NY NY - Alice Parsons: Heiress, Long Island, 1937

I've been looking and will continue to look but so far, I have been unable to find a death certificate/notice for her. I found one that could be her but the death location was listed as Dallas, Texas. She also used the name Anne Parsons and there were/are quite a few Anne Parsons...

The Dallas, Texas entry might be correct, since that is where Roy died and where his widow lives now. I re-read my notes and I believe I may have misread my own scribble. There may well be a question mark after my cryptic shorthand note "Anna dead 1984 - California". Unfortunately when speaking with Allyn Parsons, I grabbed the only writing implement at hand - a pencil. The writing has gotten terribly smudged.

Good luck in your ongoing search, with your determination you're bound to hit pay-dirt soon!:rocker:
 
That's very interesting - I wasn't aware Frank ever remarried.

I haven't found a marriage record but, when he went to California before his death he stated his date and place of birth, the fact that he was travelling to see his son Howard McDonell in Hollywood California, he also listed his wife's name. I've also found census records with them both.
 
Yes, it's kind of hard to figure out just how much more exciting a squab paste recipe could be. Alice and William had been raising squab for a number of years by 1937, and they were actually using Anna's recipe for squab paste.

LE was able to confirm that William got on the train that morning, and I found an almost indecipherable report from LE that I think confirmed he had a meeting with Anna's friends. That report was in the Suffolk County PD records that I viewed a couple of years ago.

The timing of the meeting is very questionable, and I think Anna set it up to get William out of the way. She wanted to make sure no suspicion would ever fall on him, because that would ruin her whole plan.

I don't think William knew ahead of time what Anna had in mind that day, but he found out as soon as he got home. At that point, he had two choices - tell LE what Anna had done, or cover up for her. And we know he didn't tell LE what she did. JMO.
William is often referred to as a "Yale man" but I have not read that he was a graduate of Yale and I have not found any information to sustain that he was. (Other family members clearly were.) William took a few (3-4) business trips as a mature adult in the interests of his family business but he never seems to have joined the business and doesn't appear to have had a position in his families interests. He married Alice. And became a gentleman poultry farmer.

I would need some very strong convincing to believe that he played no part in Alice's disappearance.

jmo
 
I've got totally confused with all the family members now. I don't know how everyone keeps track of them all.

I suppose the information I'd most like to know (apart from where Alice is, of course) is the date William and Anna first met. And also the names and information about the Russians William went to meet, the day Alice disappeared. I can't recall if it's been mentioned now, but I presume William's alibi was thoroughly checked out. Maybe the FBI got to talk to the Russians he met too?

This made me laugh! You have no idea! On both sides of the family, reproduction and longevity is unbelievable! Alice's Grandfather McDonell - was married three times and had thirteen children (maybe more; I may not have found some)! The Williams didn't mess around either!

ETA - William could have met Anna in London in 1925. He was there at the time. Again, I wouldn't be surprised.
 
I have found three family connections (marriages and names) between the two families (Williams and McDonells). They often lived in the same places and had occasion to inter-marry. I haven't found the exact connection yet but "Marcelis Clark" is a common name through both family trees.

SCOOP - Alice's uncle Timothy S Williams and his wife Alice Williams Kelley Williams were related! Timothy's grandfather was Alice's father's brother. I'm not sure where that puts them but they were family before they became family! Alice Williams (not our Alice Williams Parsons but Timothy's wife) was also 17-18 years older than him. It was her second marriage and his first. She had children. He did not.

ETA - Quite the "blended" family for so long ago.
 
Kiran Ravi Parsons may have had/still have a brother. I have found public records that indicate that Roy Kupryanova Parsons and his wife may have had another child named either Roy or Ray. Has anyone else found anything more about this? If so, please share.

Thanks.
 
The Dallas, Texas entry might be correct, since that is where Roy died and where his widow lives now. I re-read my notes and I believe I may have misread my own scribble. There may well be a question mark after my cryptic shorthand note "Anna dead 1984 - California". Unfortunately when speaking with Allyn Parsons, I grabbed the only writing implement at hand - a pencil. The writing has gotten terribly smudged.

Good luck in your ongoing search, with your determination you're bound to hit pay-dirt soon!:rocker:


The listing I've found is as follows:


Name: Anna Parsons
SSN: 🤬🤬🤬
Last Residence: 75229 Dallas, Dallas, Texas, United States of America
Born: 17 Feb 1900
Died: Feb 1982
State (Year) SSN issued: California (1960)

Could your 1984 also be mis-read as 1982?
 
Pink Panther, it's a bit conspiracy theory-ish, but do you think there is any chance Anna contributed her Russian knowledge/skills during the war years, and was allowed to 'stay under the radar' in exchange?

