OK - Five Bever family members slain in their Broken Arrow home, 22 July 2015 *Guilty*

[T4Tide]

BBM - I think this is probably going to be a touchy subject for me because we are a homeschooling family. I just want to point out that even though the neighbors didn't see the kids interacting with other kids in the neighborhood, doesn't mean the kids don't have a social life.

My kids have played with the kids in our neighborhood, but the older ones always come home and say they don't want to. The neighborhood kids swear a lot, and talk about sex constantly, and my boys just don't want to be like that. I respect their decisions and it makes me proud that they want to distance themselves from that.

But my kids have lots of friends, and are really active in sports and other activities outside of our neighborhood. Just throwing it out there.

I have no doubt that an 18 year old who has his license can get his hands on drugs. No doubt.

Having said all of that, I know our family dynamic is different than theirs (wow - I really HOPE it is!) so who knows what went on inside that home. For 2 boys to kill their family just defies logic.

So something was off, but my main thought is....I just don't want people to blame homeschooling and perceived socialization without having more information.

We are also a homeschooling family, and Lord....my kids keep me so busy with their "social events" that I barely have time to see straight! They are 15, 13, 12, 8, and 11 months. 😊😊

Bottom line....there's weird and mental home schoolers and there's weird and mental public/private schoolers. There's males and females who kill. There's black and white people who kill. There's liberals and conservatives who kill. There's smart and not so smart people who kill. There's rich and poor people who kill. There's violent video gamers who kill and video gamers who don't. There's homosexuals and heterosexuals that kill.

When tragedy strikes, we want to know what the trigger was....and that's normal, but we have to be careful about putting people in groups and then deciding that belonging to that group was what turned them into murderers. It's not.

THEY turned themselves into murderers.

MOO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

They are now reporting that one of the sons called 911 before dying....this is my old hometown.........so sad for my broken arrow family

This is such a sad and tragic case. I read another article earlier and his girlfriend said how she always felt he loved his family a lot. Yet this is the way he repaid them for their love and kindness.

I think they were good people....good parents.

I do think there are drugs involved. If its meth then I have read several articles about meth addicts when keeping up with the Bobo case, and they are known to be very sadistic, and violent when they resort to murder.

IMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

We are also a homeschooling family, and Lord....my kids keep me so busy with their "social events" that I barely have time to see straight! They are 15, 13, 12, 8, and 11 months. ����

Bottom line....there's weird and mental home schoolers and there's weird and mental public/private schoolers. There's males and females who kill. There's black and white people who kill. There's liberals and conservatives who kill. There's smart and not so smart people who kill. There's rich and poor people who kill. There's violent video gamers who kill and video gamers who don't. There's homosexuals and heterosexuals that kill.

When tragedy strikes, we want to know what the trigger was....and that's normal, but we have to be careful about putting people in groups and then deciding that belonging to that group was what turned them into murderers. It's not.

THEY turned themselves into murderers.

MOO

I couldn't agree with you more. This had nothing to do with being home schooled imo and there isn't one statistic that says teens who are home schooled are more likely to commit crimes much less murders. That is just a myth.

Teens who commit multiple murders of their parents or siblings or both come from all walks of life just like other murderers do. I have read about several teen killers and most of the ones I have read about went to public schools and were well liked by their peers. And the saddest part about it many of them were known to be very close to their parents who were supportive parents. The motives are mind blowing and so nonsensical. Very few teens murder because they were abused. Most endure it until they are of the age to legally leave the home.

I don't think this had one thing to do with abuse either. In fact it wouldn't surprise me if the parents overly pampered all of their children.

Teen killers murder for the most stupid of reasons when it comes to wiping out parents or entire families. 1. They don't like doing chores. 2. They kill for financial gain thinking they will inherit everything with everyone else dead. 3. They have their material possessions taken away because of misbehavior and go into a blind murderous rage. 4. Or they wanted to do something the parents didn't approve of or date someone they didn't approve of.

I did read a statistic awhile back that the motives for teens who murder are changing. Some of these killers are psychopaths even at an early age and they are more bonded to material things than they are their families. Some cant handle being told 'no' about anything.

The two teens probably didn't have a vehicle to go on their planned murder spree. With the parents dead they could take any vehicle they wanted/money and do as they pleased.

Thank goodness this carnage was stopped because of the 911 call. No telling what would have happened if no one knew about it and they were out on the streets looking for more people to murder.

This case reminds me of one that happened in my own community many years ago in the early 80s. A 16 year old son went into to his home and shot dead both of his parents with a shotgun as they lay in their bed asleep. Then he tried to murder his only sister and rape her. She was shot but miraculously survived. He was so ticked off that his parents had cutoff all access to money because they knew he would spend every dime on illegal drugs. They had tried to have him dried out several times. Once they stopped the money it sealed their fate. He felt if he could kill them and his only sister he would inherit all of their wealth. They were wonderful highly respected citizens and very good parents. Of course he got nothing and is doing LWOP and his sister inherited everything as she should have.

I wouldn't be surprised if something similar happened in this case.

