P.I. Says He Videotaped Area Where Caylee Was Later Found

[SeriouslySearching]

This is beginning to look like a Keystone Cops presentation = the investigation. As far as that goes their investigation should have been over along time ago -- they charged Casey Anthony way too soon because they were angry. Now they are stuck with it and have to build the case around it whether or not. As the ME HAD to say homicide because the police already had!!! Maybe some real proof connecting Casey Anthony is yet to come. Never know it seems.

What a mess.

The Grand Jury indicted Casey not OCSO with evidence and testimony which clearly 12 plus people said provided enough to bring the charges. This had nothing to do with anyone being "angry" and your reference to "Keystone Cops", imo, is way out of line. They have done an outstanding job in this case to track down the truth and evidence to present to the Grand Jury. The ME only reported her scientific findings which she can back up and in no way is associated with what LE already had other than it adds more weight to her decision.

You bet there is some real proof coming to connect Casey to the murder, the removal, and the dumping of Caylee. This will come out at trial and there will be no reasonable doubt left. The triangle will be complete and the puzzle down to the last piece will be in place.

 

[Reannan]

It's one thing not to have a very good plan. It is entirely another thing to have no plan at all, which is what driving around with a body in your car for up to 11 days would certainly be persuasive of.

I just can't get my mind around driving around with a decomposing body in your car for ELEVEN days! In Florida - in June?? No Way! Someone parked next to her would have called the cops because of the smell! I think KC had been planning on getting rid of Caylee, and possibly her parents as well. I think she murdered little Caylee in a fit of rage, and then she stupidly realized she had not thought thru what to do with the body. I believe at this point, she KNEW decomposition was going to start, and therefore, I believe she put the body on ice - somewhere. It would be interesting to see if she had a lot of 7-Eleven receipts (or whatever the local stop-and-rob gas station is called) where she kept filling up a cooler. At some point she took the body off of the ice and in the hot Florida heat, it rapidly begin to thaw in the trunk of the car, with subsequent oozing of fluids (gross). I bet she even placed the cooler in the back yard, thus, the cadaver dog hit on the back yard. KC then freaked and had only one option - driving to the nearest "dump" site she knew of, parking on the side of the road, and tossing the body as quickly as possible to the thickest brush she could find without having to venture 'into' the woods. What a disgusting string of thought, and what an even more disgusting set of actions.

 

[Pattymarie]

If prosecutors were to present two storylines, that would say to the jury that we really don't know what happened beyond a reasonable doubt.

In their closing argument, any halfway competent defense attorney would have a field day with a two storyline (we're not sure what transpired) approach. They would be doing figurative handstands. Moreover, it would be the talk of the crimetainment media, and the D.A. would have their phone ringing off the hook with demands to remove the prosecutors.

I have said this before....if Casey gets off due to legal mumbo-jumbo...that we as a society have permitted, then we as a society, deserve to have her walk amongst us.

 

[TxRose]

The Grand Jury indicted Casey not OCSO with evidence and testimony which clearly 12 plus people said provided enough to bring the charges. This had nothing to do with anyone being "angry" and your reference to "Keystone Cops", imo, is way out of line. They have done an outstanding job in this case to track down the truth and evidence to present to the Grand Jury. The ME only reported her scientific findings which she can back up and in no way is associated with what LE already had other than it adds more weight to her decision.

You bet there is some real proof coming to connect Casey to the murder, the removal, and the dumping of Caylee. This will come out at trial and there will be no reasonable doubt left. The triangle will be complete and the puzzle down to the last piece will be in place.

Imagine if they had not charged her so soon and she was still out free. Do you think we would have ever found that poor little girl's body? Doubtful. And any coorborating evidence would be gone for good. I for one thought they had plenty of circumstantial...and forensic evidence to charge her when they did. She has not been found guilty...she was charged. The jury will decide if the evidence is enough or not to find her guilty.

 

[impatientredhead]

It's one thing not to have a very good plan. It is entirely another thing to have no plan at all, which is what driving around with a body in your car for up to 11 days would certainly be persuasive of.

Haven't you been saying over and over again that her behavior after the fact has no bearing on premeditation? And besides, wrapping her in plastic and putting her in the trunk was the plan, bad plan, but a plan nonetheless. No plan would equal leaving her lay wherever she died.

First degree murder in the state of Fl includes the death of a child during aggravated child abuse. IF it turns out to be true that duct tape was wrapped around her head, that is aggravated child abuse all day.

 

[Diamond]

The location and placement (on top of the ground) of Caylee's body does not support premeditation. Moreover, the defense is likely to argue that the placement and location invited LE to find her body.

There are plenty of premeditated murders where the body isn't even moved, let alone buried well.

 

[Crafti]

Attorneys ask their clients to tell them what happened.

So, with all things considered and his concern about the PI, it is pretty likely that she did tell Baez. (wonder how long ago!) If he thinks the PI may have heard privileged information and the PI was working for the A's, then they probably knew for a while as well.

How or could any of this be proved and who could face what charges. :crazy: I assume Baez would be protected due to privilege?

 

[Wudge]

I have said this before....if Casey gets off due to legal mumbo-jumbo...that we as a society have permitted, then we as a society, deserve to have her walk amongst us.

Based on clear and unyielding evidence that we know of -- which is very little -- the evidence is sufficient to convict Casey on what charge (planned and deliberated murder or aggravated manslaughter?

