Isn't that interesting?
Not that we'll ever know but I think it would be valuable to know how much time elapsed between Jake being shot and the 911 call being made.
OH OH - Jacob Limberios, 19, Sandusky County, 2 March 2012
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Isn't that interesting?
Not that we'll ever know but I think it would be valuable to know how much time elapsed between Jake being shot and the 911 call being made.
Pocono Sleuther
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I can't find the video where she (BB) says this. Was it the one that appears to have been removed from the site? I def think there's way more to this case.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
ETA. I found it. Holy carp!
Wescott
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On the Facebook Justice page they say it was 6 minutes. I assume they think this as Jacob was apparently talking to his friend on the phone right before the shooting and they know the time the 911 call was made.
Wescott
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It's the Zac Zender & Brittany Bowers Interview. Also on their youtube site:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2w48_Uu-tmk"]Zach Zender & Brittany Bowers interview - YouTube[/ame]
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2w48_Uu-tmk"]Zach Zender & Brittany Bowers interview - YouTube[/ame]
Tulessa
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I'm battling the flu, but just had to post thus FB comment that Brittany posted.
http://www.sanduskyregister.com/article/limberios-shooting-saga/4918041
http://www.sanduskyregister.com/article/limberios-shooting-saga/4918041
wishinuall
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DeWine to announce Grand Jury findings
http://www.sanduskyregister.com/article/limberios-shooting-saga/4942186
http://www.sanduskyregister.com/article/limberios-shooting-saga/4942186
This link has a full transcript of today's press conference:
http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
The thing that jumped out at me first is that it had previously been reported that the bullet entered the left side of Jacob's head. But now they're saying it entered the right side of his head.
:banghead:
http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
The thing that jumped out at me first is that it had previously been reported that the bullet entered the left side of Jacob's head. But now they're saying it entered the right side of his head.
:banghead:
Apparently the GJ found that Jabob did accidentally shoot himself when the gun went off due to a faulty safety mechanism.
http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
ETA: sorry la louve, didn't see you posted same article
I also found it odd that such a big deal was made on the entry wound being from the left, and now it's right? Anyone know if Dr. Wecht testified?
http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
ETA: sorry la louve, didn't see you posted same article
I also found it odd that such a big deal was made on the entry wound being from the left, and now it's right? Anyone know if Dr. Wecht testified?
Coroner says he won't change suicide ruling in Limberios case.
http://www.portclintonnewsherald.co...-suicide-ruling-Limberios-case?nclick_check=1
The parents have filed a civil lawsuit against the coroner.
http://www.portclintonnewsherald.co...-suicide-ruling-Limberios-case?nclick_check=1
The parents have filed a civil lawsuit against the coroner.
IMO no one in Sandusky county government wants to take any ownership for the botched investigation of Jake's death. For the sake of Jacob's daughter Ella, I hope his parents prevail in their civil suit and the coroner is ordered to change the death certificate.
Interesting too, that Coroner Wulkie is an elected official.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/mystery-young-fathers-death-spurs-push-revamp-coroners/story?id=19687764
Interesting too, that Coroner Wulkie is an elected official.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/mystery-young-fathers-death-spurs-push-revamp-coroners/story?id=19687764
And anyway, from what I understood from the articles is that they basically said it was POSSIBLE that Jake could have shot/held the gun himself and it went off. The more I think about it, how would they REALLY know no one else at the party had the gun/fired it at that time because they never investigated that til all this time later? When did they do tests on the gun? Now? Of course it might have shown to misfire 30% of the time or whatever they said but that means nothing if they didn't test it then, right? Who knows what has happened to the gun since the accident? Obviously this is the result of a very poor/nonexistent investigation when it should have been done, but I'm still not 100% sure it was Jacob. And mainly in part because of Dr Phil's lie detector tests. Can someone refresh my memory on exactly what the questions were that they both failed on?
EGirl
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No, the questions weren't if THEY shot him... did he shoot himself and did they witness it.
See, THAT'S why I have such a problem with this grand jury finding. Not that I believe 100% in lie detectors, but why show deception on that if that's what you believe happened? Whether or not if they actually SAW it, if they didn't see someone ELSE do it, (or KNOW of it after the fact I guess) they would have shown to be telling the truth, IMO of course
from http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
"The lack of an initial autopsy shortly after the shooting, including the lack of any toxicology testing;"
Is this saying tox testing was not done in the first autopsy by Wecht (autopsy done at parents' request)? Not done in the second autopsy?
Generally, if an autopsy is done several months after embalming & burial,
would tox testing produce accurate, reliable results on blood alcohol level at time of death?
Would embalming alone preclude reliable tox results?
Would passage of time alone preclude reliable tox results?
Both together?
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
"The lack of an initial autopsy shortly after the shooting, including the lack of any toxicology testing;"
Is this saying tox testing was not done in the first autopsy by Wecht (autopsy done at parents' request)? Not done in the second autopsy?
