OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #83

[Myland]

Jmo here’s the odd part. When there was no Wow moment at the border people were saying things like they should have been upset with questioning. Then on the audio George is upset with the investigation and now it is - this shows he was a shooter.

 

[SuziQ]

Did we lose sound or is it me?

 

[ColMustard]

Did we lose sound or is it me?

No problem on the L&C youtube.

 

[SuziQ]

No problem on the L&C youtube.

It was me, operator error.

 

[Myland]

Jmo the tape that bothered me the most was the first one with Angela talking to Jake. That shows me those two men never had a chance growing up around that woman.

 

[justtrish]

Good Morning!
As we are hopefully inching towards an end to this trial I have a few thoughts. It has been a wild ride and I respect many of you immensely who have been posing from day one. This is all IMO.

George was definitely there. Jake put him there, Angela put him there. 3 guns IMO put him there. I believe Jake lied when he said he took the gun from George to minimize George's part in the murders. After listening to the wiretaps yesterday, I believe George had no problem pulling the trigger taking at the very least, the shot that took off CRsr arm. Listen to the hatred he spews about poor BA, I believe he was just as vocal about HR if not worse because she wasn't bending to the Wagners demands over custody. I wonder if Jake was even present for the entire scene at CRsrs, and also question where the rest of the shots came from there.

I think George shot Kenny and was proud of himself for a little while, boasting the Lone Wolf pic on his FB. Great shot George... right to the eye. All by yourself, You're a Big Boy!

When LEO put on the heat, George lost his crap. He was paranoid. It may have even amplified his already aggressive, pugnacious, demeanor. This is the family BA knew, the family after the "Laser Focus".

I believe Smiley was Sheiderer. Statements he made in court lead me to believe this. Smiley made posts about inside info, searches that both happened and did not happen. He created many seperate threads to keep the conversation on track best he could. And of course, he is sitting in court every day as Smiley said he would be.

I have so many thoughts, and opinions, and gut feelings after 6 years of following closely. George is Guilty of all charges. I wonder if DA has decided if Jake held up his end of the bargain, because all the puzzle pieces did not add up in his testimony IMO he lied about George's involvement on the night of the murders.

Praying justice is served for the R and G families.

Great post! I think those recordings have helped many see the real personality of George. We've already seen Angela and Billy in other recordings sounding paranoid, chatty, and ranting, but George we heard very little about.

I feel very similar! I think Jake was over at Frankies to keep an eye out and prepare to shoot if they came out. He knew that house because Hannah lived in it for a while. He was making sure Frankie and Hanna Gilley didn't wake up while George and Billy were over at Chris Sr. I even wonder if Gary was shot in that recliner by George while Billy was out at the grow, then moved before Chris and Billy got back up to the house. Maybe George went back out to hide and wait on Chris Sr to walk up there and he sees blood or see something off so begins to move around more so George doesn't get a good shot at first and hits his arm, then several places on the front of the house. I could even see George then getting the pistol again and coming up to shoot again while Chris is standing there with his arm nearly blown off. If I recall there was a shot to the stomach and chest. Then he gives Billy the gun (because maybe Billy didn't want to see off by wearing his gun while he was meeting with Chris) and shoots him several times in the head to finish him. Maybe he does come out of the house saying I just shot my best friend. Maybe that is the point Jake it walking back over toward Chris Sr and he tries to calm him down and then get the keys. I could see George then moving Chris Sr body while Jake is taking down the cameras. I really think they covered those bodies so they could try to get in the safe in the bedroom. They didn't want to look at the bodies while they tried to break in to that safe, where Billy knew he kept all that cash.

What I am sure of no matter who killed who or what order, etc. George was there.

 

[justtrish]

How can this expert witness help the Defense? Not impressed.

I understand an outside expert isn't maybe going to know every single thing like someone that worked the case for years, but he didn't know the name of one of the victims (Hannah Mae) and that sorta bothers me. How can you stare at these photos and try to analyze a crime scene and not want to know who the victims are or at least put a name to them. You are going over this in court where their families are listening and you know scene 2 is where Dana and Chris Jr are but you don't recall the 3rd victim. Then the defense didn't even say her name.

