorado theater shooting during 'Dark ...

www.foxnews.com/.../deadly-shooting-colorado-movie-theater-dark-knight-rises.html


Jul 20, 2012 - Aurora Police Chief Dan Oates said authorities are "confident" that Holmes ... FBI spokesman Jason Pack said there's no indication in the investigation so far of ...




Shooting Suspect Attacked During 'Dark Knight Rises' Movie « CBS ...

denver.cbslocal.com/2012/.../aurora-colorado-mall-shooting-town-center-century-16/


Jul 20, 2012 - (CBS4) – A terrifying shooting at an Auroramovie theater overnight left 12 .... owns the Century 16Theater, said they are working with police in the investigation.




Video: 3-D software recreates Aurora theater shooting - PoliceOne

https://www.policeone.com/...investigation/.../5882100-Video-3-D-software-recreates-...


Jul 27, 2012 - Video: 3-D software recreates Aurora theatershooting. CSI technology shows the crime scene to an exact scale as ... Crime Scene Investigation Buyers Guide ...




Colorado shooting: Massacre at Aurora movie theater - AJC.com

www.ajc.com/news/national/...aurora-movie-theater/8BnCDvIBUA34W1RLkU9t6M/


Jul 20, 2012 - A gunman wearing a gas mask shot 71 people, killing 12 in a movie theater in Aurora, Colo.




12 people killed, 70 wounded in Colorado movie theater shooting - Jul ...

www.history.com/.../12-people-killed-70-wounded-in-colorado-movie-theater-shooti...


Jul 20, 2012 - The incident in Aurora began when the shooter, James Holmes, entered theater ... Investigators learned that in the months leading up to the tragedy Holmes had ...

 
  • #204
In general, comments on media reports, public news facebook accts, everywhere. And yes I know conspiracy theories have become prevalavent. However those who are convinced of a CT don't appear to have any "motive" other than nothing can be believed and everything is faked. What I don't get is why?

If one gets to the point that nothing can be believed and everything is faked, then never ever can there be truth. I can't begin to imagine how such a philosophy impacts personal relationships as well but it sure can't be good.

I think first you have to distinguish between the so called "conspiracy theorists" who look at each event individually with logic and critical analysis, and those who i will refer to as "conspiracy nuts", including the auto-hoaxers, who automatically assume all major events are faked or wild conspiracies.

Once that distinction is made you can then go about discussing their motives.

The term "conspiracy theory/theorist" is very misleading IMO. And intentionally so.
 
  • #205
There weren't 22,000 witnesses in any of those shootings, or 22,000 people directly affected by them.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

An investigative report immediately released could also be considered proof of CT because everything was prearranged, conspired in advance and no actual investigation took place because the report was but a cover up, a deception.

Either way......
 
  • #206
There weren't 22,000 witnesses in any of those shootings, or 22,000 people directly affected by them.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

They are not talking to 22000 people.!

Pretty sure they got that number from total sales for the three day event

That was not 22,000 people!!

Anyone know the formal name of the place of the concert?? The facility?

here is what 16000 look like

images


https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1...64.psy-ab..0.2.212.6..35i39k1.118.TAKc3AvIs8o
 
  • #207
When did Tucker stop wearing bow ties? It hasn't helped, JMO. Why does he hate union workers so much? He's only being nice to the local union leader because he wants to use him to get information he can twist against JC. Does the union leader not realize he's being used by someone who hates union workers?

Also, why is Tucker and conservative cohorts trying to demonize JC just because he has family that are from Mexico? The cruel attacks on this man are beyond the pale.

I know it's hard for some people to accept that the domestic terrorist who did the mass murder was a white, wealthy conservative, gun-loving, country western music fan who liked to gamble in Vegas. But you're going to have to learn to live with that. It has happened before and will again. Domestic terrorists come from all kinds of backgrounds.
BBM

I thought we had to have citations when stating something as facts? Do you have citations for these statements? As far as I've seen, there hasn't been anything to point to him being a conservative, and gun-loving and country music fan has no credible basis in reality as we know it right now.

:moo:
 
  • #208
I think first you have to distinguish between the so called "conspiracy theorists" who look at each event individually with logic and critical analysis, and those who i will refer to as "conspiracy nuts", including the auto-hoaxers, who automatically assume all major events are faked or wild conspiracies.

Once that distinction is made you can then go about discussing their motives.

