OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#49

[RAISINISBACK]

That’s true but she’s already claimed she made the purchases that are on the receipts AND if she claims she didn’t know he used her card that digs the hole deeper for her precious son. I find red flags when I look at those receipts. I find it extremely hard to believe a 77 yr old knows what particular pocket shot stealth slingshot to buy or would buy a 4x jacket for BW when everything else he wears is a 2x. I don’t believe she would order without him either standing over her while she orders or he has pre-printed the exact things he wants. If AC gets her on the stand and asks her, “Do you allow BW to use your cc?” If she says yes then she is also responsible. But if she says “not all the time” then Ac would ask how often, did she authorize for BW for___ on ___ day? If FW says no then “How do you remember you did/didn’t on this day or this day or this day?” Again, if she says she doesn’t allow him then she’s admitting guilt by her use of her own card or he did it against her knowledge which adds theft to his charges.

Wagner family matriarch claims innocence as case is dismissed

What I found very interesting was in Fred's interview after the charges were dismissed, she said 'I am innocent." She stressed the "I" slightly making me think she wasn't too sure about the W4's innocence anymore.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Adding a half hour to that timeline makes no difference.

Can you explain how Sheriff Reader,who responds after the murders were called in to 911, (he wasn't a first responder at the scenes) would be able to plant DNA at the crime scenes? Are you assuming he carried around some samples of Wagner family members DNA to plant there? Alternatively, he would have to observe the crime scenes, decide to frame the Wagners (why?) and would have to leave the crime scenes, with hundreds of first responders around, multiple helicopters overhead and dozens of news cameras at every intersection nearby, and drive over to the Wagners farm on Peterson Rd. to somehow get into their home, while they were there and take some DNA samples.

Keep in mind, all the evidence at the crime scenes was retrieved by BCI and their crime scene experts who then took it to the BCI labs for examination.

If your theory is that Sheriff Reader somehow planted evidence at the crime scene while BCI was processing it, why would he wait for over a year after the murders before pursuing them?

JMO

ETA: See timeline on p 1 of this thread for the names of the first responders to the crime scene.

Inside the Rhoden investigation: Scientists work with cops

Betty if you can remember the article, I think DeWine arrived on the scene before Reader did. He jumped the first helicopter out and was running the show almost before the first newscast went out.
Him and Frannie.

Poor Frannie had to tell him what those little houses out in front of Frankies were for.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I knew they were looking at Reader but dang, I'm having a hard time picturing him as some wild playboy breaking law after law. Taking drug money, having an affair, a gambling addiction, giving his daughter impounded cars? This is smelling a bit like the Moorer's in Heather Elvis' case. Point at the LE, politicians & whoever else you can. I'm fearing a lot of corruption there possibly.

I'll wait to see the evidence.

Anyone can have a gambling addiction. That's why casinos have a 1-800 number to gamblers anonymous posted about 100 times all over the casino. The ATM's in casinos here only allow you to withdraw so much from your bank account for that reason. They cut you off from cashing checks after a certain amount also.

The reason the casinos here limit the amount of cash you can get at them is because at a casino in Tulsa a woman in her 80's was allowed to cash 20 checks for a total amount of 86000.00 in one night. She promptly lost every dime of it. Her son sued the casino on the grounds his mother was incompetent and was awarded half the money back. The casinos here took a lesson from that and now limit the amount you can get in ATM's or checks.

JMO

 

[OhioBlues]

The article says the search warrants and affidavits have been turned over to the W4.

"However, court records indicate those search warrants and affidavits have already been disclosed to attorneys for the Wagner family members who are charged with the homicides."

The article also says this:

In a motion to dismiss the charges, Canepa and Pike Co. Prosecutor Rob Junk wrote that they were concerned about turning over to Wagner’s attorney's search warrants and the affidavits used to obtain them for Wagner’s property in May 2017. “Releasing this information at this time to defendant Fredericka Carole Wagner would compromise the prosecution of the capital cases,” Canepa and Junk wrote in their motion.

I believe what Canepa and Junk wrote in their motion is accurate.