 

[Boston]

snipped

One could have a premeditated plan that goes awry .If KC had a plan for disposal and was interrupted,or came close to being caught she may have dumped her quickly.Perhaps she planned to dump the body out by the airport,but people were closeby and she was afraid of being seen.Maybe she didn't realise how quickly the body would decompose and had to come up with another plan,All complete supposition.We just don't know,but the way the body was dumped does not rule out premeditation Imo.

Also,I would not be surprised if the PI always worked for the A's,but because he was present during conversations with JB he's claiming privilage.Again jmo

I think this is exactly what happened.

George either noticed the smell or saw the body on June 24th when he retrieved the gas cans out of the trunk & KC got nervous & dumped the body there because she thought George was going to call LE on her.

I think KC had planned on going back to move the body but her car was Towed on the 30th.

 

[MissJames]

Here is a definition of premeditated murder:

"Premeditated murder is the crime of wrongfully causing the death of another human being (also known as murder) after rationally considering the timing or method of doing so, in order to either increase the likelihood of success, or to evade detection or apprehension.[1] State laws in the United States vary as to definitions of "premeditation." In some states, premeditation may be construed as taking place mere seconds before the murder."

I don't know the definition under Florida law...but it is my belief that it requires only forethought on killing someone...not on how you will cover up the crime. So if you get mad at someone, grab your gun and drive over to their house and shoot them...is that not premeditated? Just because you left them there on the floor and the body was easily discovered (i.e. you had not planed for disposal of the body) - does not mean it wasn't premeditated.

I will agree with Wudge that I think the defense will argue the premeditation aspect.

To argue no premeditation the defense would have to acknowledge KC was responsible for the death in some fashion.Do you think they will?

 

[Chezhire]

If one or more of the Anthonys were the PI's client, they could claim work product privilege. Clients hold the privilege.

Incorrect. Attorneys may claim work product. I do it all the time. (forgot to mention: whether or not the Anthonys are the PIs clients is irrelevant, as neither the Anthonys nor the PI are attorneys, ergo the work product privilege, which only applies to the work product that a court deems to be an attorney's work, is inapplicable.)

 

[impatientredhead]

There are plenty of premeditated murders where the body isn't even moved, let alone buried well.

And I have yet to hear them claim they are going to prove premeditation. They indicted her for aggravated child abuse, that is not a coincidence when it ties into a first degree murder charge (death during commission of aggravated child abuse).

 

[Paladine]

So you're saying that just dumping her around the corner on the side of the road shows less guilt/premeditation than trying harder to hide the body?

I know you weren't asking me, BUT...I think the disposal merely shows her callousness and total lack of respect for Caylee. She didn't care enough to plan a better disposal, Tony was waiting...


imo

 

[SuziQ]

This is beginning to look like a Keystone Cops presentation = the investigation. As far as that goes their investigation should have been over along time ago -- they charged Casey Anthony way too soon because they were angry. Now they are stuck with it and have to build the case around it whether or not. As the ME HAD to say homicide because the police already had!!! Maybe some real proof connecting Casey Anthony is yet to come. Never know it seems.

What a mess.

LE doesn't charge anyone. The SA's do. Casey was initially charged with child abuse because she lost Caylee. Lost Caylee to a non existent nanny. Also charged with OJ because she lied about what she did with Caylee. Charging Casey was not because of haste or anger, it was because of solid evidence. A grand jury brought down the murder charges.

 

[impatientredhead]

If one or more of the Anthonys were the PI's client, they could claim work product privilege. Clients hold the privilege.

There is no indication that George and Cindy hired this PI through their attorney. If he was hired as a direct contractor to them there is no privilege.

 

[Crafti]

Imagine if they had not charged her so soon and she was still out free. Do you think we would have ever found that poor little girl's body? Doubtful. And any coorborating evidence would be gone for good. I for one thought they had plenty of circumstantial...and forensic evidence to charge her when they did. She has not been found guilty...she was charged. The jury will decide if the evidence is enough or not to find her guilty.

I agree! I think enough evidence was destroyed by her parents when they didn't call the police as soon as they noticed the smell at the tow yard!

ps. Sorry about last night, but it was funny.

 

[Crafti]

I think this is exactly what happened.

George either noticed the smell or saw the body on June 24th when he retrieved the gas cans out of the trunk & KC got nervous & dumped the body there because she thought George was going to call LE on her.

I think KC had planned on going back to move the body but her car was Towed on the 30th.

I agree, I think that's when she disposed of the body so haphazardly. (sp?)

 

[Diamond]

And I have yet to hear them claim they are going to prove premeditation. They indicted her for aggravated child abuse, that is not a coincidence when it ties into a first degree murder charge (death during commission of aggravated child abuse).

Good point.

 

[SuziQ]

Good post.

People need to appreciate that prosecutors cannot layout a storyline to the jury that supports both murder one and aggravated manslaughter. Moreover, if they do not lay out a storyline in their opening statement, that will tell me that they are almost certainly but whistling into the wind.

IIRC, murder one in Florida and in this case applies because of alleged child abuse/neglect charge that Casey was indicted for. If your kid dies because of abuse/neglect at your hand or abuse/neglect you allow, it's considered premeditated.

 

[TxRose]

I agree! I think enough evidence was destroyed by her parents when they didn't call the police as soon as they noticed the smell at the tow yard!

ps. Sorry about last night, but it was funny.

I don't even remember what happened last night...so no problem! LOL. :blowkiss: