NV - Jessica Valenzuela, 32, dead, 36 injured, car plows into crowd, Las Vegas, 20 Dec 2015 *arrest*

  • #361
Until people stop validating the victim mentality, excuses under the guise of "causation" are going to keep certain areas crime-ridden slums and the people who live in them dependent on the government and the rest of us for their livelihood. Until someone teaches them self discipline and personal responsibility we will forever live with their "victimhood".

If it's about choices, why not teach the poor disenfranchised to get an education instead of skipping school or misbehaving so no one can learn? Why not teach the so-called "marginalized" that the best help they can get is at the end of their arms - their own two hands? You got 'em, use 'em, get an education, get a job. Quit whining and making excuse, and the same goes for those who work with them. Quit making excuses. I learned to sink or swim because someone told me I HAD to, so I did.

How much money has been thrown at the inner-city, poor put upon "marginalized", "disenfranchised" folks, to help them out? How much housing has been built for them that they torn to pieces? There needs to be an end to the excuses and someone needs to let 'em sink or swim on their own. I'm tired of paying their bills and hearing excuses for their bad behavior.

:cow:
They are sinking and not swimming becasue they cant!!

Hey, as a society we are doing the swim and sink - they sink , and go kill people --thats not gonna change until society grasps what mental illiness really is - realize that they do need support and provide it or live the consequences which is what we are doing

and look what is happening lets quit trying to help and more mass shootings, more inncoent lives destroyed , etc etc

hecl its up to us if we are ok to do that and suffer the consequncces we are living or walk around very carefully, armed, with a bullet proof vest etc etc

pay for treatment or pay for cities being closed down , schools closing , flights being diverted , overtime for LE --- billions , billions, changing our lives walking through more metal dectors , having our bags searched --- the trade off for treatment would be a lot cheaper than what we are doing

there are reasons why we have all been very busy here ! and as long as we let em sink or swim lots of us will be killed or hurt

..................there have been very few of these that are only personality disorders --- most are misssed mental illiness spiraling out casue there is no help

that simple -- buy 78 less bombs and put it into mental health

There are a lot of "S" es:
sink,swim,get shot,stabbed,suicide bombers, swiped by cars, suffer.....

CNN there have been 3 Isis attacks since Oct 14. There have been over 50000 related to violence ..........there is data there .............

its up to us
 
  • #362
Here are the typical histories I would get in the chart .when I hear media blabbing about availible help.

This is the typical profile .....

Here is what the history of the family is when I would get them:

so when was dad incarcerated , before she was born

- he used heroin ? Yes?


how often was the power cut off? They shivered, or sweat to death, appromately 6 weeks on and off as far as we can tell the last year

I understand the little child found her mom passed out on the floor - yes twice

who took care of the children while mom was hospitalized no-one it appears they fended for themselves in the dark with no food

I understand her brother was murdered several weeks ago - yes it was a gang drive

Was she bonded with her older brother - very much so

From the documentation I understand moms first boyfriend beat mom regularly - yes

In front of the children yes on three occasions we are aware of - he is incarnated now..

I understand the department that has received several reports , regarding sexual abuse from moms second boy boyfriend

yes - he used crack



I notice here that mom was incarcerated for a two weeks several years ago - yes three weeks for marijuana dealing

- I see here the younger child was placed in foster care two years ago , yes but we found out one fo the foster care parent was beating her so we had to remove her -- we cant find placement for her at this time

I see here that mom did attempt to work at McDonald's and KFC but ended up terminated because she her car did not work , she had to try to bury her child that was murdered , and as result of her car not working , while unemployed had no means to try to get another job Yes

She had 14 court visits related to the department removing the younger sibling from the home , ( but was unable to read the 48 page document the department gave to appeal removal of custody). In addition ,but could not make the court hearings because she had no gas , so the the department had to determine that she was not following her treatment plan and had began removal of custody hearings . to get the rest of the children out of the home - yes we are in that process at the time of the event.

The court ordered parenting classes, substance abuse group therapy, individual therapy, which she was unable to make or participate in because she could not pay the costs of the court ordered " treatment" and her car was broken .