IMO

 

[FragileSugar]

I have never been so terribly hit by a crime like this one, just nothing about it makes any sense to me at all... these boys seem to have come from a loving, happy, healthy home and it wasn't just one of them but both of them, if they could kill off their whole family what made them even trust in each other??

I wonder if possibly they have brain damage from huffing freon? I was reading some of the mom's comments on reddit and at one point they had to have some sort of locks put on their ac unit, she indicated it was kids going to the park (apparently there's a public access beside their home?) but maybe it was her own kids? I just don't know... this thread here where she commented was especially chilling/heartbreaking to me: https://www.***********/r/Frugal/comments/2r7uhv/is_remaining_child_free_the_most_frugal_way_to_be/ "I would never give up having any of my children so I could have more money. They are amazing people and the world will benefit by having them in it. And nothing I could buy or invest in could compare to giving a person a chance to have a life."

...elsewhere she talks about going overboard spoiling her kids for christmas, according to her facebook she follows Dayna Martin who is an advocate for *extremely* permissive parenting, in another forum she was talking about trying to balance time with her family and visiting her newborn (the now 2yo) in NICU... this just doesn't sound at all like a reclusive abusive home, far from it....??

Another reddit thread she posted : "The ages are 18 16 12 11 9 4 1. I started when my first was in preschool. I like that I got to spend everyday with my now 18 yr as he grew up. My oldest slowed down on his to go work so he did not graduate early but my 16 yr old just finished his online hs and graduated early."

This was 7 months ago. Maybe the 16 year old had extra time since he finished his online hs early and he started bonding more with his older brother? I don't know. I just don't understand how two children could not only murder their own parents but also their younger siblings and show no remorse.

 

[KinderedSpirits]

What a tragedy! So heartbroken.

 

[HoneyWest]

http://http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/girl-who-survived-broken-arrow-stabbing-named-brothers-as-assailants/article_63975ee4-26e7-5742-b220-15dfe9e351ba.html

New local article with 16 year old's mugshot.

 

[FragileSugar]

Ammunition delivery possibly tied to Broken Arrow killings

FOX23 found out investigators are looking into a shipment that was supposed to be delivered to the home Thursday.

Sources said the shipment contained boxes of ammunition. Police said they can't comment on it because of the investigation.
- See more at: http://www.fox23.com/news/news/local/five-dead-broken-arrow-homicide/nm5LJ/#sthash.TEucwzqU.dpuf

 

[FragileSugar]

Matt Jacobsen and his wife lived across the street from the family. They talked to FOX23 off camera about their memories of the family.

Jacobsen said April Bever was a 'mother hen' and loved her children very much. He said they were both very involved and friendly. He said they often chatted with April and she helped them celebrate the birth of their child last year and their children played together.He even said he helped one of the Bever children with their lawn mower just last week.

He said the only unusual thing is that the family didn't spend a lot of time outside, despite having a pool and playground toys in their yard. He described the suspected killer, Robert, by saying he 'craved attention.'
- See more at: http://www.fox23.com/news/news/loca...er-was-mother-hen/nm6Bs/#sthash.xcgQ1r4i.dpuf

 

[FragileSugar]

Oklahoma Police Scour Teen's Social Media After Deaths

A neighbor of the family, Matt Jacobsen, on Friday described the 16-year-old as a follower, not a leader, and "nerdy," given his interest in computers and technology. Others in the subdivision noted the family seemed isolated to the point that they appeared to avoid community events.

 

[bluesneakers]

BBM - I think this is probably going to be a touchy subject for me because we are a homeschooling family. I just want to point out that even though the neighbors didn't see the kids interacting with other kids in the neighborhood, doesn't mean the kids don't have a social life.

My kids have played with the kids in our neighborhood, but the older ones always come home and say they don't want to. The neighborhood kids swear a lot, and talk about sex constantly, and my boys just don't want to be like that. I respect their decisions and it makes me proud that they want to distance themselves from that.

But my kids have lots of friends, and are really active in sports and other activities outside of our neighborhood. Just throwing it out there.

I have no doubt that an 18 year old who has his license can get his hands on drugs. No doubt.

Having said all of that, I know our family dynamic is different than theirs (wow - I really HOPE it is!) so who knows what went on inside that home. For 2 boys to kill their family just defies logic.

So something was off, but my main thought is....I just don't want people to blame homeschooling and perceived socialization without having more information.

I'm hopeful people know how popular homeschooling is now and how many different types of parents (even parents who aren't a "type") do it. It should be like any other sort of schooling choice. Yes, this happened and these kids were homeschooled, but would we jump to any schooling-related theories if they'd been in public, Catholic, private, prep, or any other kind of school?

 

[wfgodot]

Now probably isn't the place for apologists for home schooling to tout their beliefs; neither then should it be the place for those opposing to point fingers.

Rest in peace all. Something was amiss.

 

[human]

The older one has that weird look like Lanza or Holmes.

What is that all about?

