OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #80

[ohioexpat63]

Nah. This is just the typical drama that this defense team tries to stir up.

They don't have any evidence to exonerate GW4, so they use drama, smoke and mirrors.

It is all smoke and mirrors, as well as, red herrings. Look here but dont look at all the evidence. Ill trust the jury vs an opinion being posted on twitter or anywhere else.

There are drastically differing opinions on if jake was laughing and belching during his testimony. People have jumped all over someone else's opinion, as though personal biases doesnt fit into the equation. We hear, read and process information differently. Jmo. To each their own I guess. Jmo

 

[ohioexpat63]

Oh, wow! Did someone here accuse AC of "prosecutorial misconduct"? If so, that's an outrageous thing to say. Not surprising for this defense team, though. They're desperate.

Just inferences!

 

[sunshineray]

When did the prosecution learn about it? Is this information something they sat on and kept from George's defense? The fact that Jake confessed to killing all 8 people almost 2 years ago? Could this be exculpatory evidence the prosecution kept from George's attorneys?

JMO

I think JW's lawyers knowing and not saying seems more logical a scenario. Even JW lawyers knowing and tell the GWIV's defense about it before JW's plea sounds more likely to me.

For the prosecution to have known before JW's plea and not explore it during direct examination seems very unlikely to me since the prosecution, the direct of many witnesses has brought to light unflattering and borderline-deceptive behavior from witnesses themselves. (mostly about the victims)

I remember thinking numerous times, ok good they brought that up instead of the defense so the jury will realize they're getting the full unflattering at times story.

I just don't see the prosecution hiding these facts, that it would be logical, especially given the all for one, one for all close knit W family relationships they started on out of the box describing. The prosecution would have acknowledged JW wanted to save his co-conspirators and say it was all me, I went alone that night. Then he decided to tell the truth. He was in prison quite the long while, waiting on his trial, until he finally confessed...not unusual

Abuse of the client privilege right (if that is legally what it was) seems much more likely a scenario to me. AJMO

 

[sunshineray]

No. These appear to be the results of these recent stunts pulled by Nash and Parker. Judge Deering will be keeping the trial on track. I’m wondering, though, how much longer it will be before they get into some trouble.

Is it possible they have some scheme going with Jake‘s attorneys to render his testimony usesless by convincing him to change his story? Is Jake dumb enough to fall for such a scheme?

Sounds like the Judge is calling them on the carpet to see if they’re up to something, JMO

I sure hope it's JW's lawyers that are the guilty party, if in fact what ever JW said to them was something by law they had to tell the defense, and not something the prosecution knew and didn't reveal. I would think not. It seems such a logical and human thing for a criminal to do. Lie at first to protect his cohorts who are family. I sure it's happened before. AJMO

 

[Nanasteele]

WOW, just wow.

JMO

No. These appear to be the results of these recent stunts pulled by Nash and Parker. Judge Deering will be keeping the trial on track. I’m wondering, though, how much longer it will be before they get into some trouble.

Is it possible they have some scheme going with Jake‘s attorneys to render his testimony usesless by convincing him to change his story? Is Jake dumb enough to fall for such a scheme?

Sounds like the Judge is calling them on the carpet to see if they’re up to something, JMO

This is all crazy! GW4 is just as guilty if he did pull the trigger! He was there, in meeting, helped gather supplies and kept the secret! I mean he stood on watch at CRJ bedroom and you know he had a gun! They all four are guilty and Angela should be in jail for life!

 

[Ann99]

Jake Wagner expected to return to the stand Friday in brother's murder trial

George Wagner IV's murder trial in Pike County is expected to resume Friday morning.

www.wlwt.com

 

[arielilane]

I was in the courtroom when AC asked JW about the Boondocks Clip. His answer was he didnt remember the clip that she was referring to. She showed the clip from a google search that the prosecutors googled. He didnt laugh. In fact he said that the clip that they showed wasn’t the exact clip he watched. He laughed after the state asked him if he could say what guns where in the clip. He smiled and said yes gold plated 1911s.. but he only smiled because he knew the answer. Other times in his testimony he actually asked the state if his answer was right.

Welcome to WS!

 

[pcrum12]

does anyone know if court has started or not - or if it has and we just get lady justice today lol

 

[sunshineray]

I think it is a bunch of hoopla, until it becomes something. We will know soon enough. As we saw with the witnesses opting in and out and all the dramatic opinions that followed, it turned out to be a nothing burger. Jmo

I sure hope so...I don't know in the scheme of things what is actually required of all these lawyers when an accused changes original statements to say I didn't tell you the full truth, here's the truth now...the actual way it all happened. JW already being caught, in what look like outright falsehoods in his testimony, makes me leary of what might have actually been held back from prosecution by his attorneys. Just my questioning of the situation with this subpoena of JW's lawyers

 

[arielilane]

does anyone know if court has started or not - or if it has and we just get lady justice today lol

The elegant Lady Justice for now.

 

[sunshineray]

I think the prosecution will object. They have not rested their case. How can the defense call JW’s attorneys to testify today when it’s not their turn. IMO

It wouldn't be in front of the jury, I would think. It would be a hearing to see if any lawyers broke the law in not reporting that JW originally said it was all him, that his family members weren't involved. This can't be the first accused who's done that, IMO

 

[sunshineray]

Nah. This is just the typical drama that this defense team tries to stir up.

They don't have any evidence to exonerate GW4, so they use drama, smoke and mirrors.

If JW's lawyers didn't say it happened or they told the prosecution in plea talks and the prosecution didn't disclose it...is that against the law?

 

[arielilane]

https://twitter.com/CFranciscoWCPO

Pike Co. massacre trial will begin soon for day two of defense cross examining Jake Wagner.