Generally, if an autopsy is done several months after embalming & burial,
would tox testing produce accurate, reliable results on blood alcohol level at time of death?
Would embalming alone preclude reliable tox results?
Would passage of time alone preclude reliable tox results?
Both together?
from http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
“The lack of sufficient documentation of the first autopsy of Jacob Limberios.
The Limberios family retained forensic expert Dr. Cyril Wecht to conduct this autopsy.
For it to be substantially useful to future investigations, a sufficient number of photographs
would need to have been taken for review by future forensic experts.
Dr. Wecht reportedly did not take photographs.”
“6 BCI investigators, however, interviewed an employee of the funeral home present in the room during the autopsy who reported seeing photographs being taken. If such photographs exist, BCI investigators never received them….”
“Dr. Wecht did take three photos of a bone he removed from Jacob Limberios’ body subsequent to conducting the autopsy.”
BBM SBM
So…
Someone told BCI Wecht took no photos during the autopsy. Who would that be other than Wecht or Wecht’s employeee?
A funeral home employee above said photos were taken during the autopsy.
And Wecht did take three photos after the autopsy. Did BCI have those to review?
Questions:
Did Wecht did not take photos during autopsy?
If not, why not?
Did Wecht take photos during autopsy?
If so, why did he not provide (all of) them to BCI?
Either way -
- if Wecht/employee did not take pix, or
- if Wecht/employee took pix but did not provide them to BCI (even if they were subject to attorney-client privilege
because parents’ atty arranged for Wecht to conduct autopsy)
IMO, it seems if pix somehow indicated the death was an accident, whether by Jake or byother kids,
they would have provided to BCI, if they had the pix,
IMO, if pix were not taken, seems to deviate autopsy SOP.
IMO, it seems detrimental to the parents’ position that he never would have committed suicide.
JM2cts and I could be wrong.:seeya:
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
“The lack of sufficient documentation of the first autopsy of Jacob Limberios.
The Limberios family retained forensic expert Dr. Cyril Wecht to conduct this autopsy.
For it to be substantially useful to future investigations, a sufficient number of photographs
would need to have been taken for review by future forensic experts.
Dr. Wecht reportedly did not take photographs.”
“6 BCI investigators, however, interviewed an employee of the funeral home present in the room during the autopsy who reported seeing photographs being taken. If such photographs exist, BCI investigators never received them….”
“Dr. Wecht did take three photos of a bone he removed from Jacob Limberios’ body subsequent to conducting the autopsy.”
BBM SBM
So…
Someone told BCI Wecht took no photos during the autopsy. Who would that be other than Wecht or Wecht’s employeee?
A funeral home employee above said photos were taken during the autopsy.
And Wecht did take three photos after the autopsy. Did BCI have those to review?
Questions:
Did Wecht did not take photos during autopsy?
If not, why not?
Did Wecht take photos during autopsy?
If so, why did he not provide (all of) them to BCI?
Either way -
- if Wecht/employee did not take pix, or
- if Wecht/employee took pix but did not provide them to BCI (even if they were subject to attorney-client privilege
because parents’ atty arranged for Wecht to conduct autopsy)
IMO, it seems if pix somehow indicated the death was an accident, whether by Jake or byother kids,
they would have provided to BCI, if they had the pix,
IMO, if pix were not taken, seems to deviate autopsy SOP.
IMO, it seems detrimental to the parents’ position that he never would have committed suicide.
JM2cts and I could be wrong.:seeya:
from http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
“Jake’s parents indicated that he had a history of some psychological issues and was under the care of a psychiatrist,
having been prescribed medication for depression and sleeping difficulties.
He was also reportedly prescribed another medication -- a prescription which he would not fill or take.
It is unknown what this medication was, or its purpose."
"Despite multiple requests, BCI investigators have not received the medical records from Jake’s psychiatrist.”
Does anyone know if psychiatrist could have been ordered to provide records?
- To parents in their lawsuit against coroner to change manner of death from suicide?
If, in the course of parents' lawsuit, they were able to subpoena the psychiatrist’s records and did not and
then did not provide them to BCI, imo, it seems detrimental to the parents’ position contending that he never would have committed suicide.
JM2cts and I could be wrong. :seeya:
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
“Jake’s parents indicated that he had a history of some psychological issues and was under the care of a psychiatrist,
having been prescribed medication for depression and sleeping difficulties.
He was also reportedly prescribed another medication -- a prescription which he would not fill or take.
It is unknown what this medication was, or its purpose."
"Despite multiple requests, BCI investigators have not received the medical records from Jake’s psychiatrist.”
Does anyone know if psychiatrist could have been ordered to provide records?
- To parents in their lawsuit against coroner to change manner of death from suicide?