Maybe this is nit picking, but remembering why there is even a trial should be important for everyone in the court room, even the defense. If their client didn't do it, there is still 8 murdered innocent people.

 

[ColMustard]

I have to disagree with the expert's assertion that any light would "mute" the flash of a gunshot. The word "mute" to me means it would eliminate the flash.

I just don't think it would, unless the ambient light is brighter than the flash.

Edit: I can't agree about the blinds in the camper either. If he didn't speak so absolutely I might agree to a degree. They're trying to say Jake couldn't have seen the flash from outside, that all light from the flash was eliminated by the ambient light and the blinds.

15 minute break, until 10:25.

Clark Kent will shoot this duck down.

 

[Chelly]

Interesting point brought out about this crime scene analyst testifying for the defense. He says he does not have a degree but has testified at hundreds of trials.

imo, Paid expert witnesses for defense attorneys seem to spin evidence to fit the conclusion they expect.

 

[Ann99]

I understand an outside expert isn't maybe going to know every single thing like someone that worked the case for years, but he didn't know the name of one of the victims (Hannah Mae) and that sorta bothers me. How can you stare at these photos and try to analyze a crime scene and not want to know who the victims are or at least put a name to them. You are going over this in court where their families are listening and you know scene 2 is where Dana and Chris Jr are but you don't recall the 3rd victim. Then the defense didn't even say her name.

Maybe this is nit picking, but remembering why there is even a trial should be important for everyone in the court room, even the defense. If their client didn't do it, there is still 8 murdered innocent people.

Witness does not seem to be prepared or he is not familiar with this situation, and Nash does not seem to know what questions to ask of him.
A complete disconnect.
Fail.

 

[Niner]

Defense witness: Jon Priest continued...


James Pilcher
@jamespilcher
·
5m
He was asked how many people perpetrated the crime - but Nash says we'll get to that. Now presenting pictures of blood on the floor. Not showing them on the screens in the courtroom. Going over Scene 1 - Chris Sr.'s house.

Calls it a volume stain with a sustaining source of blood. With swipes like with a broom or a brush. Others were a smear.

Says the chair recliner was moved after the blood stain was created. Now onto the injuries and wounds to Chris and Gary.

Priest: injury to Chris Sr's arm was high powered - like the SKS rifle 762x39 caliber said to be used in the crimes.

Bodies appeared as if they had been dragged by the feet First body was likely Gary and second one was Chris

Bodies were covered with comforter - Priest says that happens a lot to hide the bodies or "depersonalize" the bodies.

Now going to scene 3 - talking about Dana was also covered up with pillow and comforter. Pillow was in different position when first stained with blood and then put over her face. Then comforter placed over her.

Defense lawyer Richard Nash asking specifically about placement of shots to head - making note several victims were shot through the right eye.

Priest says he can't rule out multiple offenders, but a single offender could have perpetrated the crimes at Chris Sr's house. Also a lack of multiple sole impressions.

Hard to drag bodies side by side, have to be in a line or one at a time.

Says not a lot of footprints indicates not many people inside the crime scene.

But says there were prints found in blood there. Prints I saw direction of travel from bedroom out to living room.

Priest says he wouldn't be able to see a gunflash inside the trailer from behind the truck at Kenneth's trailer - Jake previously testified he saw one after father Billy went inisde. He says he never went into Ken's trailer.

They show a video showing someone firing a .40 glock with a Hornady bullet to see if you could see a gunflash.

But he still says he wouldn't see a flash at night behind the truck - especially through the window with blinds in the window. Especially with a light on inside.

The caliber of scenes is monogamous - and says one individual easily could have done all those shots especially at the final three crime scenes when all in bed.

Reading from report - question of number of perpetrators. Consistent with what he testified. No more questions. Prosecution wants to reset and pull up exhibits for cross examination so we're on break for 15 minutes.


link: https://twitter.com/jamespilcher

 

[CIA Team Member]

Jmo the tape that bothered me the most was the first one with Angela talking to Jake. That shows me those two men never had a chance growing up around that woman.

