NY NY - Sylvia Lwowski, 22, Staten Island, 6 Sept 1975 - #1

[rosemadderlake]

No sisters. There must have been a soon-to-be maid of honor, a bridesmaid or two.

Engagement announcement in paper, marrying on the earlier side of age-range for college-educated female, still living at home...not "moved in" with BF...

Did she usually return home each night to the parents home? Did she have to?

Many of us did not come home every night in those days, and at a much younger age than 22!

bbm - What were their religious backgrounds? Did they pick out a church?

 

[rosemadderlake]

Notice Sylvia Lwowski's birthday will be in a few weeks...April 28.

Let's Go! Let's Go!

Post to the thread enough, and hoping that will inspire an old friend or two to step aboard and join us! Stranger things have happened.

I don't know why, but I am hoping for a girlfriend. A different perspective. That's the way it was back then...in the boroughs. GFs remember things like that: a friend's BD you came-of-age with in the old days, in the old neighborhood even though you may not have heard from them in years...you don't forget. Do you?

bbm: Epiphany! You are on a roll, today!

Yes, I think a close girlfriend would be most insightful, too. What does "BD" stand for?

 

[Jmoose]

bbm: Epiphany! You are on a roll, today!

Yes, I think a close girlfriend would be most insightful, too. What does "BD" stand for?

I think it's birthday-Sylvia's is coming up next month

 

[epiphany]

bbm: Epiphany! You are on a roll, today!

Yes, I think a close girlfriend would be most insightful, too. What does "BD" stand for?

Birthday!

:bdsong:

 

[rosemadderlake]

]Birthday!
[/B]
:bdsong:

Thank you!!!!!!!

 

[epiphany]

bbm - What were their religious backgrounds? Did they pick out a church?

And are both, or one, engaged to marry their "first loves"?

No one seeing anyone else, met anyone else at the time she went missing? First love directly to-the-altar? Perhaps, one wanted out.

 

[Odyssey]

Pertinent to Sylvia's family dynamics, as well as lack of publicity, usually expected info/basic facts available or known about a missing college-educated 22yo in 1975 NYC, etc.:

What was the date of Sylvia's parents' marriage?

I haven't been able to find any info on their marriage. It more than likely occurred in Germany, if Sylvia was born there.

I am just curious if she had additional half-sibings out there somewhere...

 

[rosemadderlake]

And are both, or one, engaged to marry their "first loves"?

No one seeing anyone else, met anyone else at the time she went missing? First love directly to-the-altar? Perhaps, one wanted out.

bbm Great question. They met in high school.

The argument, if she was not speaking to her father and the fiance said something random that set her off, or he stood up for her father as she was talking about it -would she storm off?

-Not sure one would be breaking off an engagement before a movie date unless it was planned? If it was planned, would there be someone else? Maybe she met someone else...

 

[Dushi]

Ok, the argument

They weren't together long before he says she got mad, half hour?
Why do i get the feeling this was ongoing, not a spontaneous disagreement


The other thing.. the ring


If she was mad enough to break their engagement, it would have to be a serious matter between them. not a lovers spat???

Did she give the ring back or throw it at him?


OR

Was he the one that was angry at her?
Did he take the ring ?

If he has the ring, he could justify it by saying they argued etc etc...


Was she the kind of person that flies off the handle quickly or did she have a long fuse

 

[rosemadderlake]

The engagement ring is listed in the case file along with her watch.

I am assuming Sylvia has the ring. Or, her mother thought she would have the ring when filing PR? If Sylvia didn't have the ring, her mother may not know that....

 

[Odyssey]

Here's something I was thinking about and I hope you can all do me a favor so we can get a consensus of different personalities and how they would react.

Please put yourself in the fiance's shoes for a minute. It's the 1970's, you're in your 20's, you're driving and your non-live-in significant other is in the passenger seat. You get into an argument (use your own imagination for what the argument would be about), and your significant other storms out of the car. There are no cell phones, facebook, etc.

What would you do?

I think I would let him go and I'd go home, or somewhere to cool off... and let him cool off as well. I don't think I would go straight to his parents house, since I wouldn't think anything was wrong other than an argument.

If I felt I was in the wrong, I might call him a few hours later to apologize. If I got no answer, I might go to his house to apologize, or I might think he didn't want to talk to me yet and give it more time. I wouldn't get his parents involved in our business.

If I felt HE was in the wrong, I probably would wait at least a day, maybe even longer, thinking he should call me to apologize. If I got a call from his family saying he never came home, however, I would probably get worried and start trying to find him.

I wouldn't think he was missing otherwise.

If I did hear he was missing from his family, even if THEY didn't want publicity, I would - I was the last person to see him, and assuming I wasn't guilty of anything, I would want anyone who saw him walking alone to come forward... and I would feel guilty that the argument happened, would want him to know I loved him, etc... I'd be posting signs and contacting the newspaper, etc.

That's me... maybe other people would have different reactions.

 

[Dushi]

Here's something I was thinking about and I hope you can all do me a favor so we can get a consensus of different personalities and how they would react.

Please put yourself in the fiance's shoes for a minute. It's the 1970's, you're in your 20's, you're driving and your non-live-in significant other is in the passenger seat. You get into an argument (use your own imagination for what the argument would be about), and your significant other storms out of the car. There are no cell phones, facebook, etc.

What would you do?

I think I would let him go and I'd go home, or somewhere to cool off... and let him cool off as well. I don't think I would go straight to his parents house, since I wouldn't think anything was wrong other than an argument.