If, in the course of parents' lawsuit, they were able to subpoena the psychiatrist’s records and did not and
then did not provide them to BCI, imo, it seems detrimental to the parents’ position contending that he never would have committed suicide.
JM2cts and I could be wrong. :seeya:
I stand partially corrected. I just watched the Dr. Phil video again and the questions were:
Did Jake shoot himself?
and
Did Jake shoot himself in the head?
(no questions about did they witness it)
http://www.drphil.com/shows/show/2114/
from http://www.norwalkreflector.com/article/3814751
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
Before the party began, Evan, William, and Brittany first gathered at Teris Tavern in Bay View, OH. They then traveled in a van that William drove to Brittanys residence before leaving to pick up Jake from his home. Jake entered the van, carrying an open and partially full case of Bud Light bottles. The four then traveled to Castalia Market, Evan remained in the van, while the other three went into the convenience store, where William purchased vodka, Bloody Mary mix, cigarettes, Combos snacks, and another case of Bud Light bottles. From there, the four traveled to Brittanys residence, where they began to drink their alcohol. BBM SBM
4 This evidence included the following: a Bud Light box labeled On Floor, containing 17 empty bottles and four full bottles; a Bud Light box labeled In Fridge, containing 20 full bottles. BBM
How much was consumed collectively by all four?
So 17 empties in one case on floor? Maybe includes as part of those, the 4 empties which would have come from in fridge case that still had 20 fulls. Perhaps some of those empties were consumed by others before the party? Maybe some of the empties they consumed that night were not placed in the cases (placed in big garbage can in the garage)?
I missed any ref to the amount of vodka purchased or consumed.
Forgot where I read or heard someone say that 19 y/o Jake did not drink alcohol that night.
Puzzling that he would bring to the party a partial case of beer and not drink at all,
esp. in that apparently he would not drive himself home.
Questions
Did Jake drink that night at the party? Before the party? Both?
Did Jake not drink at the party or before?
If he drank -
- say 1-2 beers, he may not have been impaired.
- say 3 or 3+ beers, his senses may have been dulled, so that -
- he was not cognitively alert re safe firearms handling SOP (letting ppl drinking handle his gun w ammo in it, etc).
- his hands, esp fingertips, were not sensitive about how he was handling gun.
- his impulse control not to hurt himself may have been impaired.
If he did not drink,
- why does it seem he ignored safe firearms handling SOP (letting ppl drinking handle his gun w. ammo in it, etc).
Who sits in a house, in the same room, w 3 ppl who have been drinking and lets them pass around his gun w ammo in it?
Esp. when that person has never met 2 of the 3 others?
JM2cts and I could be wrong. :seeya:
transcript of Ohio AG's report at 11/20 presser, describing some limitations the BCI & AG investigation faced =
Before the party began, Evan, William, and Brittany first gathered at Teris Tavern in Bay View, OH. They then traveled in a van that William drove to Brittanys residence before leaving to pick up Jake from his home. Jake entered the van, carrying an open and partially full case of Bud Light bottles. The four then traveled to Castalia Market, Evan remained in the van, while the other three went into the convenience store, where William purchased vodka, Bloody Mary mix, cigarettes, Combos snacks, and another case of Bud Light bottles. From there, the four traveled to Brittanys residence, where they began to drink their alcohol. BBM SBM
4 This evidence included the following: a Bud Light box labeled On Floor, containing 17 empty bottles and four full bottles; a Bud Light box labeled In Fridge, containing 20 full bottles. BBM
How much was consumed collectively by all four?
So 17 empties in one case on floor? Maybe includes as part of those, the 4 empties which would have come from in fridge case that still had 20 fulls. Perhaps some of those empties were consumed by others before the party? Maybe some of the empties they consumed that night were not placed in the cases (placed in big garbage can in the garage)?
I missed any ref to the amount of vodka purchased or consumed.
Forgot where I read or heard someone say that 19 y/o Jake did not drink alcohol that night.
Puzzling that he would bring to the party a partial case of beer and not drink at all,
esp. in that apparently he would not drive himself home.
Questions
Did Jake drink that night at the party? Before the party? Both?
Did Jake not drink at the party or before?
If he drank -
- say 1-2 beers, he may not have been impaired.
- say 3 or 3+ beers, his senses may have been dulled, so that -
- he was not cognitively alert re safe firearms handling SOP (letting ppl drinking handle his gun w ammo in it, etc).
- his hands, esp fingertips, were not sensitive about how he was handling gun.
- his impulse control not to hurt himself may have been impaired.
If he did not drink,
- why does it seem he ignored safe firearms handling SOP (letting ppl drinking handle his gun w. ammo in it, etc).
Who sits in a house, in the same room, w 3 ppl who have been drinking and lets them pass around his gun w ammo in it?
Esp. when that person has never met 2 of the 3 others?
JM2cts and I could be wrong. :seeya:
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