The term "conspiracy theory" is very misleading IMO. And intentionally so.

I guess I must be missing the analysis part. What I notice is the final report hasn't been released.

Meanwhile the media who lives by its ratings is anxious for more information. So perhaps not by coincidence, little anonymous tidbits are being released without any supporting information whatsoever. Some people are assuming that information is factual even though it wasn't released by officially named sources and then using it as proof to support their opinion. (Totally ironic by those who believe the media helped to fake the event, I might add.)

By my definition, what's occurring is wild speculation and definitely not analysis.
 
  • #209
An investigative report immediately released could also be considered proof of CT because everything was prearranged, conspired in advance and no actual investigation took place because the report was but a cover up, a deception.

Either way......

It could be. Depends on what the report says. Depends on what the "theory" is. You can't just say proof of a CT without detailing what the CT is. That implies all CT's are the same. You are implying anything labelled a CT must be phony simply because someone somewhere labelled it a CT.
 
  • #210
An investigative report immediately released could also be considered proof of CT because everything was prearranged, conspired in advance and no actual investigation took place because the report was but a cover up, a deception.

Either way......

I live in Orlando - where the biggest one was until ....

local news was wall to wall without commercial for days

why because info was pouring and oozing and overflowing from the law and FBI. It was a gusher of new information day after say

We have to remember in terms of fatalities this tragedy was allegedly 8 more fatalities.

I went down there like 10 days later - there was still tents and tents and tents of national and international news agencies

Hey who knows maybe that is why this is so absurd.

Our FBI dude was amazing -- he did not stand there stalking our police chief. He had that mike in his hands girl!!!

My deal is in all of them there were briefings with new information like 4x day for 3 days then 3 for 3 etc

Here is what an honest presser looks like IMo!

Notice Gov /Mayer Sheriff Head /Orlando Police head /FBI lead

Congressmen had already been contacted

At this point CIA had been contacted per this presser

jmo I lived it - it may be different . I am gay. It may different. I had been to PUlse. It may different .

But LV is an insult to citizens IMO

moo
[video=youtube;jyFAuNISRkg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyFAuNISRkg[/video]
 
  • #211
It could be. Depends on what the report says. Depends on what the "theory" is. You can't just say proof of a CT without detailing what the CT is. That implies all CT's are the same. You are implying anything labelled a CT must be phony simply because someone somewhere labelled it a CT.

And conspiracies exist. It's not like having the theory there might be one in play is ridiculous. Look at history. People in power often conspire. A government official was charged yesterday with “Conspiracy against the United States." It's not all aliens and fake moon landings.
 
  • #212
They are not talking to 22000 people.!

Pretty sure they got that number from total sales for the three day event

That was not 22,000 people!!

Anyone know the formal name of the place of the concert?? The facility?

here is what 16000 look like

images


https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1...64.psy-ab..0.2.212.6..35i39k1.118.TAKc3AvIs8o

“He had a huge area of three, four or five football fields with people standing shoulder to shoulder,” Alphin said. “He was not aiming at any individual person. He was just throwing bullets in a huge ‘beaten zone.’”

Once the trigger was pulled, simple laws of physics and trigonometry sealed the fate of more than 500 people who would fall wounded in the ensuing fracas — 59 of them fatally.

“He had a huge area of three, four or five football fields with people standing shoulder to shoulder,” Alphin said. “He was not aiming at any individual person. He was just throwing bullets in a huge ‘beaten zone.’”

Beaten zone is an infantry term dating to World War I. Shaped like the area a searchlight casts across a flat surface, it represents the area where bullets can strike, and moves substantially with tiny changes in the tilt of the gun.

If the shooter shifted by about 1 degree, or the width of two fingers held at arm’s length, Alphin said, the beaten zone would fall outside the crowd.

“That’s all the distance you have to move and you aren’t hitting anybody,” Alphin said. “So he had to be pointing or aiming at the very center of mass and then bouncing all over with the recoil.”

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-la...-terror-why-the-las-1507085772-htmlstory.html
 
  • #213
Elliot Rogers (this is only half of the presser)
this is hours after the event

there are differences in the events for sure

listen to the detail these investigators got

yes there are differences I acknowledge




[video=youtube;8yKQIx_GQG4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yKQIx_GQG4[/video]
 
  • #214
“He had a huge area of three, four or five football fields with people standing shoulder to shoulder,” Alphin said. “He was not aiming at any individual person. He was just throwing bullets in a huge ‘beaten zone.’”