If I felt I was in the wrong, I might call him a few hours later to apologize. If I got no answer, I might go to his house to apologize, or I might think he didn't want to talk to me yet and give it more time. I wouldn't get his parents involved in our business.

If I felt HE was in the wrong, I probably would wait at least a day, maybe even longer, thinking he should call me to apologize. If I got a call from his family saying he never came home, however, I would probably get worried and start trying to find him.

I wouldn't think he was missing otherwise.

If I did hear he was missing from his family, even if THEY didn't want publicity, I would - I was the last person to see him, and assuming I wasn't guilty of anything, I would want anyone who saw him walking alone to come forward... and I would feel guilty that the argument happened, would want him to know I loved him, etc... I'd be posting signs and contacting the newspaper, etc.

That's me... maybe other people would have different reactions.

Excellent thought provoking post!!

I actually agree with what you said
In my youth, I was very stubborn so i would definitely drive off and leave the fiance behind

My anger doesn't last long, so sooner rather than later i would regret it

I would try to call him at home .... ( would someone answer? possibly a parent)



If he lived at home , and i couldn't reach him by phone, I may go to the door of his parents house to find him

If he was missing, would i worry? Yes, and i would search and do what I could to find him
The guilt and worry would be tremendous for me

 

[Saracen]

bbm Great question. They met in high school.

The argument, if she was not speaking to her father and the fiance said something random that set her off, or he stood up for her father as she was talking about it -would she storm off?

-Not sure one would be breaking off an engagement before a movie date unless it was planned? If it was planned, would there be someone else? Maybe she met someone else...

or maybe he had..

and what about the pregnancy, did she tell him?, did he blow his top?..

 

[epiphany]

or maybe he had..

and what about the pregnancy, did she tell him?, did he blow his top?..

Or IF a pregnancy were true, did she say, to hell with all of them: both her own family & him? Fiance may not have wanted to begin a family, but her parents may not have approved of her being a single-parent either. Hid out at a GFs place, with her possibly valuable engagement ring, and booked out-of-SI shortly after?

Again, who was Sylvia?

 

[rosemadderlake]

or maybe he had..

and what about the pregnancy, did she tell him?, did he blow his top?..

Was she pregnant for a second time? Or was this a speculation? Why would he blow his top about a pregnancy if they were engaged to be married?
-- Unless it might not be his? Oh, this can get really complicated...

 

[Jmoose]

Here's something I was thinking about and I hope you can all do me a favor so we can get a consensus of different personalities and how they would react.

Please put yourself in the fiance's shoes for a minute. It's the 1970's, you're in your 20's, you're driving and your non-live-in significant other is in the passenger seat. You get into an argument (use your own imagination for what the argument would be about), and your significant other storms out of the car. There are no cell phones, facebook, etc.

What would you do?

I think I would let him go and I'd go home, or somewhere to cool off... and let him cool off as well. I don't think I would go straight to his parents house, since I wouldn't think anything was wrong other than an argument.

If I felt I was in the wrong, I might call him a few hours later to apologize. If I got no answer, I might go to his house to apologize, or I might think he didn't want to talk to me yet and give it more time. I wouldn't get his parents involved in our business.

If I felt HE was in the wrong, I probably would wait at least a day, maybe even longer, thinking he should call me to apologize. If I got a call from his family saying he never came home, however, I would probably get worried and start trying to find him.

I wouldn't think he was missing otherwise.

If I did hear he was missing from his family, even if THEY didn't want publicity, I would - I was the last person to see him, and assuming I wasn't guilty of anything, I would want anyone who saw him walking alone to come forward... and I would feel guilty that the argument happened, would want him to know I loved him, etc... I'd be posting signs and contacting the newspaper, etc.

That's me... maybe other people would have different reactions.

Let me turn this around a little-if I were in Sylvia's position, and the man I married was in the fiance's position, he would have driven around, trying to find me for quite a while, at least. I couldn't say that this guy didn't, but there doesn't seem to be any evidence that he contacted anyone other than Sylvia's family. I like to think my husband is exceptional, but I know lots of men who would go looking for their fiancee in this situation.

 

[Jmoose]

:what:

Was she pregnant for a second time? Or was this a speculation? Why would he blow his top about a pregnancy if they were engaged to be married?
-- Unless it might not be his? Oh, this can get really complicated...

I believe a second pregnancy is speculation-Does Gajonka know?

 

[Jmoose]

And it sounds like Sylvia did not have the ring when she left, right? That might be speculation, too.

 

[epiphany]

Let me turn this around a little-if I were in Sylvia's position, and the man I married was in the fiance's position, he would have driven around, trying to find me for quite a while, at least. I couldn't say that this guy didn't, but there doesn't seem to be any evidence that he contacted anyone other than Sylvia's family. I like to think my husband is exceptional, but I know lots of men who would go looking for their fiancee in this situation.

IF, I said IF, I know attorneys, or have access to them...and IF, I said IF, I know NYPD employees, I'm gonna follow what they tell me to do...doesn't matter what I may wish to do, or my heart tells me to do...I'm last to see her and I'm not stupid. Even if I have nothing to do with it. NYPD mid-1970s. I'm gonna be very cautious here.

 

[Dushi]

And it sounds like Sylvia did not have the ring when she left, right? That might be speculation, too.

We have speculated about a second pregnancy and its been said that she did not have the ring