NY NY - Irondequoit, WhtFem 14-23, 122UFNY, skeletal in shallow grave, front teeth overlap, Jul'88

[Hannahgmq]

Curious on similarities between doe and Namus 4592, the information lines up, physically matches (the photo is a little blurry but could suggest similar front teeth), under 2 hrs apart in distance, MP went missing when Doe is believed to have died and is not ruled out on Namus. The teeth is really sticking with me, it would be great for more photos of Karen to compare further. I’ve suggested the similarities to the doe network.

 

[Falling Down]

Curious on similarities between doe and Namus 4592, the information lines up, physically matches (the photo is a little blurry but could suggest similar front teeth), under 2 hrs apart in distance, MP went missing when Doe is believed to have died and is not ruled out on Namus. The teeth is really sticking with me, it would be great for more photos of Karen to compare further. I’ve suggested the similarities to the doe network.

I like this possible match. Just two things:

-The houses located by where the remains were found were built in the 1960's. Which may or may not relate with this missing person, I've suggested in the past that organized crime activity may be related to the case.

-The drive is around 6 hours, in 2025. In 1979 it would have been longer, I-390 had not been completed yet, and the U.S. had a 55 mph speed limit. So I'd estimate a 7 hour drive from Burlington County, NJ, to Irondequoit, NY, in 1979.

 

[summergirl1]

Irondequoit Jane Doe 1988 | DNA Doe Project

dnadoeproject.org

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

Finally an update on her FGG journey!

Irondequoit Jane Doe 1988 | DNA Doe Project

dnadoeproject.org

Irondequoit Jane Doe 1988​

Pending Cases

Description:
On July 31, 1988, the skeletal remains of a female were found in Irondequoit, New York. Investigators determined that she was Caucasian and likely between 15-19 years old at the time of her death. The cause of death could not be determined, but the case was ruled a homicide based on the circumstances.

The victim had been buried 2-3 feet below ground surface in a hunched over position. Her remains were discovered by a young boy who stumbled across them while digging in his backyard. The neighbourhood in which she was found had existed for 24 years and was a rhubarb farm prior to the development going up. While it’s estimated that she died 10 to 15 years prior to being discovered, she could have been there for up to 30 years.

NamUs ID:
UP2607

Date Body Found:
July 31, 1988

Race:
White/Caucasian

Sex:
Female

Estimated Age:
15-19

Estimated PMI:
10-30 years

 

[Amy0077]

122UFNY

The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs) UP2607

Unidentified: Town of Irondequoit, Monroe County, NY

Have you seen this child? Jane Irondequoit Doe 1988

Missing From: Irondequoit, NY. Missing Date: July 31, 1988. An unidentified female was found in Irondequoit, New York on July 31, 1988. Her skeletal remains were found buried in a small knoll, located in a residential neighborhood that overlooks Irondequoit Bay in Monroe County. It is estimated...

www.missingkids.org

Reconstructions of the victim; close up of teeth.

Audrey Lynn Nerenberg

104DFNY - Audrey Lyn Nerenberg

just put her name in the doe network search engine- she'll pop right up

The estimated date of death on the unidentified girl is between 1972 and 1978. Audrery vanished in 1977.

<MOD NOTE: Original links broken throughout this thread have been edited to include the current link (when available) and images as of October 9, 2022>

I grew up in that neighborhood.

 

[ziggystarshay]

I'm so happy to see DNA Doe Project take this case on! It's absolutely what is needed to push this Jane Doe into an identification. This case has driven me crazyyyy for so long, I will anxiously be awaiting an update!!

 

[djanga]

According to the Doe Network, she had significant dental restorations using gold foil. I’m just wondering how typical it was for teenagers to have gold-foil restorations at that time? I understand that it was something expensive.

 

[summergirl1]

They've obviously never been able to link her remains to anyone who lived at the property where she was found. Perhaps that means her remains were there before the property was developed. However, construction obviously never found them..

 

[djanga]

Do we know anything about the rhubarb farm which was there before? Could she be a seasonal worker on the farm?

From the DDP website: The neighbourhood in which she was found had existed for 24 years and was a rhubarb farm

 

[summergirl1]

Yeah, it makes you wonder about the rhubarb farm. I looked for info in old newspapers and couldn't seem to find anything new about the land before the land was developed, but then I don't know the name of the farm. Apparently the specific land where she was found had been a peach orchard on the rhubarb farm.