Once the trigger was pulled, simple laws of physics and trigonometry sealed the fate of more than 500 people who would fall wounded in the ensuing fracas — 59 of them fatally.

“He had a huge area of three, four or five football fields with people standing shoulder to shoulder,” Alphin said. “He was not aiming at any individual person. He was just throwing bullets in a huge ‘beaten zone.’”

Beaten zone is an infantry term dating to World War I. Shaped like the area a searchlight casts across a flat surface, it represents the area where bullets can strike, and moves substantially with tiny changes in the tilt of the gun.

If the shooter shifted by about 1 degree, or the width of two fingers held at arm’s length, Alphin said, the beaten zone would fall outside the crowd.

“That’s all the distance you have to move and you aren’t hitting anybody,” Alphin said. “So he had to be pointing or aiming at the very center of mass and then bouncing all over with the recoil.”

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-la...-terror-why-the-las-1507085772-htmlstory.html

So he had to be pointing or aiming at the very center of mass and then bouncing all over with the recoil.”

No fence building tree garbage can hit

imo all that means is shooters were not 32 floors higher

snipers standing on a trailer or whatever could certainly shoot and not hit anything above ground. from 32 floors its like rain how can rain not get on things right next to it ??

Not argueing if anyone can explain this I would love to know

moo

All we are disagreeing on is number of shooters and their locations

If anyone can help me understand the cab driver footage I am all ears
 
  • #215
I guess I must be missing the analysis part. What I notice is the final report hasn't been released.

Meanwhile the media who lives by its ratings is anxious for more information. So perhaps not by coincidence, little anonymous tidbits are being released without any supporting information whatsoever. Some people are assuming that information is factual even though it wasn't released by officially named sources and then using it as proof to support their opinion. (Totally ironic by those who believe the media helped to fake the event, I might add.)

By my definition, what's occurring is wild speculation and definitely not analysis.

"What's occurring" where? This is what I am saying. You have to distinguish between the two before you can label this asking questions as "conspiracy theories"

Also, this whole entire thread is speculation. We have posters here who think they have Paddocks entire psychological profile figured out. Yet, I haven't seen any official documents released with regards to that.
 
  • #216
BBM

I thought we had to have citations when stating something as facts? Do you have citations for these statements? As far as I've seen, there hasn't been anything to point to him being a conservative, and gun-loving and country music fan has no credible basis in reality as we know it right now.

:moo:
Lol at the idea a source is needed to determine if he was gun-loving.

But yes, people said he had a gun room and we know how many guns he owned. Is it possible a gun hater would purchase and use so many guns?

Also, several early reports contained opinions from those who knew him that he liked country music.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
  • #217
“He had a huge area of three, four or five football fields with people standing shoulder to shoulder,” Alphin said. “He was not aiming at any individual person. He was just throwing bullets in a huge ‘beaten zone.’”

Once the trigger was pulled, simple laws of physics and trigonometry sealed the fate of more than 500 people who would fall wounded in the ensuing fracas — 59 of them fatally.

“He had a huge area of three, four or five football fields with people standing shoulder to shoulder,” Alphin said. “He was not aiming at any individual person. He was just throwing bullets in a huge ‘beaten zone.’”

Beaten zone is an infantry term dating to World War I. Shaped like the area a searchlight casts across a flat surface, it represents the area where bullets can strike, and moves substantially with tiny changes in the tilt of the gun.

If the shooter shifted by about 1 degree, or the width of two fingers held at arm’s length, Alphin said, the beaten zone would fall outside the crowd.

“That’s all the distance you have to move and you aren’t hitting anybody,” Alphin said. “So he had to be pointing or aiming at the very center of mass and then bouncing all over with the recoil.”

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-la...-terror-why-the-las-1507085772-htmlstory.html

1 degree doesn't leave much wiggle room does it? I am a lay person when it comes to guns and shooting, but it sure sounds to me like one would have to be a trained marksman to pull off such an attack. Where would he practice shooting at such an angle. Where would he find the time between his extensive travel and 14 hrs/day 365 days/ yr playing video poker?
 
  • #218
hi blue !!
 
  • #219
So he had to be pointing or aiming at the very center of mass and then bouncing all over with the recoil.”

