OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #51

[IType]

I'm again very surprised that there's no DNA Evidence/Discovery in GWIV's case.

In my honest opinion: It is very interesting that he is the only one with a motion for (which as of today was recinded by Defense) and admission by Prosecution that there is none specific to him.

Any thoughts? I wasn't on Websleuths in March when this was first brought up.

I am intrigued with this as well.

 

[IType]

Quoted from Betty's post 194 above (BBM): "Special Prosecuting Attorney Angela Canepa agreed that two terabytes of information would take months to comb through and said the state has agreed to provide a focus of the evidence to the defense to help them narrow down what they need to analyze before the trial."

I also find this interesting. This has only come up with GW4 and his defense team, but none of the other defendants, up to this point that I can recall.

If there is no DNA evidence against GW4 and only a certain portion of the submitted evidence applies to him, does that mean he played a lesser role in planning and carrying out the murders? Just thinking out loud here--I realize that if he participated in any fashion, no matter how great or small, he is still guilty of the murder and conspiracy charges. JMO

Maybe I am reading too much into it. Still just trying to figure out what role he might have played in all of this. Unfortunately, I am sure those answers will be a long time yet in coming, JMO.

 

[Betty P]

Quoted from Betty's post 194 above (BBM): "Special Prosecuting Attorney Angela Canepa agreed that two terabytes of information would take months to comb through and said the state has agreed to provide a focus of the evidence to the defense to help them narrow down what they need to analyze before the trial."

I also find this interesting. This has only come up with GW4 and his defense team, but none of the other defendants, up to this point that I can recall.

If there is no DNA evidence against GW4 and only a certain portion of the submitted evidence applies to him, does that mean he played a lesser role in planning and carrying out the murders? Just thinking out loud here--I realize that if he participated in any fashion, no matter how great or small, he is still guilty of the murder and conspiracy charges. JMO

Maybe I am reading too much into it. Still just trying to figure out what role he might have played in all of this. Unfortunately, I am sure those answers will be a long time yet in coming, JMO.

Yep. We'll find out eventually.

As for Canepa's agreement to provide a focus of evidence to the defense, I got the impression she meant for all the defense teams. GW4's attorney pointed out on their last discovery dump of 2 terabytes that it would take them 2 months to go through that amount. ICBW.

ETA: I just went back to review her remarks, but the video at the Facebook link has been shortened, so I didn't hear them. Will look elsewhere later for a full video. I'm going to think some more about what the lack of DNA evidence for GW4 means and why his defense brought it up. There are a number of ways to speculate on what it means. Could it have something to do with the home made silencer? DNA on weapons? On ammo? DNA left at one of the crime scenes?

It was also interesting to hear AC argue against the defense motion to not admit any of the defendant's unsworn statements. I'm assuming this applies to the alleged recordings of GW4 discussing plans to break out of jail if they're caught and to seek retribution against LE and the AG. AC argued the USSC allows them to use those statements at trial as long as they tell jurors they're not sworn statements and they don't contradict other evidence.

JMO

 

[IType]

Yep. We'll find out eventually.

As for Canepa's agreement to provide a focus of evidence to the defense, I got the impression she meant for all the defense teams. GW4's attorney pointed out on their last discovery dump of 2 terabytes that it would take them 2 months to go through that amount. ICBW.

Makes sense. Thanks

 

[Sleuthinsleuther]

I'm again very surprised that there's no DNA Evidence/Discovery in GWIV's case.

In my honest opinion: It is very interesting that he is the only one with a motion for (which as of today was recinded by Defense) and admission by Prosecution that there is none specific to him.

Any thoughts? I wasn't on Websleuths in March when this was first brought up.

I think he will walk because of this. Although he will probably be charged with aiding and abetting

 

[Betty P]

I think he will walk because of this. Although he will probably be charged with aiding and abetting

Sorry, I respectfully disagree. There is plenty more evidence against him and his family, including video, audio recordings, texts, emails, etc. Weapons, ballistics, all kinds of evidence.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

GW4, IMO took care of the kids while BW, JW & AW commitment murder, JMO GW is the one that did the hacking of spy ware?

 

[Loomis124]

I think he will walk because of this. Although he will probably be charged with aiding and abetting

Respectfully disagree. He will not walk.
JMO

‘Great deal of’ evidence pushes back trial date for oldest Wagner brother

 

[Loomis124]

GW4, IMO took care of the kids while BW, JW & AW commitment murder, JMO GW is the one that did the hacking of spy ware?

Do you really think just because the State will not be entering DNA evidence against him all of a sudden makes him innocent of the 8 counts of aggravated murder and all the other charges? There is plenty evidence. JMO

‘Great deal of’ evidence pushes back trial date for oldest Wagner brother

 

[Loomis124]

I am intrigued with this as well.

I'm not so sure there "isn't any." I am sure AC has said numerous times, "the State will not be presenting any DNA in his case. I could say more, but rather not. All JMO

 

[Puzzles8]

The court hearings this week have been interesting. It appears FW and RW only came to support Billy at his court date this week and none of the others. Might the evidence of AW’s phone calls to RN and JW be the reason?

I speculate IV didn’t participate “directly” in the murders, as in pulling a trigger at point blank range to assassinate innocent people. He probably had more of a support role in planning and helping carry out the massacres – stalking beforehand, purchasing supplies, making silencers, taking down trail cams, stealing security footage, keeping the dogs happy, cleaning up any potential evidence, destroying evidence, heck maybe even taking care of the children as JBB has suggested.