Would really like to know what happened to AW to become this way. Was it the SA to her? Or, did was it something else? Really wonder what it was like in her parents house growing up. Seems lying, stealing, etc was the norm in the household, and also in Billy's side of the family. Generational. As I've said before; they all worked hard to not work.
I still feel so badly for both Tab and BA, they never had a chance back then. Both vulnerable.

JMO

 

[Skully67]

How can this expert witness help the Defense? Not impressed.

Trying to sow doubt in JWs testimony. I have also wondered about the lack of shoe prints at scene 1.

 

[Skully67]

I have to disagree with the expert's assertion that any light would "mute" the flash of a gunshot. The word "mute" to me means it would eliminate the flash.

I just don't think it would, unless the ambient light is brighter than the flash.

Edit: I can't agree about the blinds in the camper either. If he didn't speak so absolutely I might agree to a degree. They're trying to say Jake couldn't have seen the flash from outside, that all light from the flash was eliminated by the ambient light and the blinds.

15 minute break, until 10:25.

Clark Kent will shoot this duck down.

Depends on the type of blind. Some are light filtering, some are blackout. Some with those slats would still show light thru them.

 

[Skully67]

Witness does not seem to be prepared or he is not familiar with this situation, and Nash does not seem to know what questions to ask of him.
A complete disconnect.
Fail.

Agree. He should at least know names and locations.

 

[dgfred]

If you are expecting a shot or two... watching closely you might notice the slight change in light. maybe a muffled shot too.

 

[pcrum12]

Great post! I think those recordings have helped many see the real personality of George. We've already seen Angela and Billy in other recordings sounding paranoid, chatty, and ranting, but George we heard very little about.

I feel very similar! I think Jake was over at Frankies to keep an eye out and prepare to shoot if they came out. He knew that house because Hannah lived in it for a while. He was making sure Frankie and Hanna Gilley didn't wake up while George and Billy were over at Chris Sr. I even wonder if Gary was shot in that recliner by George while Billy was out at the grow, then moved before Chris and Billy got back up to the house. Maybe George went back out to hide and wait on Chris Sr to walk up there and he sees blood or see something off so begins to move around more so George doesn't get a good shot at first and hits his arm, then several places on the front of the house. I could even see George then getting the pistol again and coming up to shoot again while Chris is standing there with his arm nearly blown off. If I recall there was a shot to the stomach and chest. Then he gives Billy the gun (because maybe Billy didn't want to see off by wearing his gun while he was meeting with Chris) and shoots him several times in the head to finish him. Maybe he does come out of the house saying I just shot my best friend. Maybe that is the point Jake it walking back over toward Chris Sr and he tries to calm him down and then get the keys. I could see George then moving Chris Sr body while Jake is taking down the cameras. I really think they covered those bodies so they could try to get in the safe in the bedroom. They didn't want to look at the bodies while they tried to break in to that safe, where Billy knew he kept all that cash.

What I am sure of no matter who killed who or what order, etc. George was there.

THIS - My thoughts exactly -- I think it could very well be as you post by the evidence we are seeing.

 

[Chelly]

Prosecutor Andrew Wilson (aka Clark Kent) beginning to cross examine defense's expert witness, Mr Priest. Looking forward to this!!!!

 

[Ann99]

Depends on the type of blind. Some are light filtering, some are blackout. Some with those slats would still show light thru them.

MO
The door on KR trailer had a window, with no blind or curtain, I think.
I believe JW could have seen a flash from that area as Billy would have been standing very close to it. The door would have been behind Billy.

 

[justtrish]

I have to disagree with the expert's assertion that any light would "mute" the flash of a gunshot. The word "mute" to me means it would eliminate the flash.

I just don't think it would, unless the ambient light is brighter than the flash.

Edit: I can't agree about the blinds in the camper either. If he didn't speak so absolutely I might agree to a degree. They're trying to say Jake couldn't have seen the flash from outside, that all light from the flash was eliminated by the ambient light and the blinds.

15 minute break, until 10:25.

Clark Kent will shoot this duck down.

What I listened to just made me think you know maybe Jake was up there watching at the road and Billy and George were down at Kenneth's killing him. I've thought George killed Kenneth from the beginning since he put that wolf photo on FB and his mother had to comment on it. Makes you wonder. If it's just a photo, then why did she need to say really George?