Since he has opted out of allowing us to record him… I will be stuck in the courtroom, and I will have to bring you the latest on Twitter during breaks.

 

[joe jones]

If JW shared with a third-party information, he also shared with his attorneys it could be argued he has waived attorney client privilege, if it is a very specific thing, he has told another person. I doubt the judge though will allow any challenge to attorney client privilege it is sacrosanct as it should be.

 

[arielilane]

https://twitter.com/jamespilcher

The prosecution in the Wagner trial has at least a week or two left for its case, meaning the trial may extend into mid-November, after initial estimates of 6-8 weeks for the most complex and expensive murder trial in Ohio history.

 

[sunshineray]

It is all smoke and mirrors, as well as, red herrings. Look here but dont look at all the evidence. Ill trust the jury vs an opinion being posted on twitter or anywhere else.

There are drastically differing opinions on if jake was laughing and belching during his testimony. People have jumped all over someone else's opinion, as though personal biases doesnt fit into the equation. We hear, read and process information differently. Jmo. To each their own I guess. Jmo

I'm more worried about the subpoena for JW's lawyers than JW misstating some minor things from his proffer.

 

[sunshineray]

If JW shared with a third-party information, he also shared with his attorneys it could be argued he has waived attorney client privilege, if it is a very specific thing, he has told another person. I doubt the judge though will allow any challenge to attorney client privilege it is sacrosanct as it should be.

Fingers crossed

 

[rsd1200]

There are only a few things that can break attorney client privilege.
All of the below is merely speculation, guesswork, and research due to an inability to sleep, on my part:


GW4's Lawyer's Subpoena JW's Lawyer's, Info


WAVERLY, Ohio (WXIX) - George Wagner IV’s attorney has subpoenaed Jake Wagner’s attorney’s notes, according to a copy of the subpoena.

It orders Jake Wagner’s attorney to appear at 9 a.m. Friday before Pike County Common Pleas Court Judge Randy Deering and “Please bring your file and interview notes of Edward (Jake) Wagner concerning the involvement of him and his co-defendants in the homicides” in the case against Jake Wagner.

Pike County massacre: Complete trial coverage

Reached for comment on the phone, Gregory Myers of Columbus declined to comment.

We also reached out to George Wagner’s lawyer, Richard Nash of Chillicothe, but we have not heard back.

We will update this story once we do.
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Lawyers have attorney-client privileges to keep such information such as notes private, so it’s not clear why Nash is requesting such records.

The subpoena between the brothers’ lawyers comes as Jake Wagner faced his brother in court all week, testifying against him in a murder trial approaching the two month mark.

The trial is taking the day off Thursday due to a scheduling conflict with the judge.

It is set to resume a 9 a.m. Friday.

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After RJN's confession that she'd lied in Dec 2019;
"Wagner said he took his grandmother’s words to heart and viewed them as “an answer from God.” He testified that he had been praying about what to do and had lied to his lawyers about committing the murders. A short time later, he said that he confessed to his lawyers and detailed his mother, father and brother’s involvement in the conspiracy but did not plan to cooperate and wanted to go to trial. He didn’t plan to testify at his trial because he would have to lie."

Ethical Obligations of a Lawyer When His Client Has Committed or Intends to Commit Perjury
What are a lawyer’s ethical obligations when his client reveals his intent to commit perjury? What are a lawyer’s ethical obligations when a lawyer learns that a client has committed perjury? 1) Persuade them not to do so. 2) Request to be removed as their attorney.
More at link below
Ethical Obligations of a Lawyer When His Client Has Committed or Intends to Commit Perjury
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The attorney-client privilege protects most communications between clients and their lawyers. But, according to the crime-fraud exception to the privilege, a client's communication to her attorney isn't privileged if she made it with the intention of committing or covering up a crime or fraud. --more at link below--
Not all attorney-client communications are privileged.

 

[Dudly]

But if George has told his attorneys the truth, why does George's story keep changing?

I'll admit I do not understand how proffers work in terms of a witness at trial.

So here is as much as I understand. Jake's Proffer was about 12 hours long.
Does the prosecution just say to him - tell us the story of what happened and just keep taping until he stops talking?
Can they ask him to respond to certain questions? During the recording of the proffer can they confront him with evidence so that he has the opportunity to change his story/proffer?

I'd appreciate anyone with legal expertiece weighing in, so that we all better understand the legal process of a proffer.

Thanks, JMO

One thing about testimony varying some. That is a sign it was not rehearsed and memorized. How much variation is allowed before it is considered unreliable???

 

[joe jones]

I am hoping that one of the reporters who has followed the case from day 1 writes a book, not just about the trial but a wide-ranging book about the area the crimes happened in, the families, the murders, post the murders and the trials, (not asking for much). Some of the profits could go to the surviving children.

I also hope FR provides for the surviving children, SW and BVW are her great grandchildren, KR is SW sister, BR father was killed by her Grandson, RR is an orphan due to her grandson killing both his parents, she has so much money that it would be helpful to whoever is raising the children, I also hope she provides money for their education when they are older post high school.

It would be a way to break the cycle of children having children and hopefully give them choices in life that their parents didn't have. I only know for sure where BVW and BR went, I don't know where the others are (I have seen posts as to who has them). That is just rumors and I do not know who they were placed with.

The property of the Rhoden's could also be sold, and the proceeds used to benefit the families, I haven't read anything about CRsr land being sold or KR.

AW must have given permission for CN and Randa and her mum and grandmother to live in AW fathers home, as AW inherited the home, when RN and her mother move next door CN said he will continue to live in that house, it is no use to AW for 30 years and with an aging grandmother and mother having CN and Randa next door will mean they will be able to help them as and when it is needed.