My thought would be maybe someone knew this would be an out of the way place to bury a body. That doesn't mean she had any connection to the rhubarb farm, but maybe the person who buried the body did, or at least knew it might be a good place to bury remains. I am sure everyone still living who was findable in connection to the rhubarb farm was looked at.. but it may have been someone who had ties to it, but not easily found ones after a long passage of time.

 

[phantomstrider]

I think she will be identified soon given the DNA Doe Project taking her case.

 

[SleutherGirl]

I am so excited for DDP to take this case.

 

[beubeubeu]

The medical examiner is the one who estimated her postmortem interval, dying likely in the late 50s. Other than the interval, there's nothing to indicate she couldn't have died EARLIER than the 50s. There's not much to go on, clue-wise. We have the neighborhood, her unique teeth overlap/pattern, the gold foil restoration dental work. Gold foil work began in the late 1800s and was phased out in the 1960s+, at least not taught in dental school beyond then.

I think it's entirely possible, or at least worth being open minded about, that she could have died long prior to the 50s. Gold foil restoration work was very expensive at the time, and again, it's stated that she had extensive work. Then why not also have braces? If you have money? To fix the front overlap and straighten out her teeth. Braces were around in the 20s-40s, more popularized after the 60s, but around nonetheless. But that could also be indicative of her age..I was super young when I had braces (put on at the end of 5th grade and removed middle of 7th grade), but I'd say that's not common. More so mid-later teen years, right? And if they were waiting until that age, then I think she's on the lower end of the age range, 14, 15, maybe 16. This is what I have running through my mind! Never-ending little avenues of thoughts.

Why not also have braces? Not sure how it wad back then but generally all teeth need to be fixed before getting braces. Maybe that work was in progress while she got murdered.

 

[beubeubeu]

Why not also have braces? Not sure how it wad back then but generally all teeth need to be fixed before getting braces. Maybe that work was in progress while she got murdered.

But that kinda indicates that for significant part of her life she suffered poverty, wasnt well taken care of, didnt have access to quality food and/or healthcare - cause otherwise she wouldnt have many cavities even if family couldnt afford braces for her when she was younger.
Also maybe pregnancy? Is it possible to tell if woman was pregnant before just from skeleton? I dont know, but sometimes pregnancy kinda ruins teets - with access to healthcare its mostly possible to keep under control, but without nutrients, dentist teeths are going very bad very fast.

Its not very helpful or insightful Im afraid, just my best guesses. That the reason why she had so many cavities, fillings but no braces was that either:
a) she had rough upbringing and youth, then at some point her situation improved, maybe her parents got good jobs, maybe she started working or got married and got a chance to finally take care of her teeth properly...
b) she had relatively normal upbringing and youth but bad genes when it comes to teeth - and pregnancy, or maybe prolonged sickness + low quality food, possibly not enough food, no dental care for a 2-3 years led to many cavities, then something changed and she was able to afford dental care and was on her way to get braces as soon as all the work would be done.

Use of gold may mean much or may mean nothing.
"Nothing" in a sense that at the time in her area gold was just better looking choice than silver fillings, and as she could afford it she just decided to get the gold ones. Or "much" in a sense that at the time gold fillings werent as common anymore, but held strong in some communities/groups with her being member of one of these, or closely associated with...

Also not sure if Im getting that right, but it seems to me like she was discovered somewhere close to the pin:

Not far from the road I guess, yet far enough for someone to not really be seen if showing up there at night. With location like that her murderer could have next to no ties to the owner of that land then. Probably knowing the area and being acquainted with someone maybe-related to the farm owners or workers would be "enough". Just my guess but if it got sold few years later it may be already not well taken care of at the time of her murder.

All hope really with DNA Doe Project. Great case for them cause how else anything could really be done here? Either miracle or DNA...

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

When Carl Koppelman attended the Tammy Jo Alexander memorial back in 2015 in upstate New York, he went to the location where Irondequoit Jane Doe was found and posted a lot of interesting and useful information (with pictures and maps!) about the neighbourhood in this thread.

Several WS members have lived and grown up in the area and have shared their stories and POV (off the top of my head, @Falling Down and @ziggystarshay -hi! *waves*). I have also found out a few interesting things about the address + the neighbourhood, and its residents that certainly raised my eyebrows.
It is a very intriguing case, and I encourage everyone to read through the thread. I can't wait to learn her name, who she was, and her story.

As always, fingers crossed