The statement that you quoted was written by a reporter who may not know all of the facts.

 

[Dudly]

Sure. The only new information I gleaned from the article was:

Eight of the theft in office charges involve a Chevy Silverado and a Nissan Versa (but they would not elaborate further)

The tampering with evidence, tampering with records and theft in office charges all relate to “evidence envelopes,” the indictment says.

The conflict of interest charges stem from Reader either taking or asking for loans totaling $3,000 from one county vendor, as well as loans totaling $6,000 from his employees, including one from his former chief deputy.

Reader said neither he nor his department will discuss the matter, and wanted to assure the citizens that business will go on as usual.





#I stand 4 Charlie!

My opinion only:
The main thing they are stressing is that those things involving the loans and vehicles "could" have influenced him making decisions regarding his job. It looks to me that the main reason the anonomous tipster complained is to discredit Reader. It does not say if he repayed the loans which to me would make a big difference. As usual with Pike County, there are a lot of facts missing in the indictment. In my opinion, it isn't as bad as it is made out to be. I still think someone has a vindetta or it is political.
All my opinions..

 

[Cool Cats]

 

[Cool Cats]

Sorry about above post. Was trying to download but didn't work out and I can't get it to delete.

It is Sheriff Reader's Court Indictment you can read it here:

Indictment of Pike County Sheriff Charles Reader

 

[LovelyB]

Does that prove murder?

What evidence do you believe LE has that proves murder against the W’s. You really think they have dna?

Personally, I think they have some DNA... At any rate, the discovery is out there for all to see. There is plenty of evidence there, or they wouldn't be sitting in jail without bond. Whether they are convicted is another story, given recent events.

 

[Cool Cats]

Those indictments on Reader really does have me believing he or his team would purposely plant evidence to frame someone. I think the W’s are guilty, but also wouldn’t be surprised if they were indeed set up/framed

If the parts to make a silencer were planted, they still got the forensics from the crime lab that ties it to the murders. This article goes along with what you are saying:

Full article here: Pike County sheriff

“Of course [Reader’s indictment] is going to affect the case,’’ said Michael Benza, who lectures on criminal law at Case Western Reserve University.
“The prosecution will say that it won’t, but [Reader and his department] were involved in the opening stages of the investigation, and that’s one of the most important parts of a criminal case, when you are gathering evidence and interviewing witnesses, when everything is fresh.’’

Timothy McGinty, the retired longtime Cuyahoga County prosecutor and judge, agreed: “It’s a problem that goes to the credibility of the case. In small counties, sheriffs are the key law enforcement officers. They’re a big deal.
“But this will depend on how much his office did in the investigation and what the attorney general’s office did.’’

The charges also involve tampering with evidence, an allegation that Benza said could affect how defense attorneys for the Wagners handle the Rhoden case.
“Defense attorneys can bring up the fact that if he is tampering with evidence in this case, did he tamper with evidence in other cases?’’ Benza said.

 

[Myland]

Jmo we believe the killers took the cell phones but is there evidence they did? We believe the killers opened the windows but is there evidence the killers did? We believe the killers put the mag lite in the well, but made it thru one farm search and two years, is there direct evidence to link the mag lite to the Wagner’s and victims? Jmo

 

[OhioBlues]

Jmo we believe the killers took the cell phones but is there evidence they did? We believe the killers opened the windows but is there evidence the killers did? We believe the killers put the mag lite in the well, but made it thru one farm search and two years, is there direct evidence to link the mag lite to the Wagner’s and victims? Jmo

What are you asking? Are you asking if someone else did these things? If so, are you suggesting someone in particular?

 

[OhioBlues]

DBM - Double posting

 

[Myland]

What are you asking? Are you asking if someone else did these things? If so, are you suggesting someone in particular?

