GUILTY OR - Whitney Heichel, 21, Gresham, 16 Oct 2012 #3

[CaringCitizen]

Her husband looks dead pan...which could read 'shell-shocked' in a sense, but in another...I can't quite get a consistent read on him. He seems very contained, almost detached (calling her "a lively little person")...even when breaking down at the news conference--his face contorted but I saw no tears. I'm not making accusation here...it's more a personality read, from body language and verbal and nonverbal expression.

When I watched the first family presser and then how all the reporters used the next morning's presser to ask questions about Clint, I went back and studied the footage. He does smile and laugh (I have still shots of it) prior to the tears. I posted that I thought this was the impetus for reporters to ask so much about him the next day - but that we didn't know enough to really think it could be him. His body language made me suspicious too but it wasn't enough. Something was still nagging me - in particular the timeline didn't work very well to be Clint (if the sighting at the gas station was real, for example).

BUT, after it was clear he was not involved I had to figure out why this gap was there for me. I did figure it out. I think during that presser he is looking at a smiling photo of Whitney. I think he points to her when he smiles/laughs briefly before crying. You can't see her photo during his time at the podium but I think that's what happened. I had to figure this out for myself because I am an excellent read of people and was very bothered by the still shots I was able to capture of the smile and the laugh. I didn't post them because I couldn't make the timeline work for it to be Clint.

I also am not on FB so I didn't see all the many consistent genuinely loving photos of them together. I saw the few that were posted ahead of time but none like the barrage of them that came after Holt was announced as the killer.

For me, the smile/laughing at the presser by Clint is solved in my mind now. He was looking at his wife and smiling the same way they do with each other in almost all of the photographs we have now seen.

I think he's a good guy.

BTW - I can't believe how much this case has sucked me in. I am behind on just about everything!

And I also must watch the third and final presidential debate tonight (6PM local). I am worried sick that we are about to go in a terrible direction. I'm mailing in my vote this week.

This lovely performance by Iris Dement gives me strength that others care too. This incredible performance really moves me. It's especially powerful with headphones on. Iris was raised on the Gospel and rarely gets political so it is all the more special and rare.

[video=youtube;hhgb9hYjX3g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhgb9hYjX3g[/video]

Sorry for the brief off topic - life is moving so fast.

I really enjoy learning from all of you here on this board. And I really hope that justice is served in this case in the end, for Whitney.

-

 

[StreetcarRider]

Hi Pixel...you're thinking of Alpha High School maybe? That's on NE 8th in downtown Gresham...near the county offices and DHS.

Springwater Trail does appear to be an alternative high school:

http://schooldesigns.com/Project-Details.aspx?Project_ID=1650

 

[yankeeballer123]

Too true.....

Some people just handle grief in different ways. I don't think anyone can really begin to know what he's going through. Maybe talking about her to people makes him feel better. Maybe he's the type of person who keeps his emotions private.

 

[yankeeballer123]

"Sources told KGW reporter Kyle Iboshi Holt was "obsessed" with Heichel, and that there was a sexual component to her murder."

http://www.kgw.com/news/Clues-lead-...-in-murder-of-Whitney-Heichel--175092931.html

 

[Knox]

KATU.com ‏@KATUNews @foxone1 We aren't streaming it live, but we'll have the latest on KATU News at 4.

 

[ingra1327]

http://www.kgw.com/news/Clues-lead-...-in-murder-of-Whitney-Heichel--175092931.html

Sources told KGW reporter Kyle Iboshi Holt was "obsessed" with Heichel, and that there was a sexual component to her murder. Holt was scheduled to appear in Clackamas County Jail Monday afternoon.

RT @KyleIboshi: Jonathan Holt facing 7 counts Ag. Murder. Wearing suicide smock. http://bit.ly/WEuhnZ

 

[Ashfox]

Granting interviews about his heartbreak seems off to me, somehow. If they are 'unspeakably devastated' (and her family does seem to be), then media interviews seem like the last thing a devastated husband would be interested in right now. Maybe later...but doing these interviews today seems almost like 'good PR' in light of the fact of Holt's arraignment today...

It seems normal to me I dont see them having a large public memorial for WH so perhaps this is his way of sharing with the non (i dont use the term church since JW dont consider it a church) but Ill use it in this reference non church community his thanks for what everyone has done and what Whitney meant to him? Regardless of whether people want to admit it or not being a JW comes with IMO extra scrutiny whether you like it or not just due to all the miss information that people say about you and all the confusion involved. Even though I no longer attend I would have people to this day say oooo you used to be amish... I will still have to clarify many things for the rest of life lol but i do think that with all the media attention associated with this case and the fact again IMO there probably wont be a public memory this is his way to say thank you to those no JWs

 

[tiredblondy]

with WH being sexually violated in some way by him that says more than any anything to me I think he probably made some sort of advance towards her in the past and she rebuffed it he held it in until it came to a boiling point I dont want to speculate on anything but I do think he thought about it for a very long time maybe he decided he couldnt get Whitney to love him so he got married to someone else who showed interest in him but actually held a torch for WH and then when Whitney met someone got married and was totally in love ready to start her own family it was to much for him perhaps he stopped going to meetings because he didnt like to see how happy they were together and then he just went crazy I dont think he had to have any priors for that to be the case but its so ODD that of all places he lived in the same complex Id be curious to know when he moved his family into the same place.