I have thought much the same thing. I have found records on ancestry that her documents were inspected in 1925 through the Czech embassy and I can't understand why. She had tried to enter the year before! Did she try again a year later? If so, I can't find a record for it so she must have done it through a different name.
 
Okay, this info is from my handwritten notes so I need to find the document to back it up, but thought you'd be interested.

In 1923, 260 Russians of the Czar's former aristocracy were ordered deported because the immigration quota was exhausted. When Anna arrived on the Aquitania on 3/11/24, she was ordered deported because the immigration quota was exhausted. This might indicate Anna really was part of Russian aristocracy.

Although Roy's widow, Allyn, told me Anna's father was the overseer of the Czar's land - would that be considered aristocracy??

Marilynilpa - From what I've read, the Czar would mostly only hire people from "noble" families into his court. A few pages back, I posted a link to those noble families. I DO believe that Anna was a member of a "noble" family. I don't think she was making it up - it just didn't mean much of anything in the US apart from getting in or not...

ETA - And she was still convinced that it had meaning when she told it...
 
One last post and then I will call it a night. I have not found a single shred of information about William Parson's mother. NOTHING. NOTHING. NOTHING. She was Laura Wolcott and apart from her being recorded as wife to his father - there is nothing to be found. Another tree lists her as "Laura Woolcote" but even that is a complete dead end. I have found less for her than for Anna K! Any help, suggestions for further research would be much appreciated.
 
I wish I had started a timeline now, it makes it so much easier to look things up and remember them. Do we know if William came home before the trash collectors were refused entry, or afterwards? Even the most trusting person would have their suspicions raised if they came home to find their wife missing and the housekeeper forbidding entry to the basement.

Really, if the way we think this might have played out is correct, how horrific for Roy. Even if he wasn't aware or made to be involved in anything at the time, being questioned by police and just hearing the rumours would be enough to give a child nightmares.

In all the best stories of course, people leave confession notes on their deathbed explaining everything. Doesn't look like it happened here though. All three people who might possibly have known something are dead. Even the Russians William met will be too. Although if they were involved, they might have confided in others. So there is still a tiny chance there is somzwibeleone out there with information.
zwiebel - You still can start a timeline and I would happily contribute as I'm sure many others would! Please do!

: )
 
William Henry Parsons - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

^ Laura Wolcott Collins, I found this link: http://archive.org/stream/historyofclassof00yale/historyofclassof00yale_djvu.txt

BBM - seem William H. the 3rd graduated Yale in 1910.

William Henry Parsons is the son of William Henry
Parsons and Laura C. (Palmer) Parsons. Parsons' father
was born on July 7, 1 831, in Staten Island, New York, was
a manufacturer and merchant in New York during his life,
and died in Palm Beach, Florida, in February, 1905. His
parents were Edward Lamb Parsons and Matilda Clark.
His wife was the daughter of John Palmer of Rye and
Harriet (Barker) Palmer, and was born on March 6, 1832,
and died in February, 1893, at Rye. Parsons' paternal
grandfather came from England and settled at Rye, New
York, and his mother's family was of New England origin.
Our classmate was born on January 31, 1859, in New
York City, but lived his early life in Rye, where he prepared
for college. In college Parsons was fond of sailing and was
the second commodore of the Yale Yacht Club. He was
chairman of the senior promenade committee, a member of
Delta Kappa and Psi Upsilon, and is a graduate member
of Wolf's Head. He roomed with Morris in South Middle
in sophomore year, and in junior and senior years with
Gallaher in Durfee.

Since graduation Parsons has been in the paper business
as manufacturer and exporter. On leaving college he first
traveled over Europe with a number of the class, going as
far as Constantinople and returning via Greece and Italy.
He reached home in December, 1882, and in January, 1883,
went into business with his father's firm, W. H. Parsons &
Company of New York City. At present he is of the firm
of Parsons & Whittemore, at 174 Fulton Street, New York
City. Other trips to Europe were taken in 1875, 1884,
1898, 1900, and 1904. Parsons is a Presbyterian and
has been an officer of the church since 1887. He was
superintendent of a mission Sunday-school in New York
from 1888 to 1906. He has taken considerable interest

in politics at various times, although he has never held
any public office. He is a member of the University, Yale,
Graduates', New York Yacht, Larchmont Yacht, and Nas-
sau County clubs, the Chamber of Commerce, and of a
number of religious and charitable societies. Among his
relatives who were Yale men were his brother, John P.
Parsons, '85, and his cousins, Edward L. Parsons and
Herbert Parsons.