I see here that on unannounced visits by your agency the only thing found in the kitchen was a jar of peanut butter ---yes on two occasions we discovered that was the case mom reported she was unable to drive across town to get her food stamps, and when the power was cut off what she had spoiled

it says here upon visits that the children appeared disfhevled and not bathed - yes the water had been turned off due to lack of payment - mom described on several occasions that her neighbor let her use the hose , but mom did not want to infidge

I see that upon your last visit you observed one of the children has a gum infection, yes, moms car was broken at the time, but she got her aunt to drive her to the free clinic, but after waiting for six hours , and the aunt had to go to work so we had to leave

I see here that mom has one charge for domestic violence - yes when her crack abusing boyfriend started beating her - she struck him , the neighbors called LE and she was charged, but unable to make court appearances - yes mom never showed up

See here that mom got a DUI three years ago , yes, but she was unable to make the court hearings or pay the fines so her license was revoked resulting in her having a hard time trying to get another job at a McDonald's
yes she managed to try to interviews but was not hired because she had been terminated twice in the same year

I see here that a report was file with your agency 8 months ago from a teacher who reported that the child looked extremely exhausted and hungry yes the child was observed placing food in a bag at lunch time. When interviewed the child reported that she was trying to get some food for her mom and her older sibling

I see here that mom was evicted two years ago - yes the complex evicted her after her inability to pay rent

So the department believes that mom and children slept in the car or a public park for several months , yes according to moms reports she did not know what to do

I see here on several occasions LE charged her with loitering yes that occurred on two occasions

I see here that mom was arrested on two occasions for shoplifting - yes she explained that she was trying to get some food for her kids

I notice that her older brother has two juvenile placements before being murdered - yes in one instance he was dealing drugs to try and help his mother the rent - on another occasion he was arrested for burglary - he claimed he wanted to sell what he could get to help mom with the electric bill so his siblings would not shiver at night

I see here that mom had to drop out in 10th grade because because she became pregnant. Yes - does mom know who the childs father might be - unclear at this time - both are incarcarated at this time

this was not an unusual history at all social - in fact pretty much all the time

That ^^ is a 'typical' profile? Of whom? Seems like painting a lot of people with a broad brush to label those types of behaviors as any kind of a typical profile. JMO
 
  • #363
Hi Blue

I was not doing "her" I was responding to media , claiming there is help out there , while having no clue what these families really live

get past it ----oh please .........

Okay, now it makes more sense. I wondered how you knew so much about this case already. Maybe that shows how heartbreakingly common situations like this are.

As sad and desperate as her story might be though, I don't understand why she did what she did or how she got there. People deal with situations like the ones you've mentioned every day and I agree we need to help, especially wrt to mental health and education, but afaik no one has ever responded to personal tragedy and struggles like this before.

Or... do you think this is in any way similar to the woman (Diane Shuler) who drove off the bridge with her kids in the car?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Taconic_State_Parkway_crash
 
  • #364
but ...what does that "look" like ???

Since they are typically told before hand what to say and to not say anything except that.....they hang their head, don't make eye contact, crying or signs of having been crying/in distress. jmo
 
  • #365
Mo on that one is it was medical she had a horrible gum issue going - there was a broken bottle of vodka in the mess 0 blood everywhere so it made sense to me the broken bottle of vodka might have gottne mixed in -- obviously the bottle was not empty. Yeh adults bring a bottle of vodka on vacation. I think the tooth stuff might have resulted in a TIA (I had one it is a unreal experience ) and I kinda did what she did . I tried to keep walking to help but then I started to fall down it was awful, i kept veering off the left of the sidewalk. I tried crawling but my left arm kept failing horrid

I think she just wanteed to get her babies home and kept going

there were no reports of her being an alcohlic, at all,.

Witnesses who say her that morning said she was not intoxicated. Video at the -11 showed a coherent woman

I think she had a mini stoke like I did

trying to go down the stairs in here I did not realize I could not do it -- so I went down on my butt.

it was horrible hospitlzed for four days

ijn
Okay, now it makes more sense. I wondered how you knew so much about this case already. Maybe that shows how heartbreakingly common situations like this are.

As sad and desperate as her story might be though, I don't understand why she did what she did or how she got there. People deal with situations like the ones you've mentioned every day and I agree we need to help, especially wrt to mental health and education, but afaik no one has ever responded to personal tragedy and struggles like this before.

Or... do you think this is in any way similar to the woman (Diane Shuler) who drove off the bridge with her kids in the car?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Taconic_State_Parkway_crash
 
  • #366
Excuses, excuses. A mother of 3 is DEAD, 3 children without a mother and potential grandchildren without a grandmother. There were many others badly hurt and yet there are always those who offer excuses. There is something very wrong when people offer one excuse after another for the evil that inhabits our earth.

:cow:

Great post! ITA
 
  • #367
My feeling is that she MAY have an underlying mental illness (not saying she does) but that's very different from being criminally insane in the eyes of the law. In my opinion she knew right from wrong. She was an angry, hate filled woman who wanted other to be in pain and said so.

I feel the exact same way. She knew what she was doing was wrong. I don't think she "snapped" at all.

Evil.
 