 

[Carrollz]

Everything I read, everywhere I look, it just seems like this was nothing but a very loving, very happy, very family oriented home (from their actual online presence and people that actually spoke with and knew them as opposed to strangers and people that didn't know them)... I just do not get this and clearly these boys had to have planned this out so it's not like some crazy drug induced psychotic break???

http://www.news9.com/story/29628860...derer-is-unrecognizable-from-person-she-knows

 

[Carrollz]

I'm seriously traumatized by this... I read all these horrible stories and I feel like there is always something I can point to, it may not make sense, I may never relate to or fully understand it and of course it is always troubling, but I can just say well there's evil or psychosis or *something*... but this situation??? I'm just... I don't even know... why, how can these boys not only be so horrible but so stupid and so capable of doing this?

 

[bluesneakers]

Everything I read, everywhere I look, it just seems like this was nothing but a very loving, very happy, very family oriented home (from their actual online presence and people that actually spoke with and knew them as opposed to strangers and people that didn't know them)... I just do not get this and clearly these boys had to have planned this out so it's not like some crazy drug induced psychotic break???

http://www.news9.com/story/29628860...derer-is-unrecognizable-from-person-she-knows

That's what I'm stuck on too. I'm not saying no way is it a psychotic break (drug induced or no), but I don't know how it would work since there two of them. Could two brothers decide to become serial killers and start with their own family?

 

[arizona sunshine]

My family belongs to the Indian Springs Country Club and this is all everyone is talking about. My husband actually had the father as a contact on LinkedIn. A few people have said they'd seen them swimming at the pool a few times but they stayed pretty much to themselves. Not sure if they were actual members or guests. Nobody seems to know anything about them except they were big into Rhema church.

just a peripheral information to the case; The Rhema Church is holding a Campmeeting in Broken Arrow this week

http://www.rhema.org/Campmeeting
2015: Happening Now! Broken Arrow, Oklahoma. Kenneth Hagin Ministries' Campmeeting 2015 is under way!

 

[FragileSugar]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3173491/Suspect-18-admits-stabbed-parents-death-home.html

A few interesting comments made by a "friend" of RB - they worked together at a call center called MicahTek. Sort by "Best Rated" and it's the first one listed. He also comments on the 2nd and 3rd highest rated.

 

[bettiepageturner]

Yikes, one of those mugshots (both of them, actually, of the older brother's) that just send a shiver down your spine. Hard to explain why *exactly.* And even harder to understand how BOTH brothers could have wanted to do this.

 

[Hatfield]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3173491/Suspect-18-admits-stabbed-parents-death-home.html

A few interesting comments made by a "friend" of RB - they worked together at a call center called MicahTek. Sort by "Best Rated" and it's the first one listed. He also comments on the 2nd and 3rd highest rated.

Thanks. A lot of the comments are well worth reading through and especially the ones from the friend as I do think it gives a good perspective on this tragedy.

JMO
I think the sheltering and isolation that the children had to live with went too far to the extreme.

Whether someone is homeschooled or not , it is important IMO that children are allowed to mingle with their peers at least some of the time during developmental years. It serves some important functions in child development.
I know some parents who are homeschooling their kids and they have social events to make sure their kids get that exposure which I felt is great for them.

Being able to succeed and fail with various competitions with peers is one of those things that I feel is important. Whether it be extra curricular activities like sports OR work OR classroom competitions like tests where kids always ask each other how they did on tests OR simple unrelated competitions like "Lets see who can run to the end of the street Faster".

All of those types of peer competitions and just silly and fun stuff with peers helps children learn valuable lessons. Lessons that cannot really be learned elsewhere.

I think when there is too much isolation then the children are left to wonder in their own minds about all sorts of things and they have nobody to run their thoughts by. Because they will not discuss certain things with parents. No checks and balances for them. Nobody there to tell them...."No Silly, That is just crazy".

Their thoughts, minds, and development can go in very twisted ways and with nobody around them to ever help change their thinking and correct their mistakes they can convince themselves of horrible misdirections.

Because let us remember an important point. There are lots of things a child will never talk to their parents or teacher about. There are many important subjects that a child will never dare talk to their parents or teacher about but they will comfortably share those kinds of things with a peer.

Anwyay, I am not trying to put the blame solely on the parents because there could have been some valid mental disorders, however, IMO I do think the style the parents had of sheltering their children to the extreme could have contributed to this tragedy.

So sad.

 

[bluesneakers]

just a peripheral information to the case; The Rhema Church is holding a Campmeeting in Broken Arrow this week

http://www.rhema.org/Campmeeting
2015: Happening Now! Broken Arrow, Oklahoma. Kenneth Hagin Ministries' Campmeeting 2015 is under way!

I hope it doesn't turn out one (or both) of these boys was sick and not getting proper treatment.

DIVINE HEALING—Healing is for the physical ills of the human body and is wrought by the power of God through the prayer of faith, and by the laying on of hands. It is provided for in the atonement of Christ, and is the privilege of every member of the Church today (James 5:14,15; Mark 16:18; Isa. 53:4,5; Matt. 8:17; 1 Peter 2:24).

http://www.rhemabiblechurch.com/im-new/we-believe/expanded-beliefs