On June 26, 1884, in Rye, New York, Parsons married
Laura Wolcott Collins, daughter of the Rev. Charles Jewett
Collins and Annie (Rankin) Collins. Mrs. Parsons is of
New England ancestry; her father was a graduate of Wil-
liams, her grandfather of Yale. They have had six children:
Annie Rankin, born on August 8, 1885, died October 5,
1886; William Henry 3d, born on May 29, 1888, in New
York City; John Palmer, born on April 16, 1890, in New
York City; Oliver Wolcott, born on September 12, 1892,
in Rye; Laura Cecilia, born on November 6, 1893, in Rye;
and Mary Marselis, born on October 8, 1894, in Rye. Wil-
liam H.
3d was graduated at Yale 19 10, John is in Yale
191 2, and Oliver is at the Sanford School. The daughters
are at school in New York. They have lived in New York
City, except for two or three winters spent in the country.
Their summer home is at Glen Cove, on Long Island Sound.
Our New York dinners have been due to the initiative taken
by Parsons, and as chairman of the reunion committee he
deserves the praise and thanks that were accorded him by
every member present at the twenty-fifth reunion.

His business address is 174 Fulton Street, and his resi-
dence is 324 West End Avenue, New York City.



Eta: oh and this:


575. MRS. WILLIAM H. PARSONS
(Laura Wolcott Collins)

Fifth in descent from Governor Roger Wolcott

from: http://www.archive.org/stream/cu31924030920262/cu31924030920262_djvu.txt

Pedigree was a HUGE deal to these people.. intermarriages were not uncommon, and were probably to do with keeping assets and ties in place within the families, as well as simply that they had their own small social circle limited by class and prestige, and so had fewer options for marriage partners than the general public as it were. Sort of like an American version of the nobility..

They must have had an absolute poo when William married Anna.

eta: google links to Laura's grandpa, also a churchman:

-- clickety click
 
I'd be very interested in whether any of the family wills concerned had provisos regarding children - ie, if Alice had kids, they'd get x amount.. but she never did have any.
 
I'd be very interested in whether any of the family wills concerned had provisos regarding children - ie, if Alice had kids, they'd get x amount.. but she never did have any.

I don't know about all of the family wills, but I know that Colonel Timothy Shaler Williams did not have any provisions like that in his will. Neither did his wife, Alice Williams.
 
Ausgirl - I won't re-quote you whole post above but thank-you so much for resolving this issue! It was driving me nuts. I was "tunnel-vision" hunting on Laura Wolcott and couldn't see the forest through the trees!
 
I was wondering when you'd see that, Pink Panther. I looked in very early this morning, German time, and saw that whole load of information had come up in answer to your question. What a treat!

I'm going to go back to the beginning of the thread to start creating a timeline. I think it might be best to include the main life events in this case, as well as the events on the days Alice disappeared. What do you think?
 
Okay, this info is from my handwritten notes so I need to find the document to back it up, but thought you'd be interested.

In 1923, 260 Russians of the Czar's former aristocracy were ordered deported because the immigration quota was exhausted. When Anna arrived on the Aquitania on 3/11/24, she was ordered deported because the immigration quota was exhausted. This might indicate Anna really was part of Russian aristocracy.

Although Roy's widow, Allyn, told me Anna's father was the overseer of the Czar's land - would that be considered aristocracy??

I think the Russian Royals worked pretty much like the English ones, except in Russia it was on a much larger scale. On the Russian Royal forums, for example, they have a discussion about the hierarchy/numbers of ladies-in-waiting etc various royals were 'allowed' to have. So, for example, the Czarina had 200, and invariably they all possessed some title or other. Same applies to our English Queen too (not 200 though!)

Failing a royal title, retainers would often have a military one, usually high-ranking. I would think the Czar's landholdings would have been substantial and the overseer's job an important one, so Anna's father would have had a military title at least. That would tie in nicely with the Shishkoff we unearthed upthread, who was a major, I think?
 
I was wondering when you'd see that, Pink Panther. I looked in very early this morning, German time, and saw that whole load of information had come up in answer to your question. What a treat!

I'm going to go back to the beginning of the thread to start creating a timeline. I think it might be best to include the main life events in this case, as well as the events on the days Alice disappeared. What do you think?

If you two have any trouble with dates/life events, let me know.

I look forward to seeing the completed timeline.
 
Oh, I will have trouble with the timeline - I always do. I'll do it a bit at a time then post them here for corrections, so the thread doesn't get boring.

I would have posted the first bit tonight, but so far today I have had - a headache from slipping down an icy cliff path; Mr Z is at an hotel with work and has 1) called me to tell me there are gunshots outside his window; 2) called me to tell me he is lost in a blizzard; 3) called me to tell me he has accidentally wandered into an inhabited royal palace and a police car is circling slowly around him.

That's ironic given our recent topic of conversation, but it's all meant I've been a little distracted today.

ETA: gunshots were fireworks and he has reached his hotel safely now!
 

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