  • #368
Meanwhile, just several hours ago in downtown Toronto, allegedly- a man armed with a hunting knife and a machete, without provocation, hacked at a random stranger with the machete. Witness says he was yelling something about hating white people.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...tre-1-injured-Toronto&p=12257154#post12257154

Machete-wielding man arrested after attack near Eaton Centre; 1 injured, Toronto
 
  • #369
She didn't appear heartbroken to me. She was calm and cool as a cucumber!

Just like when she told the valet to call 911. And being described as "stoic" right after it happened.

No remorse. Evil.
 
  • #370
Excuses, excuses. A mother of 3 is DEAD, 3 children without a mother and potential grandchildren without a grandmother. There were many others badly hurt and yet there are always those who offer excuses. There is something very wrong when people offer one excuse after another for the evil that inhabits our earth.

:cow:

So do you believe that evil just exists and there's nothing we can do about it? With the exception of sociopaths I don't think anyone is born evil. It comes from somewhere. Otherwise there are just people who do bad things and we have no power to change it or help anyone, and it would be pointless to try to reduce crime. Some people are evil, oh well. Lock them up.

What's so wrong with looking at a person who has done something evil and trying to understand where and how it started? Unless you truly believe there are just evil people and how they get there is a big mystery, and recognizing where things might have gone wrong is an excuse.

FWIW I'm not excusing what Holloway did. It was evil and criminal and maybe unforgivable. I don't believe she was destined for this though.

Reason =/= excuse.
JMO
 
  • #371
On the subject of evil, some may find this book interesting, fwiw..
https://books.google.ca/books?id=hrdMD_ZoL8UC&hl=en
content.jpg

In this absorbing and equally inspiring companion volume to his classic trilogy—The Road Less Traveled, Further Along the Road Less Traveled, and The Road Less Traveled and Beyond—Dr. M. Scott Peck brilliantly probes into the essence of human evil.

People who are evil attack others instead of facing their own failures. Peck demonstrates the havoc these people of the lie work in the lives of those around them. He presents, from vivid incidents encountered in his psychiatric practice, examples of evil in everyday life.

This book is by turns disturbing, fascinating, and altogether impossible to put down as it offers a strikingly original approach to the age-old problem of human evil.
 
  • #372
She didn't appear heartbroken to me. She was calm and cool as a cucumber!

And impatient, like this whole thing was interfering with her day.

I can't stoping wondering why she didn't ask about her kid. Even if she knew already. I would be begging and crying.
 
  • #373
Meanwhile, just several hours ago in downtown Toronto, allegedly- a man armed with a hunting knife and a machete, without provocation, hacked at a random stranger with the machete. Witness says he was yelling something about hating white people.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...tre-1-injured-Toronto&p=12257154#post12257154

Machete-wielding man arrested after attack near Eaton Centre; 1 injured, Toronto

I WANT SWEETS! A LOT OF THEM if I am quiet for a couple of minutes it means I am destroying the kitchen !!
 
  • #374
Deadly tornado one dead clarksdale ( i think) misippi
 
  • #375
Meanwhile, just several hours ago in downtown Toronto, allegedly- a man armed with a hunting knife and a machete, without provocation, hacked at a random stranger with the machete. Witness says he was yelling something about hating white people.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...tre-1-injured-Toronto&p=12257154#post12257154

Machete-wielding man arrested after attack near Eaton Centre; 1 injured, Toronto


Dotr my dear your behind !

god

47 minutes ago

Uber driver, 35, assaulted with a machete in Brisbane by a '17-year-old female passenger who tried to steal his car'

teenager



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz3vBvopJF1
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
 
  • #376
From what i'm getting here, I'm hearing that we can't expect any more from this woman &others like her because she had a bad childhood &cannot be expected to rise above it. If that is truly the case, then people in her position should not be allowed to have children, drive cars, own guns, etc, cause they just can't handle it. All there should be for her is govt programs to get her thru life & never expect good results, cause she just ain't capable.
Problem is, I know people who have it rougher, and did rise above it. My own mom had the worse childhood I've ever heard of, yet has never been on public assistance, has been married for 57 years, raised 5 kids, and made us walk the line. And the worse part of her story is that her family hates her for it, even though she done more for them than anyone else on earth.
All that with a 6th grade education, and she's not ashamed of it.
Maybe I should take her to LV & let her preach this girl the kind of serman she preaches to us. She doesn't accept less & I couldn't ask for more.
All my life story, sorry if it offends.
 
  • #377
DA Steve Wolfson just said they have not gotten the blood tests back yet. (Greta)
 
  • #378
  • #379
Sorry, I see sober with absolutely no remorse.
 
  • #380
Clothing designer??????
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
80
Guests online
3,440
Total visitors
3,520

Forum statistics

Threads
632,609
Messages
18,628,951
Members
243,213
Latest member
bleuuu_
Back
Top