No fence building tree garbage can hit

imo all that means is shooters were not 32 floors higher

snipers standing on a trailer or whatever could certainly shoot and not hit anything above ground. from 32 floors its like rain how can rain not get on things right next to it ??

Not argueing if anyone can explain this I would love to know

moo

All we are disagreeing on is number of shooters and their locations

If anyone can help me understand the cab driver footage I am all ears


Agree CARIIS. and I would like to know if someone here could help me understand how LE would go about ruling out multiple shooters so soon?

In a normal everyday shooting with multiple wounded such as a gang related shooting , it seems to me the very first thing LE does is round up witnesses to determine number of alleged shooters and other details. Problem here I n this event is that many of the witness reports were of multiple shooters. So, how did they go about ruling that out? What investigative techniques would they use to do that?
That is a question I expect to see answers to.
 
  • #220
It is not Oct 2027 you silly person it is 2020!

HOwever..............IMO .........

Hey mo has not changed at all in that senior citizen had nothing to do with the shooting , he was involved in arms trading for personal gain or was involved in a sting operation went wrong , that he was killed and became a Patsy.

people got killed , but imo not in this deranged senior citizen nonsense.

I think this is much more like the Batican night in Paris

Def more than one shooter- in a highly organized and skillfully done by snipers that had been highly trained with a perfectly executed escape plan

Might have been Iran COntra affair with violence

OR the folks that the sting was aimed at fould out about it and decided to address it - and while there might as well do some terrorism - hey your in a room with an arsenal and there are a bunch of Americans 1000 feet away in a pen

I believe the snipers were in a far more realistic location like on roofs around the concert area , were removed from the area in a very organized manner via the LVPS helicopter afterwards.

All the calls into dispatch about everything happening elsewhere were made by participants to spread out resources -- and it was effective.

They did not close the airport for a absurd length of time because they had to have the helicopter escape. Amazingly the airport was officially shut down after the helicopter scurried off into the night

Hard drives don't float away into the heavens IMO. Since they are so convinced it was removed after , unless there ghosts the only folks in the room were they guys that busted in.

And amazingly they were not SWAT --they were 4 gentlemen who do not typically engage in SWat activities.- from two different agencies - when is last time anything like ever happen. Never

The story floated by authorities is a horrible screenplay-I have never seen a Sheriff stalked by FBI before either!

hey omo and each is entitled to one!

RE: I just have a difficult time believing it has the power to completely stage a tragedy of this magnitude without the truth being revealed.

We did it in the Pentagon Papers. We did it in the Iran Contra Affair. There were never any WMD in Iran. We did the Manhattan Project Watergate was rife with govt deception, the FBI under Hoover was corrupt as can be -- the NSA lied to the public for decades about what data it was collecting -- a notion that our govt has not engaged in many many activities that were about abuse of power etc etc is not historically accurate imo

[FONT=&amp]The Keating Five were five United States Senators accused of corruption in 1989, igniting a major political scandal as part of the larger Savings and Loan crisis of the late 1980s. Basically they had prevented Charles Keating, Chairman of the Lincoln Savings and Loan Association from being audited in return for receiving campaign funding.

[/FONT]
The election between George Bush and Al Gore was plaqued with issues but it wasn’t until Florida bungled its voting system that the trouble really began. With the world watching the state had to count and recount all its ballots until finally the courts stepped in and chose Bush.


and in the last 24 hours quite possibly the biggest scandal in the country's history might be unfolding right before our eyes

http://list25.com/25-biggest-political-scandals-in-history/5/
Cariis, I agree with some of what you are saying re the swat team that was not a swat team at the same time. Thats worth looking at?
where were the real swat team, is there supposed to be a swat team or two there?
What happened?
Were the Terror squad people called in and at what stage?

they're worthy questions.
Try wrapping your head around the 64 aint ancient thingy..?
Everything else is a theory, great theories and interesting theories but eventually we're gonna have to stop falling down those rabbit holes and deal with what we actually have got.
Until credible facts emerge anything else is a mere side circus.
I discipline my reading material on this...because I need to integrate it as a human being first. A massive human tragedy happening in a free country that I personally care a lot about.
And after that, if it aint peer reviewed and cited by at least a dozen reputable academics.. I aint goin' there.
Its also a huge distraction from the nitty gritty of sleuthing...
We're missing something big about Paddock.. just dont know what it is yet..
 
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