I want to be very careful how I say this but sometimes a guy can perceive things that just aren't there from someone simply being friendly.

When I was younger there was a guy in my class that was weird like that. It got to be I would not even look at him because he took it to mean I was "after" him. They just don't think like others do. It was very scary and I was just a very friendly person.

After my Dad's funeral, 45 yrs later, he appeared again and tried to visit me again, one night at 2:30 am. It was and still is very scary.

Oh he's married too but has a fixation with me even with me being an old lady. These guys just don't have the normal perceptions others do and build up fantasy's in their mind.

 

[Knox]

Holt was arraigned in Clackamas County Jail Monday afternoon. He appeared in a suicide smock, and was arraighed on seven counts of aggravated murder. Holt was ordered held without bail.

http://www.kgw.com/news/Clues-lead-...-in-murder-of-Whitney-Heichel--175092931.html

 

[Bravo]

Clint is a Victim. He could not speak in the early days. Perhaps he feels the need to now. I think his faith is likely sustaining him right now. I never question a proper timeline of Grief. Everyone deals differently. Thankfully i have never walked his walk.

 

[msthinksalot]

http://www.clackamas.us/safetyapp/inmates/inmate.jsp?in=2012031099

His charges have changed.... it looks like they are updating it now... 7 charges of aggravated murder with firearm.

He was arraigned on 7 counts of aggravated murder.

http://www.kgw.com/home/Clues-lead-...-in-murder-of-Whitney-Heichel--175092931.html

They're holding him w/out bail. Per KATU and LE sources, it looks like the agg. murder charges are at least partially based on sexual assault, robbery and kidnapping.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/Repo...d-from-multiple-gunshot-wounds-175262191.html

 

[Suzvw]

Hi....I'm sure there must be, but I pasted these from the Katu site where someone else had posted these.

 

[tiredblondy]

I saw the GMA interview with Clint. It looked like they caught him outside his apartment or somewhere. It was not a formal sit down interview, just kinda like a reporter stopped him on his way somewhere.

It was so sad when he said " She was just a beautiful little person". Something like that. I know in several of the pictures of them together he's looking down at her while holding her. Just so sweet.

 

[gngr~snap]

http://www.clackamas.us/safetyapp/inmates/inmate.jsp?in=2012031099

His charges have changed.... it looks like they are updating it now.

He was arraigned on 7 counts of aggravated murder.

http://www.kgw.com/home/Clues-lead-...-in-murder-of-Whitney-Heichel--175092931.html

They're holding him w/out bail. Per KATU and LE sources, it looks like the agg. murder charges are at least partially based on sexual assault, robbery and kidnapping.

:what: 7...

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

with WH being sexually violated in some way by him that says more than any anything to me I think he probably made some sort of advance towards her in the past and she rebuffed it he held it in until it came to a boiling point I dont want to speculate on anything but I do think he thought about it for a very long time maybe he decided he couldnt get Whitney to love him so he got married to someone else who showed interest in him but actually held a torch for WH and then when Whitney met someone got married and was totally in love ready to start her own family it was to much for him perhaps he stopped going to meetings because he didnt like to see how happy they were together and then he just went crazy I dont think he had to have any priors for that to be the case but its so ODD that of all places he lived in the same complex Id be curious to know when he moved his family into the same place.

Here's the facts timetable from what I've tried to piece together:

•Whitney and Clint met at the JW hall or church (news article) at some point

•Holts married "sometime in 2010" -- their wedding pix online 2-10-2012 (screenshot)

•Heichels married 1 yr. 9 mos. ago (according to Clint) - January 2011 (katu.com)

•Holts moved into apt complex in 2012, 5-6 months ago (news)

•Holts then attended same JW hall/church, sporadically (which JW church is decided by geographic residence)

 

[Suzvw]

No it isn't. It's just a newer school in our area.

 

[Peliman]

http://www.clackamas.us/safetyapp/inmates/inmate.jsp?in=2012031099

His charges have changed.... it looks like they are updating it now.

He was arraigned on 7 counts of aggravated murder.

http://www.kgw.com/home/Clues-lead-...-in-murder-of-Whitney-Heichel--175092931.html

They're holding him w/out bail. Per KATU and LE sources, it looks like the agg. murder charges are at least partially based on sexual assault, robbery and kidnapping.

Not sure what the charging data mean or if they're being combined.

http://www.clackamas.us/safetyapp/inmates/inmate.jsp?in=2012031099

 

[Bravo]

:what: 7...

Oh gawd :what:

 

[ingra1327]

RT @MikeBennerKGW: Holt appeared in court. Answered "yes" to the judge 3x, wiped tear away from his eye.http://bit.ly/WEuhnZ

Ken Boddie ‏@kenboddie
Whitney Heichel may have been sexually assaulted before she was murdered. Jonathan Holt arraigned on aggravated murder to conceal sodomy.

FOX 12 Oregon KPTV ‏@fox12oregon
#breaking Court papers accuse Jonathan Holt of robbery, sodomy, kidnapping in death of Whitney Heichel; bkgd: http://kptv.tv/PMo9YR

 

[yankeeballer123]

Oh gawd :what:

How is it possible to be charged with seven counts of agg. murder against one person? Some one tried to explain it to me that it let the prosecution present a few different ways he did it and for the jury to be able to choose. Even with that, I don't think there are 7 things under the statute that he violated.