Jmo unless there is direct evidence these could be question a defense attorney would ask Jmo

 

[Merrygirl]

My opinion only:
The main thing they are stressing is that those things involving the loans and vehicles "could" have influenced him making decisions regarding his job. It looks to me that the main reason the anonomous tipster complained is to discredit Reader. It does not say if he repayed the loans which to me would make a big difference. As usual with Pike County, there are a lot of facts missing in the indictment. In my opinion, it isn't as bad as it is made out to be. I still think someone has a vindetta or it is political.
All my opinions..

This is all my opinion only but I think the AG strategically waited a while to give some time and distance between Reader’s charges and W4 charges to hopefully draw a line that the 2 incidents were not connected in any way. These charges have been investigated for at least 8 mos if not longer. I believe this will be a quick deal and in the end either charges are dropped or reduced. I think DeWine will take care of things “in the back room” because waaaay too much is at stake here. DeWine will not want anything to get in the way of a conclusion of justice for the R’/M’s/G’s and this case is the highlight of his ENTIRE political career. He will need take care of it so he can win a 2nd term. Anything else would be political suicide. JMOO.

 

[Cool Cats]

Jmo we believe the killers took the cell phones but is there evidence they did? We believe the killers opened the windows but is there evidence the killers did? We believe the killers put the mag lite in the well, but made it thru one farm search and two years, is there direct evidence to link the mag lite to the Wagner’s and victims? Jmo

In Count 9:
https://html1-f.scribdassets.com/oy41q82bk6tiwhk/images/7-4008e931f5.jpg

It says destroying and/or tampering with evidence of the crimes.........and/or phones belonging to some of the victims.....

The Prosecution has evidence about the phones or phones wouldn't be listed in the indictments.

The indictments say that they went into the Rhoden homes but does not say how they got in. Windows are not mentioned in the indictments.

Maglite (sp?) was found in a well on their property but the forensic results haven't been publicly revealed.

 

[Myland]

In Count 9:
https://html1-f.scribdassets.com/oy41q82bk6tiwhk/images/7-4008e931f5.jpg

It says destroying and/or tampering with evidence of the crimes.........and/or phones belonging to some of the victims.....

The Prosecution has evidence about the phones or phones wouldn't be listed in the indictments.

The indictments say that they went into the Rhoden homes but does not say how they got in. Windows are not mentioned in the indictments.

Maglite (sp?) was found in a well on their property but the forensic results haven't been publicly revealed.

Jmo but if they can link the Wagner’s to the destroying of the phones that is pretty good evidence but if just based on phones missing not so good. The mag lite has to be linked directly to Wagners and victims otherwise the well was not guarded for two years jmo

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Jmo but if they can link the Wagner’s to the destroying of the phones that is pretty good evidence but if just based on phones missing not so good. The mag lite has to be linked directly to Wagners and victims otherwise the well was not guarded for two years jmo

The ATF provided a report on the Maglite. That report was returned to the AG/BCI on 11/7/18. The indictments were signed and arrests were made 6 days after the finalized ATF report. JMO, something significant on the ATF report sealed the Wagners’ fate. In addition, if you listen again to Dewine at the 11/13/18 press conference, he stated that one piece of evidence does not make this case. It’s all of the evidence together. All JMO.

 

[Loomis124]

Does that prove murder?

What evidence do you believe LE has that proves murder against the W’s. You really think they have dna?

The evidence is not from LE, as in Pike County...aka Reader. It is from BCI. Huge difference. BCI was in charge of this case, not local LE. JMO based on news reports from Day 1.

 

[Loomis124]

Wagner family matriarch claims innocence as case is dismissed

What I found very interesting was in Fred's interview after the charges were dismissed, she said 'I am innocent." She stressed the "I" slightly making me think she wasn't too sure about the W4's innocence anymore.

JMO

IMO, FW is going to do whatever it takes to save her selfish self. First and foremost.

 

[Betty P]

Jmo we believe the killers took the cell phones but is there evidence they did? We believe the killers opened the windows but is there evidence the killers did? We believe the killers put the mag lite in the well, but made it thru one farm search and two years, is there direct evidence to link the mag lite to the Wagner’s and victims? Jmo

We will find out at the trial. I trust BCI, ATF, Homeland Security, FBI and the Attorney General's office.