My opinion only:

IV was the most vocal in the “revenge conversations”. I think the W4 assumed only Billy, AW & Jake would be arrested. That would leave IV free to carry out the “jailbreak” and revenge on LE. IV never thought through the fact that he might also be arrested and charged with the rest via conspiracy charges.

He was the only one that requested bail.

He thought he “knew” his DNA would not be at the crime scenes. That doesn’t matter if you are being charged as part of a conspiracy.

I really don't think he will walk away from this.
Now if he confesses and testifies against the others that could be a different story....

JMO, MOO, etc.

 

[Loomis124]

The court hearings this week have been interesting. It appears FW and RW only came to support Billy at his court date this week and none of the others. Might the evidence of AW’s phone calls to RN and JW be the reason?

I speculate IV didn’t participate “directly” in the murders, as in pulling a trigger at point blank range to assassinate innocent people. He probably had more of a support role in planning and helping carry out the massacres – stalking beforehand, purchasing supplies, making silencers, taking down trail cams, stealing security footage, keeping the dogs happy, cleaning up any potential evidence, destroying evidence, heck maybe even taking care of the children as JBB has suggested.

My opinion only:

IV was the most vocal in the “revenge conversations”. I think the W4 assumed only Billy, AW & Jake would be arrested. That would leave IV free to carry out the “jailbreak” and revenge on LE. IV never thought through the fact that he might be arrested and charged with the rest via conspiracy charges.

He was the only one that requested bail.

He thought he “knew” his DNA would not be at the crime scenes. That doesn’t matter if you are being charged as part of a conspiracy.

I really don't think he will walk away from this.
Now if he confesses and testifies against the others that could be a different story....

JMO, MOO, etc.

IMO, no one will confess a thing in any of these cases. They know better. Perhaps the reason AW was trying to convince RN to stay quiet. FW will stop at nothing to free her son. And money kills. JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

Why does everyone think GW4 is not as complicit?

involved with others in an illegal activity or wrongdoing.
"all of these people are complicit in some criminal conspiracy"

 

[Puzzles8]

Why does everyone think GW4 is not as complicit?

involved with others in an illegal activity or wrongdoing.
"all of these people are complicit in some criminal conspiracy"

He didn't have a dog in the fight.

 

[Cool Cats]

He didn't have a dog in the fight.

Just because he's the uncle not the dad or grandparent? This is an enmeshed family.

 

[Cool Cats]

Rhoden case sees four pre-trial hearings in one week - Portsmouth Daily Times

 

[StrangeOne]

The prisoners are allowed to research their case and certain things, of course it’s a controlled internet but we where talking about Angela trying to get message to her family (Right)?

Do you think law enforcement aren't watching these closely? It's possible they can be given the impression they aren't just to see what AW has to say.

 

[StrangeOne]

Just because he's the uncle not the dad or grandparent? This is an enmeshed family.

Well said. In the very beginning I tried hard to explain to people how family life is constructed in Appalachia. Family is family no matter the distance. We think no less of a 4th cousin than we would a 1st and so on. The loss of each of the Rhoden victims was/is felt heavily by them all. I believe it's the reason they killed KR to begin with because he would have been a threat to the Ws. They couldn't leave him alive. It's also why I think they had to kill the Rs. They thought they were losing SW with HR moving on in her life. Instead of being a normal family and fighting for rights in court they took extra steps and killed the threats to the "family".

 

[Cool Cats]

Well said. In the very beginning I tried hard to explain to people how family life is constructed in Appalachia. Family is family no matter the distance. We think no less of a 4th cousin than we would a 1st and so on. The loss of each of the Rhoden victims was/is felt heavily by them all. I believe it's the reason they killed KR to begin with because he would have been a threat to the Ws. They couldn't leave him alive. It's also why I think they had to kill the Rs. They thought they were losing SW with HR moving on in her life. Instead of being a normal family and fighting for rights in court they took extra steps and killed the threats to the "family".

I always wondered if part of the problem was that Jake could not actually fight for parental rights in court, like fight for joint custody with full parental rights to make major decisions. Hanna was the one who could make all the decisions, even cut down the visitation if she wanted.

Not being able to fight in court because of him having had relations with her when he was 20 and she was 15, according to the indictment. Now if she had married him no charges could be brought against him. Then if divorced, he could fight in court.

It doesn't make sense that he didn't go to court for joint legal custody unless he was afraid of getting charged.

Perhaps this is one reason the Wagner's became so enraged when she refused to marry him. Married, he would have been in the best legal position, unmarried, Hannah had all the rights as a single mom.

Just one theory....

 

[Johnny B Bad]

I always wondered if part of the problem was that Jake could not actually fight for parental rights in court, like fight for joint custody with full parental rights to make major decisions. Hanna was the one who could make all the decisions, even cut down the visitation if she wanted.

Not being able to fight in court because of him having had relations with her when he was 20 and she was 15, according to the indictment. Now if she had married him no charges could be brought against him. Then if divorced, he could fight in court.

It doesn't make sense that he didn't go to court for joint legal custody unless he was afraid of getting charged.

Perhaps this is one reason the Wagner's became so enraged when she refused to marry him. Married, he would have been in the best legal position, unmarried, Hannah had all the rights as a single mom.

Just one theory....

JMO but looking at the photos of Jake back in 2016, Jake looked like a drug addicted and I really think that was another factor why the Wagners didn’t take the Rhodens to court